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1. Who's to say the Driver's License isn't a fake ID? I'm sure everyone on this board that went to college knows at least half a dozen people who had a fake driver's license. If in person voter-fraud was really such an issue - how does an ID help?
Here in PA they are almost impossible to fake, they have hologram on them and the newest ones the hologram is white/black instead of that rainbow color. You can only see this when you tilt it the right angle. There is actually more than what is depicted here because all the counties are listed when you tilt it in another direction. If you could make these you could sell them for hundreds if not thousands.
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2. Let's assume the agreed-upon forms of ID aren't an issue - perfectly fine to implement something like voter-ID law, but first, you must go through every registered voter in your state and ensure they receive or already have proper ID to be able to vote. Anyone who is not already registered, the registration process will have an accompanying form for them to obtain a FREE ID that fits the requirements.
Here in PA the law was passed in March, during the primary they requested ID but it wasn't required. There's been a tremendous amount of news coverage, there has been state run publicity campaign and they sent letters to every registered voter in the state that does not have a corresponding state issued ID. At this point in time you would have to live under a rock to not know what the law was.
Is there any group that goes back over the election votes after the fact to verify only living citizens have voted ?
Do local, state governments do any verification on election votes after the fact ?
What should be happening is a state should be actively comparing voter registration database to their records of death certificates. States could even join together and share information on death records. Then, it would be simple enough to identify who is recorded as deceased, and follow up to ensure that it is correct, and then remove them from voter registrations.
And i do believe election results are audited, though I don't know the extent of the audits.
And you can say that about any activity that requires an ID. So using your logic, we shouldn't have drivers licenses.
except you missed the rest of my post, apparantly. if voter fraud with in-person voting was the issue, then i can understand the push for voter-ID laws. but that's not where the fraud is happening. what part of this is flying right over your head? i never posted any logic of the sort you just described. i simply stated why IDs at the polls is not addressing the problem of voter fraud.
here's the entire post from me, instead of the one line you pulled:
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradykp
Personally, I would be ok with voter identification under a few things I think need to be addressed first:
1. Who's to say the Driver's License isn't a fake ID? I'm sure everyone on this board that went to college knows at least half a dozen people who had a fake driver's license. If in person voter-fraud was really such an issue - how does an ID help?
2. Let's assume the agreed-upon forms of ID aren't an issue - perfectly fine to implement something like voter-ID law, but first, you must go through every registered voter in your state and ensure they receive or already have proper ID to be able to vote. Anyone who is not already registered, the registration process will have an accompanying form for them to obtain a FREE ID that fits the requirements.
let's be honest - whether you support voter ID requirements or not (and polls do show around 70% of Americans do support the concept)...the recently implemented laws in many states are recently implemented for a very specific reason.
So here's my proposed solution:
On November 7th, 2012, every state in the nation draft a voter-ID law and pass it. Then, the states can start working through their registration rolls and validating everyone that is registered has the proper form of ID.
The funny thing is...virtually all voter fraud is in the form of absentee ballots or backroom ballot stuffing. And there should be pretty easy ways to prevent that - yet we don't take steps on that. I always wondered why....
Here in PA they are almost impossible to fake, they have hologram on them and the newest ones the hologram is white/black instead of that rainbow color. You can only see this when you tilt it the right angle. There is actually more than what is depicted here because all the counties are listed when you tilt it in another direction. If you could make these you could sell them for hundreds if not thousands.
Here in PA the law was passed in March, during the primary they requested ID but it wasn't required. There's been a tremendous amount of news coverage, there has been state run publicity campaign and they sent letters to every registered voter in the state that does not have a corresponding state issued ID. At this point in time you would have to live under a rock to not know what the law was.
i'm from PA, and went to college in PA, and I knew dozens of people in college with fake Pennsylvania driver's licenses. I also knew someone (not a friend, but knew the guy) who made them and sold them. they sold for $100 back when i was in college about a decade ago. definitely not for thousands.
In my opinion, March of an election year is too late. like i said - if the state can ensure that every registered voter has an ID, then by all means, go for it. sending letters and advertising on television is nice, but i'm saying i think the the burden is on the state to ensure that every registered voter has an ID.
should be simple enough...you start with the voter registration list and do a simple bump up to the photo ID and driver's license database. then, whomever falls out of that list is who you have to contact.
i just personally don't believe in something like this if it means a legitimate voter won't get a vote, when the problem it's addressing is essentially non existent (which the Commonwealth of PA admitted).
You'd have to live under a rock to now know why the law was passed....
what’s wrong with showing an ID to prove WHO you ARE, and WHERE you LIVE (RESIDENCY)...we are after all a REPRESENTIVE REPUBLIC..you vote for a REPRESENTITIVE of YOUR DISTRICT...prove you are who you say you are, and what DISCRICT you LIVE in…. you should show that you BELONG to that certain DISTRICT
whats wrong with asking people to PROVE who they are, ARE THEY A RESIDENT of that SPECIFIC DISTRICT, (for which they are trying to vote)
do you REALLY think people like Nancy Pelosi (of San FRan) would like it if some guys from Jersey came and voted against her in San Fran, just because they didn’t have to prove that they were from San Fran
I see NOTHING wrong with requiring everyone to have an photo ID...be PROUD of who you are and your residency...PROUDLY vote for YOUR representative...but let’s be truthful, and PROPERLY vote in the PROPER district
the PEOPLE WANT a national ID..to prevent the possible voter fraud,,to prevent id theft..
get with it man
for those that say fraud is a small percentage….you lose all creditability when you say small or non-existent percentage…….as soon as one person votes saying they are someone they are not...its voter fraud…………………as soon as someone votes in for a district they dont reside in...its voter fraud
with Identification theft happening every hour or every day………………..it is a big thing
sometimes elections come down to only a few votes...any and all voter fraud must be at least tried to be stopped..this is a step
we NEED a national id, and it to be required for all
in france..or switzerland..or norway...or italy..or germany..or belguim...all have national id/drivers license
but I think having a STANDARD that applied nation wide is a smart idea
we need an ID for almost everything we do
heck I need an id( Cac card) just to log on to the computer
I need an ID to get a library card
I need an Id to rent a car
I need an id to get my perscriptions
I need an Id to get a blockbuster card
I need an id (bc AND SS) to get my license
I need an id to get a JOB
I need an id to be a new patient at ANY doctors office
I need an id to fly
i need an id to buy tobacco or alchohol
it would be CHEAPER to have one national id (DL) than having 50 DIFFERENT ones
when you go to another country (like france) you get a FRENCH drivers licince...not a paris or 'state' license
we NEED a national Id
We have the right to know the person voting is who they say they are.
We identify people behind the wheel with drivers licenses.
Supposedly everyone has an SS#.
There should be no right IMO to commit fraud in the vote.
I also hear again this year the Democrats are doing what they can to block the military vote.
Driving is a privilege, where voting is a right.
No one has a right to commit fraud in voting. In fact, punishments for those that do are quite severe - which is why it's such a teeny tiny issue.
Blocking the military vote? I'm assuming you're referring to the issue that arose in Ohio that people have skewed the facts on. Democrats aren't blocking military votes...they are actually fighting for the early voting period to be extended to more than only ACTIVE DUTY, to also include veterans and non-military. So, instead of only Active Duty citizens getting early voting rights, Democrats are fighting for everyone to get them.
They aren't blocking the military vote.
Only one party is participating in voter suppression acts this election year.
a COLLEGE ID is a valid ID of WHOM your are...but NOT a valid id of RESIDENCY, but YOUR state CCP does show your RESIDENCY, and your photo
example...minnisota
Part 2. Classification as State Residents. Students who meet one or more of the following conditions on the date they apply for admission to a state college or university shall be classified as residents of Minnesota.
A. Students who resided in the state for at least one calendar year immediately prior to applying for admission, or dependent students who have a parent or legal guardian residing in Minnesota on the date the students apply.
B. Minnesota residents who can demonstrate that they were temporarily absent from the state without establishing residency elsewhere.
C. Persons who moved to the state for employment purposes and, before moving and before applying for admission to a public postsecondary institution, accepted a full-time job in the state, or students who are spouses or dependents of such persons.
Minnesota State Statutes 135A.031, subd. 2
Procedure 2.2.1 - State Residency
so unless you LIVED there for ONE year PRIOR to going to school, or moved there for EMPLOYMENT prior to attending school...you were NOT a resident in the eyes of the state
so OK, you are a NEW YORKER going to MN. for school...you have a MN college ID.....you are NOT a resident of MN...your VOTING DISTRICT is still in your county in NEW YORK....absentee vote
if you attended college in MN..but you were an AR resident until you OFFICIALLY MOVE..that is why MOST states require you to get a new license within 30-90 days of you moving there....MN REQUIRES you to bring in your other state license and take a written and vision test within 90 days of you MOVING to the state...NC is that way too......so an AR id (we will say license) was ILLEGAL if you WANT to identify yourself as a MN resident...to vote in the MN elections (even the national elections)...but MN doesnt qualify you (as a student) to be a resident....
as to what some have and dont have (individual states) we NEED a NATIONAL STANDARD...I believe there should not be state drivers licenses only a USA drivers/nondrivers id
What laws are "written against the 1st and 2nd amendments?"
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Originally Posted by Roadking2003
Still asking; What laws are "written against the 1st and 2nd amendments?"
First Amendment:
Education for Freedom Lesson 4 (These are Supreme Court cases, but these cases are usually in response to a lawsuit challenge of a local, state or federal law).
Second Amendment:
-Gun bans by DC, Chicago, etc.
-Requiring ID for concealed carry. Ironically, no one has mentioned this as a counter argument to Democrats' opposition to voter ID laws.
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