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A couple days ago the IRS official who headed the tax-exempt orgs division was placed on paid administrative leave, in connection with the investigation into IRS targeting of groups based on ideology. Lois Lerner put on administrative leave by IRS
This means essentially that she will sit at home while collecting full pay and benefits. Modern government defines this as a form of punishment for government workers.
I work at a large private sector corp. that is very politically correct, but I've never heard of anyone going on such a thing as "administrative leave." Employees caught in wrongdoing are generally either fired on the spot, and walked out to the parking lot, or suspended without pay pending investigation. Usually after about 2 weeks they are either brought back, or terminated.
For gov't workers accused of wrongdoing, paid administrative leave now seems to be the law of the land. A few years ago in WA we had a state trooper accused of molesting numerous female motorists after pulling them over. He sat in jail for 17 months, all the while collecting his full trooper salary on "paid administrative leave." Eventually he was convicted, but continued to collect his trooper salary for several weeks after the conviction. We also had a school principle in the Seattle area who was charged with and convicted of rape, and was on "paid administrative leave" for a while even after being convicted. Congrats you taxpayers, you get the honor of working your fingers to the bone to provide succor for a rapist. Relax and enjoy!
Can any liberals out there explain and justify the concept of "administrative leave?" Do you think that private sector employers should be required to have the same policy, or do you agree with the current dual-class structure?
Can any liberals out there explain and justify the concept of "administrative leave?"
Easy. If there is clear, indisputable evidence of wrongdoing, then follow through with whatever termination procedures are in place. If that evidence does not exist (hence the need for their internal investigation) then paid administrative leave is appropriate.
Ridiculously simple concept.
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Do you think that private sector employers should be required to have the same policy
Yes.
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or do you agree with the current dual-class structure?
Well, the private sector is the one that has by and large abandoned unionization and numerous benefits and protections that go with it, so in a sense it's a "reap what you sow" type thing.
Ideally, however, we'd see a mass resurgence in unionization so the middle class can step up and take back their share of the pie that they've been surrendering since the middle of the 20th century.
First, I want to make this perfectly clear: I am NOT a liberal.
However, this person is only accused of wrongdoing. There has been no investigation and no proof it thus far. The idea of the leave is to keep the person from harming anyone and/or anything else. If the person is allowed back to work, no one knows what sort of damage they can do. Unless you are going to lock them up in a room with nothing but a blank wall to stare at all day long. Then you run into all sorts of other civil rights issues. Are they under some sort of "defacto arrest?"
Remember, the long standing law of this land is innocent until proven guilty. You can't just stop paying someone because they were accused of something. People are accused of things all the time and depending upon the complaint, is what leads admins to decide what to do.
Could you imagine the outrage by you and others, if this lady was allowed back to work? And she hit some "magic button" in a computer system, which crashed millions of IRS files? The first words out of your mouth would be, "Why was she at work?"
The government cannot take something from you, without due process of law. No due process has been given to her.
Its why you have the rubber rooms in NYC public schools full of teachers who show up everyday and do nothing. The get their full pay and benes but they cant put them in a classroom because they're rapists and you cant fire them because the hide behend their union tenure
Public employees can, like this woman, be accused of things purely for political advantage by the accuser. Paying them while investigating is only just in these circumstances. This is clearly a case where the accusations are politically motivated and, at this time, completely without evidence of any wrongdoing.
Easy. If there is clear, indisputable evidence of wrongdoing, then follow through with whatever termination procedures are in place. If that evidence does not exist (hence the need for their internal investigation) then paid administrative leave is appropriate.
Ridiculously simple concept.
Yes.
Well, the private sector is the one that has by and large abandoned unionization and numerous benefits and protections that go with it, so in a sense it's a "reap what you sow" type thing.
Ideally, however, we'd see a mass resurgence in unionization so the middle class can step up and take back their share of the pie that they've been surrendering since the middle of the 20th century.
The company I work for is heavily unionized. I am a union member. But we do not have paid "administrative leave." It's a public sector thing, not a union thing. I agree that it is "ridiculously simple:" it's called accountability.
Public employees can, like this woman, be accused of things purely for political advantage by the accuser. Paying them while investigating is only just in these circumstances.
I agree with you on this. It is unfair to monetarily punish them when guilt has not been established. However, at the same time you want to remove their possible negative influence on the organization. This is definitely true when they have employees under them, especially if you may need those employees to testify.
This is common in school systems when a teacher is accused of wrong doing.
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Originally Posted by Ponderosa
This is clearly a case where the accusations are politically motivated and, at this time, completely without evidence of any wrongdoing.
Not so sure I agree with you there. She said they targeted groups. If she didn't know this was happening, and I think she did by the way, then she should have. Being a supervisor means supervising.
I don't see how this is a liberal concept, it is merely common sense.
Accusations don't mean that a person has been found to be guilty or liable for an activity, so it is perfectly reasonable that some one is put on paid admin leave while there is an investigation. Firing for the mere whisper of something wrong would alienate a good employee, and can result in a wrongful termination lawsuit (not liberal or conservative either).
I don't see how this is a liberal concept, it is merely common sense.
Accusations don't mean that a person has been found to be guilty or liable for an activity, so it is perfectly reasonable that some one is put on paid admin leave while there is an investigation. Firing for the mere whisper of something wrong would alienate a good employee, and can result in a wrongful termination lawsuit (not liberal or conservative either).
If it's just a matter of a "mere whisper of something wrong" why take them off the job? If we placed workers on paid administrative leave over a whisper, the entire national workforce would be on paid leave. That doesn't seem like a good economic plan.
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