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The reality is the unemployment rate for those with degrees is about 5%, high school grads about 10%, and those who did not graduate high school over 15%. Engineering is certainly a practical degree, but there are other fields that are practicle. But many of the liberal arts degrees are useless in corporate America, so unless one intends to teach, the Return on Investment is usually far better if one avoids liberal arts majors.
It is incumbent on the worker to keep up their skills in an increasingly technical economy.
Many who are not employed haven't done much to grow their skill set in their own field.
But you fail to realize that not everyone has the natural talents and aptitudes to design complex things like a bullet train, flying car, state-of-the-art smart phone etc. We don't even need hundreds of millions of geniuses. America was built on blood, sweat and tears; hard work and elbow grease; not just good ideas and booksmarts, genius. Regular people need regular jobs. Not everyone can be a Rockafeller. And not everyone but 1-15% of the population should live in abject poverty. That would make America a third world country. America USED TO make things once upon a time not too long ago. However, millions of manufacturing jobs have been outsourced all while population has grown. There are less jobs in America than there were in the year 2000 despite the fact that the population has grown. Tens of thousands of factories have been shutdown stateside. Do you think the people who used to work those jobs just disappeared? Or did they all go back to school to become engineers? Seeing as only 2% of America are engineers, I don't think so. Although almost every single American owns a cellphone, not a single cellphone is manufactured here in the United States. Not a single pair of Nikes or an iphone is made here stateside, yet dozens of millions of Americans own these things.
See the problem here? A few short decades ago, much more goods were manufactured in the states. Cars that were made in Detroit are still running today and looking more beautiful than ever. They stand as a testament to the high quality of American manufacturing AND ingenuity. America has completely abandoned the former. America needs manufacturing to remain a rich nation. Producing ideas alone is not good enough for hundreds of millions of people who need to eat and make a decent living. Sadly, the city that used to lead the world in car manufacturing, Detroit, now tops the world's most dangerous cities list.
Umm, no. That's probably why they aren't paid a salary that is adjusted for inflation.
Is this one of those silly threads where someone asks "Why is it that....." followed by some weird statement that isn't true?
Your title does that, the question I quoted above does that. I didn't bother reading the rest.
What are you talking about? Most engineers make much more than average. Engineering is not hyped up for no damn reason. Do all engineers make a lot of money? No. But you can bet that most do. If you think 80-100K a year for a single income is barely scraping by, try working for $10 an hour (give or take a couple bucks) because poor people do it all across the states including the expensive metros and cities like DC, NYC, SF etc. Only someone with unnecessary lavish spending habits or a bad expensive addiction would not be able to live on 80-100K a year. Yeah, its hard to live on 80-100K a year if you have a bad coke habit, will only drive the newest Benz every year and want to go to Paris every other month. Let's get real. 80K a year is nearly double the median household income in America. You can live anywhere you want on such a salary for god's sake. Even Manhattan in NYC or Pacific Heights in SF. Also, if you make that much money, it is probably very easy to attract a partner who also brings in an income. So there is really no excuse of "boo-hoo, most working engineers don't make that much"; which is flat out false. Most people in America will never make 80K a year in their lifetime. But it just so happens that only a small minority of working people are engineers.
goldenchild, We have evolved past jobs whose only required prereq was four working limbs. Those jobs moved to an overall less educated nation.China.
We will need a substantial increase in general US education levels, and no it does not mean everyone must be able to design a rocket. But it does mean they need to be able to do things that are not simply repetitive manual exercises.
Could you give an example? A job that paid 30k in 1982 but now requires a 100k degree and still pays 30k?
Yeah, when I see people expressing themselves like this I too wonder about the quality of education in this country.
Where do you live? In the 50's? The cost of college tuition and fees has risen 400% from 1982 to 2007 while wages have remained flat during this time period. People with average paying professions are paying much more on their education than they were in the 70's, 80's, 90's and of course much earlier. The cost of a semester at Harvard only used to cost a few hundred bucks and could be paid off with a part-time job! Every new graduating class breaks a new student loan debt record. The salaries of new college grads have also dropped in the last decade along with recent grad employment dropping during this time frame.
The latest push in education is STEM.
Science, Technology, Engineering and Math.
And not for some, not based on skill, not geared towards those proficient or showing aptitude in these areas but FOR EVERYONE.
Everyone is a winner and everyone can become a rocket scientist.
Only many can't add, subtract or multiply. Mention long division and they tell you they never learned it.
You cannot MAKE someone into something they are not.
If you cannot multiply 5x5 at 14 years old, you are NOT going to go for a technical degree in college.
goldenchild, The median college debt right now is 24k upon graduation.most often payable over 25 years.with an overall median gross lifetime earnings differential of close to a million dollars. That seems like a good Return on Investment.
I know clowns who came out owing 125k, and some who came out owing 12k, and short of the Ivy Leagues and schools like MIT, the rest of them do not have huge variances in results of their grads. Often, the 35k/year school is peddling no better a product than the 8k state school. So short of Ivys, MIT, and the like.Why pay More?
Where do you live? In the 50's? The cost of college tuition and fees has risen 400% from 1982 to 2007 while wages have remained flat during this time period.
I wasn't questioning whether tuition has gone up, I was questioning your assertion that a job that paid 30k in 1982 still pays 30k today, and requires a 100k college degree. I find that claim ridiculous, and I suspect you do too since instead of giving an example to support your claim you've gone off with a wall of links about tuition costs.
Let's review, you said:
A job that paid 30K a year 30 years ago probably still pays 30K a year today although that same job now requires a $100K+ bachelor's degree
Please support this claim, noting that I didn't directly address only tuition costs. Which job? Thanks.
No way are we going to keep a large middle class with high tech engineering jobs. Anyone believing that is a fool.
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America USED TO make things once upon a time not too long ago. However, millions of manufacturing jobs have been outsourced all while population has grown. There are less jobs in America than there were in the year 2000 despite the fact that the population has grown. Tens of thousands of factories have been shutdown stateside. Do you think the people who used to work those jobs just disappeared? Or did they all go back to school to become engineers? Seeing as only 2% of America are engineers, I don't think so. Although almost every single American owns a cellphone, not a single cellphone is manufactured here in the United States. Not a single pair of Nikes or an iphone is made here stateside, yet dozens of millions of Americans own these things. 
