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I would have much preferred Medicare for all $100 per person per month, no deductible. But, the GOP and wall St. Democrats would never have allowed it. Hopefully now ACA will pave the way for Medicare for All, which I hope for
The numbers won't add up. Even socialized medicine countries are facing huge problems with increased health cost. I believe Germany recently had to raise their health taxes to 15.5% (8.5% for individual plus 7% for employer).
An average American making $30k a year would need to pay much more than $100/month with no deductible. Even to match the Germany 8% tax rate for individuals that means they would have to pay $240/month.
Than factor in close to half the population of the US do not contribute to the federal tax income tax system.
It's asking a lot to try to ask for $100/month per person.
The average US family of 4 premiums these days are about $800-1200 a month (this is the unsubsidized rate/self employed rate) with a $3000-6000 deductible. Which means the average cost per person is between $200-300 a month.
Well, the GOP warned us there would be armogeddon if it was passed.
The world, and the nation, is still here so I see the pretty well lied about that. Like death panels and the formation of Obama's brown shirt army of evil.
You do realize that it hasn't even been implemented and it's already raising healthcare costs for everyone, except the few who don't carry their own weight, right? And you think that's a good thing.
You're already have someone paying more. Who do you think pays when people with no insurance show up at the ER, or when the hospital works out a deal to lower or eliminate your bill? They don't eat the cost.
Under Obamacare, 30,000,000 are still expected to be uninsured, which is pretty much what is uninsured right now..
Who do you think will be paying those bills? Thats right, the same people who are now paying for the subsidies..
Under Obamacare, 30,000,000 are still expected to be uninsured, which is pretty much what is uninsured right now..
Who do you think will be paying those bills? Thats right, the same people who are now paying for the subsidies..
Tell me how its cheaper again?
Would you mind telling us why there is an uninsured gap in Obamacare? Hint: It's not Obamacare at fault
Quote:
Originally Posted by aneftp
The numbers won't add up. Even socialized medicine countries are facing huge problems with increased health cost. I believe Germany recently had to raise their health taxes to 15.5% (8.5% for individual plus 7% for employer).
An average American making $30k a year would need to pay much more than $100/month with no deductible. Even to match the Germany 8% tax rate for individuals that means they would have to pay $240/month.
Than factor in close to half the population of the US do not contribute to the federal tax income tax system.
It's asking a lot to try to ask for $100/month per person.
The average US family of 4 premiums these days are about $800-1200 a month (this is the unsubsidized rate/self employed rate) with a $3000-6000 deductible. Which means the average cost per person is between $200-300 a month.
The answer is tax Wall St. derivatives. There's over a quadrillion dollars in derivatives floating around, all you need to do is tax it. New York State already does it at less than one percent, they just refund the tax money back to the NYSE
So the states that had the worst health insurance freedom (and the highest costs), were also the quickest to adopt The UnaffordableHealthcareAct (aka Obamacare), and some people's rates declined? Sure, these were the most expensive states due to their inept govt.
So we need to Obamacare to bailout the stupid Fascist/Progressive states that ruined their health insurance environment?
Guess what, Obamacare doesn't work, even when you cherrypick data.
I would have much preferred Medicare for all $100 per person per month, no deductible. But, the GOP and wall St. Democrats would never have allowed it. Hopefully now ACA will pave the way for Medicare for All, which I hope for
How would you pay for all the services?
Since medicare pays substantially less than the cost of medical services, it would mean that any such implementation would result in EVERY medical institution going bankrupt.
So, if the system takes in only 100 per person per month... and it costs WAYH more than that, what rationing scheme would you use to determine who lives and who dies?
'The health law sets up a system of state-based online and telephone exchanges that will sell insurance from companies including UnitedHealth Group to people who don't have coverage at their jobs. The law makes government subsidies in the form of a tax credit available to discount monthly premiums for people with low- to moderate-incomes.
About 25 million people are expected to enroll in exchange plans by 2018, according to the Congressional Budget Office. Insurers are barred from denying coverage or raising premiums for people in poor health, or charging women more than men, common practices now. Under the law, they can charge their oldest customers a maximum of three times the price for their youngest ones, a narrower difference than in many states today.
Rand Corp. researchers, looking at 10 states, said in an Aug. 29 report that predictions of sharp increases in premiums were overstated. "Our analysis found no widespread trend toward sharply higher prices in the individual market," Christine Eibner, a Rand senior economist, said in a statement with the report.'
Rand analysis says this:
David Simas, a White House staffer, tweets (and the White House retweets) a link to an article and adds, “More good ACA [Obamacare] news. 21% savings on premiums for Ohioans who buy their own health insurance because of the ACA.”
Indeed, the article begins: “Ohioans who buy their own health insurance should see an average out-of-pocket savings on premiums of 21 percent because of taxpayer subsidies under the Affordable Care Act, according to a new study by the Rand Corp., a widely respected think tank.”
But the 21 percent is not a savings over current premium levels, but projected increased premiums:
Christine Eibner, a senior Rand economist and lead author of the study, told us in a telephone interview this afternoon that she considers this is a realistic way of comparing premiums. It compares premiums for coverage people will get on the exchange with coverage they have or would have had without Obamacare.
Based on that calculation, the average premium for individual policies in Ohio would rise by $900, or 22.65 percent...
The price hike would be offset for many Ohioans by the taxpayer subsidy.
So the 21 percent “savings” doesn’t actually even quite make up for the 22.65 percent increase in average premiums. And the savings are only for those getting subsidies. Those paying the full premium themselves will get hit with the full 22.65 percent increase.
It should be noted also that the raw comparison of premiums, before Rand adjusted for what it considered pertinent factors, was even higher:
Without factoring in subsidy offsets and the policies that people are likely to buy, premiums for individual policies in Ohio will average $5,312 in 2016, according to figures from Rand. That’s 34 percent higher than the average for individual premiums without Obamacare, Rand’s figures show. But that, too, is a high estimate that does not factor what kind of coverage people will actually buy on the exchange...
And this is the kind of article the Obama administration considers good news worth promoting.
Whos is Rand?
"who is RAND???RAND Corporation (Research ANd Development[2]) is a nonprofit global policy think tank first formed to offer research and analysis to the United States armed forces by Douglas Aircraft Company. It is currently financed by the U.S. government and private endowment,[3] corporations[4] including the healthcare industry, universities[5] and private individuals.[6] The organization has long since expanded to working with other governments, private foundations, international organizations
where do they get their money???? well numerous places....but this one stands out
Open Society InstituteThe network of Open Society Foundations (OSF), formerly the Open Society Institute (OSI) until 2011, is a grantmaking operation founded by George Soros, aimed to shape public policy to promote democratic governance, human rights, and economic, legal, and social reform. On a local level, OSF implements a range of initiatives to support the rule of law, education, public health, and independent media. At the same time, OSF works to build alliances across borders and continents on issues such as combating corruption and rights abuses.
One of the aims of the OSF is the development of civil society organizations (e.g., charities and community groups) to encourage participation in democracy and society.[1] The name is inspired by Karl Popper's 1945 book The Open Society and Its Enemies.[2]
Would you mind telling us why there is an uninsured gap in Obamacare? Hint: It's not Obamacare at fault
The answer is tax Wall St. derivatives. There's over a quadrillion dollars in derivatives floating around, all you need to do is tax it. New York State already does it at less than one percent, they just refund the tax money back to the NYSE
What do you do when you've stolen everything there is to steal (including fake money like 'derivatives'?
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