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I don't have numbers to back this up right now, but thinking out loud, isn't Germany in a different economic cycle than the US? They had a pretty massive slump post-WWII in which Germany suffered while the rest of the western world enjoyed economic prosperity. Isn't it possible that Germany's success right now is less of a case of its labor policies and more of a case of simple timing? There is obviously a cyclical nature in terms of economic growth, and looking only at a current snapshot in time is dishonest. Yes, Germany is currently doing well, but isn't there a very real possibility that its success has a lot to do with investment made in the post-WWII slump and much less to do with any practical, repeatable economic policy?
Again, I am just 'thinking out loud', as I don't have time to research the numbers. What do the rest of you think about this?
I've been to Germany many times. There is absolutely no comparison. The average citizen, the poorest minimum wage worker speaks at least 3 languages and has a better work ethic than most Americans.
Their "ghettos" look like our middle class neighborhoods. The people have pride and self worth. They are very well educated.
There is no comparison. Those Germans would build those cars for half the wage if they had to and they would put just as much quality into them. Guaranteed.
And ironically, people criticize European countries like Germany for being liberal failures.
They don't fare too well in J D Power dependability ratings, BMWs especially.
BTW, beemers are bikes, bimmers are the cages.
Eh, according to Car and Driver, since 1983 BMW is the 3rd best manufacturer in the world after Honda and Toyota. And this year, the BMW 5 series won awards with JD power.
As for your other comment, I'm well aware of Bimmer vs. Beemer, in fact my post originally said Bimmer, however, hardly anyone except extremely stuffy BMW enthusiasts refer to it as Bimmer (and even spelled that way, is pronounced Beemer, coming from the German Bey Emm Veh).
In most of the world, people call the car a Beemer.
I've been to Germany many times. There is absolutely no comparison. The average citizen, the poorest minimum wage worker speaks at least 3 languages and has a better work ethic than most Americans.
This is NOT true. The average citizen or the poorest minimum wage worker generally speaks two languages: High German and their local dialect. Even higher up the hierarchy, many Germans can only muster very basic English unless there is a reason that they practice it (or any other language) regularly.
Sure, everyone learns English in school, but most forget the language as soon as they leave school. Only those students who attend Gymnasium-level classes are required to take another language besides English (French has long been a favorite). Again, though, as soon as they leave school, they tend to forget the language.
Furthermore, there is a strong bias based on age: Older Germans do NOT speak any language other than German. Among the younger generation, English will be much more readily available, even more so with increased anglicization.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PullMyFinger
Their "ghettos" look like our middle class neighborhoods. The people have pride and self worth. They are very well educated.
This is also not quite accurate. "Ghettos" can be encountered in many large cities, such as Berlin, Hamburg, Cologne. etc. Many of those "Ghettos" are certainly nothing like a middle class neighborhood in the US. There are quite a few of them that police like to "skip" because they are too afraid to encounter violence directed against them. On your next visit, take a look at Marzahn in Berlin and I am sure you will quickly re-evaluate your assessment. Be aware, though, that Marzahn does not take well to foreigners! If you are not in that particular area, try Cologne's Chorweiler neighborhood - it's also truly awful.
Wow , you drive a vehicle made in a non union shop in a right to work state? I know a lot of people on the left do , but with a name like yours I didnt expect you would too.
I have two foreign's, and two domestics. I also have a 2007 Honda Odyssey Van. I wanted to buy a domestic van, but none appealed to my wife.
I bought a new Cavalier back in '04 to use for running around town that i still have, and i bought my son a new Cobalt a few years ago.
I've also had plenty of Mustangs, a Mercury, and an Escort. I don't discriminate. I usually like to buy a German car every so many years when i get tired or bored of driving a muscle car. I'll be in the market later this year or early next year for another muscle car and i'll probably get rid of the Bimmer.
But i always make sure that i keep a domestic brand at this address. That's important to me.
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiyero
Eh, according to Car and Driver, since 1983 BMW is the 3rd best manufacturer in the world after Honda and Toyota. And this year, the BMW 5 series won awards with JD power.
In J D Power's overall dependability ratings of 2011 vehicles BMW ranked below Buick, Cadillac, Lincoln, and even Jaguar among others. C & D's "since 1983" isn't all that meaningful, just about every car manufacturer had improved exponentially since then, or closed up shop.
In 2010, Germany produced more than 5.5 million automobiles; the U.S produced 2.7 million. At the same time, the average auto worker in Germany made $67.14 per hour in salary in benefits; the average one in the U.S. made $33.77 per hour. Here's the link to the article:
Do they pay tens of thousands of people NOT to work, like the US auto companies do? In Germany, do their auto manufactures pay more in retirement benefits and medical benefits then they do for labor cost to actually make autos?
My thoughts were also accompanied by a simple question: Why?
That's a good question. I had my checkbook ready when i test drove the Camaro, but i was REALLY disappointed in the styling and the feeling as if you're driving inside of a tunnel. GM continues to use these weird materials on their dashes, and the same old tired knobs and buttons that give it a cheap feel.
It looks great on the outside, but the inside just turned me off. I tested a convertible model (always my preference), and it was better when you let the top down. But in Arizona, you can only do that so often...usually in the evenings. It's too hot during the days.
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