Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
You really believed that British Kings who justified their reign by being appointed by God would allow anything contradicting Christianity in their laws.
British kings were originally pagans.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rebel12
How about the fact the highest points of British law, namely Magna Carta and habeas corpus (which we copied almost verbatim) were instituted in Christianity?
Habeus corpus is not derived from the Bible, it's common law that predates the Norman Conquest.
The first part of the Magna Carta concerns the position of the Catholic Church in England. That part is not a foundation for anything American. It was written during a time of conflict between Britain and the Catholic Church.
The subsequent parts that we view as being the seminal renumeration of rights is not sourced in the church or the Bible. The Bible does not correlate or call for 90% of what we consider our fundamental rights and freedoms. IN FACT, just the opposite.
Not all of them, of course. British Kings were and still are Christian monarchs. Queen of England is also the head of the Church of England.
No separation of state and church in the UK.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7
Habeus corpus is not derived from the Bible, it's common law that predates the Norman Conquest.
The first part of the Magna Carta concerns the position of the Catholic Church in England. That part is not a foundation for anything American. It was written during a time of conflict between Britain and the Catholic Church.
The subsequent parts that we view as being the seminal renumeration of rights is not sourced in the church or the Bible. The Bible does not correlate or call for 90% of what we consider our fundamental rights and freedoms. IN FACT, just the opposite.
Who said anything about Magna Carta being derived from the Bible????
I said it is based on Christianity, it's social teachings and morality.
Christianity is much more than the Bible. Everything has to be spelled out for you guys???
Christianity as opposed to other major religions defends the meek, the powerless. It talks about sharing and compassion. It talks about justice. That;s the secret behind success story of Christianity and its spread around the world.
I know this is all lost on you guys since you believe that we developed all of these concepts in the past 20 years but there were existing in European thought for centuries,
introduced by Christianity.
You really believed that British Kings who justified their reign by being appointed by God would allow anything contradicting Christianity in their laws.
So you support your argument that British law is founded on Christian princples...by appealing to obvious propaganda in support of monarchy?
First, you admit that Christianity is illogical, but that this is superior to logical analysis. Now this?
Who said Magna Carta was derived from the Bible????
I said it is based on Christianity and it's social teachings and morality.
Christianity is much more than the Bible.
Everything has to be spelled out for you guys???
What parts of the Magna Carta are based on EITHER the Bible, or "Christian teachings of morality?"
Then, extrapolating (since most people are more familiar with it): What parts of the Constitution and Bill of Rights jive with "Christian teachings?"
In fact, freedom of religion does not (there is no God but Jesus), freedom of speech does not (heresay, profane speech, using god's name in vain, etc. is all prohibited), jury trials, right to bear arms...... which are Christian principles? Beyond mushy preambles that attempt to assign said rights to a divine source without actually citing the relevant passages.
Not all of them, of course. British Kings were and still are Christian monarchs. Queen of England is also the head of the Church of England.
No separation of state and church in the UK.
No written constitution, either.
Oh - and British society is much more secular these days than the United States!
Quote:
Originally Posted by rebel12
Who said anything about Magna Carta being derived from the Bible????
I said it is based on Christianity, it's social teachings and morality.
Actually, no you didn't. You said this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by rebel12
How about the fact the highest points of British law, namely Magna Carta and habeas corpus (which we copied almost verbatim) were instituted in Christianity?
Our laws are based on British, Christian laws.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rebel12
Christianity is much more than the Bible. Everything has to be spelled out for you guys???
Actually, if it's not in the Bible, then its made up interpretation of the Bible --- teachings outside of the BIble are dogma. Catholocism is rife with it. Protestantism splintered into a thousand sects because of the various "teachings" and "beliefs" sourced outside of the Bible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rebel12
Christianity as opposed to other major religions defends the meek, the powerless. It talks about sharing and compassion. It talks about justice. That;s the secret behind success story of Christianity and its spread around the world.
None of that is the foundation or practice of the United States, and none of that typifies modern American christianity. At all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rebel12
I know this is all lost on you guys since you believe that we developed all of these concepts in the past 20 years but there were existing in European thought for centuries,
introduced by Christianity.
No. These ideas grew out of the Enlightenment. They are not sourced in the Churches.
The Englightenment - the age of REASON - is the Source of American ideals of justice, equality, etc.
What parts of the Magna Carta are based on EITHER the Bible, or "Christian teachings of morality?"
Then, extrapolating (since most people are more familiar with it): What parts of the Constitution and Bill of Rights jive with "Christian teachings?"
In fact, freedom of religion does not (there is no God but Jesus), freedom of speech does not (heresay, profane speech, using god's name in vain, etc. is all prohibited), jury trials, right to bear arms...... which are Christian principles? Beyond mushy preambles that attempt to assign said rights to a divine source without actually citing the relevant passages.
Principles of social justice. The concept of God himself who lived as a peasant and died not for the rich but for everybody. The concept of the meek destined to inherit the earth, concept of forgiveness and compassion and many many others that you probably never gathered from reading the Bible. Christianity is in essence religion for the opressed and unfortunate.
New Testament characters: a prostitute, peasants are chosen before the powerful. Jesus does not live amongts the privilegded but the poor and discriminated against by the Romans Jews.
Again if you learned about the Bible on PBS you probably missed all of that and probably would never realize how progressive these concepts were two thousands years ago and how they affected intellectual understanding of the world thereafter. You don't have to be a believer to see how the Bible revolutionized the world..
Anyway you look at it it was the Christians and not Muslims or Jews who created Magna Carta. It was the Christians with their ideas who created the United States of America and the reason for this is in that old book you find so funny but others have been finding inspiring for the last two thousand years.
In response to your - now expanded - post:
No written constitution, either.
Oh - and British society is much more secular these days than the United States!
Its hard to get it for an American that the Brits may not go to church but the Queen is still the head of the Church of England and all royal marriages and ceremonies take place in churches.
And for the Brits, the Queen personifies the state.
And yes no written consituttion yet much more tolerant and liberal than some secular countries with big and expansive constitutions like... Soviet Union.
The difference is nobody can change their color of skin and homosexuality is self declared.
Just want to touch on this point. A person can, many have, change the color of their skin.
I suggest you read the book titled black like me. Michael Jackson also changed his skin color. So, technically it is possible to change your skin color.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
