If you doen't want guns baned (FBI, weapon, government, state)
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in arizona it is already a crime punishable by ten years in prison if you sell a firearm to someone who is not legally allowed to own one. and while it isnt required, it is recommended that you head down to your local favorite firearms dealer and fill out the transfer of ownership paper work. it generally runs $15 and they run the background check for you.
Its illegal to sell a gun in AZ to someone if you know they can not have it. You are not required to do any kind of check on them and how could you anyway? If you are not a dealer you have no access to the NICS system. If you post a gun for sale on Armslist and someone calls you and says meet me at the local strip mall and says I will take it, here is the money and you give them the gun you are not required to do anything. You can for your ease of mind I guess ask if they can legally own the gun but if they are not legal to own the gun I don't think them lying to you about it is a real big issue.
I understand that we gun owners don't want a gun ban. But why is it so bad to go along with closing the no back ground check on private sales?
I don't think there are that many who want to ban guns, but there are a large, and growing, number of people who want to ban the objects of the fetish many have on mass killing weapons and accessories.
Private sales? Do you mean at a gun show? Newsflash- you have to fill out a FFL form to purchase a gun, even at a gun show.
Are you talking about "back alley" sales? Why can't a private citizen sell something he owns?
He can. What we are talking about is making it more like selling a car. When you sell a car, there is paperwork to be filled out, insurance, titling, and registration. With a gun, in addition there should be a background check through NCIC to make certain the buyer is not a felon, a fugitive from justice, a deadbeat dad, or a mental patient.
Are you going to tell us now that criminals will steal the cars they use so registration makes no sense for "honest" people...?
BTW - I can't speak for everywhere, but here in S.C. a "private seller" can rent a booth at a gun show and sell whatever he wants. They account for probably 30% of the booths rented, and the average "private seller" has 50-100 firearms on display for sale.
Asking for a DL or CCW is not required in most states. Only if you know the person buying your gun can not legally own it are you prohibited from selling it. And even if you did look at a DL just how does that say, this guy is out on parole or a felon or what ever? Only a back ground check would get that info. A CCW that is current would stop about 90 percent because its more likely that a holder is OK to own the gun. Nothing says he did not lose his right to a CCW and is a criminal who said he lost his CCW and did not turn it in. But that is much less likely than someone with just a DL which means nothing.
It is looking like the shooter William Spengler may have gotten his three guns illegally and may have done a ftf buy. He was a felon, was not allowed to buy or own a gun and had them illegally. We will know in the next few days. Even if not and he stole them I am sure criminals use the no back ground check ftf to buy guns, its just a no brainier. Do you really think that a criminal will not go to Armslist to find a seller who will sell with our so much as a whats your name? Not a snow balls chance in hell.
Good luck proving later you "made a reasonable effort" to keep it out of a criminals hands if you did nothing.
The DA will laugh their asses off and wet their pants at you.
He can. What we are talking about is making it more like selling a car. When you sell a car, there is paperwork to be filled out, insurance, titling, and registration. With a gun, in addition there should be a background check through NCIC to make certain the buyer is not a felon, a fugitive from justice, a deadbeat dad, or a mental patient.
Are you going to tell us now that criminals will steal the cars they use so registration makes no sense for "honest" people...?
BTW - I can't speak for everywhere, but here in S.C. a "private seller" can rent a booth at a gun show and sell whatever he wants. They account for probably 30% of the booths rented, and the average "private seller" has 50-100 firearms on display for sale.
50 to 100? Are you kidding me guy.
You're not selling a "few" for some cash, you're a dealer without a license.
Since when does the federal government have the authority to know about anything I buy or sell? The federal government does not require a background check on any other product, except firearms. What part of "inherent individual right" are you anti-gun fanatics unable to comprehend? We do not require federal background checks before being allowed to speak our minds, worship whom we please, or to peacefully assemble. Why would any sane individual allow federal background checks for ANY inherent individual right?
Asking for a DL or CCW is not required in most states. Only if you know the person buying your gun can not legally own it are you prohibited from selling it. And even if you did look at a DL just how does that say, this guy is out on parole or a felon or what ever? Only a back ground check would get that info. A CCW that is current would stop about 90 percent because its more likely that a holder is OK to own the gun. Nothing says he did not lose his right to a CCW and is a criminal who said he lost his CCW and did not turn it in. But that is much less likely than someone with just a DL which means nothing.
It is looking like the shooter William Spengler may have gotten his three guns illegally and may have done a ftf buy. He was a felon, was not allowed to buy or own a gun and had them illegally. We will know in the next few days. Even if not and he stole them I am sure criminals use the no back ground check ftf to buy guns, its just a no brainier. Do you really think that a criminal will not go to Armslist to find a seller who will sell with our so much as a whats your name? Not a snow balls chance in hell.
If you make a FTF sale you better get positive ID if you don't know the buyer personally. You better give him a copy of the Bill of Sale and you dam well better keep one your self.
If you see to a prohibited person and that gun is used in a crime YOU are going to get arrested and prove your innocence in a court of LAW.
There will be that little problem of the 4473 form with your name address gun, it's serial number and etc etc with all the ID for YOU on it and the cops will have if they want too.
Never heard of your William Spengler. But the guns he has will be tracked back to the 4473 and who ever has their name on that is going to have to chats with the nice police man who comes calling.
I am on Armslist...... most guys there will say they want ID and if not it's off to the FFL dealer.
Only a fool would sell for straight across cash and never get ID......
He can. What we are talking about is making it more like selling a car. When you sell a car, there is paperwork to be filled out, insurance, titling, and registration.
The only paperwork that is required for the seller is the title and bill of sale. Registration and insurance is solely the responsibility of the buyer.
How would your average person be able to do a reliable background check on someone?
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