Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
That's like claiming that homeowners see Dran-O as the "answer to the problem of home maintenance"; and if Dran-O doesn't prove to be that, it has no purpose. Pretty illogical, that.
No, it is not even remotely a similar comparison. Certain states and school districts in the north have banned CP for hundreds of years, yet they're perfectly fine schools and many of the best in the country. Places like Texas, Arkansas, and Mississippi have some of the highest rates of CP use in the nation yet these same schools tend to be the poorest performing. Their has never been any evidence the CP improves schools. It is simply a way for teachers and faculty to vent their frustrations at their poor students. The fact that many of the students tend to receive it over and over again through the year also speaks to its ineffectiveness. If it was such a miracle worker the kid would get beat once and never want to come back. They may happen once and a while, but those students seem to be in the minority.
No. But schools should be allowed to kick out kids are constantly disruptive and disrespectful. While I believe in "public education" I don't believe being that mean putting up with everyone in the "public" regardless. Some kids/people aren't worth the time and effort it takes to keep them in, and I mean that in a fiscal way. The idea that a public school has to be all thing to all people is why are public schools aren't doing well.
Velvet, again, you are attributing views to pro-CP people that there is can't evidence they actually hold: that it's a miracle worker and the rest. It seems to me the burden of proof is on those who believe it's harmful, not on those who believe it's benign.
Cal, I am pretty sure there are still private schools in California that use the paddle.
No, it is not even remotely a similar comparison. Certain states and school districts in the north have banned CP for hundreds of years, yet they're perfectly fine schools and many of the best in the country. Places like Texas, Arkansas, and Mississippi have some of the highest rates of CP use in the nation yet these same schools tend to be the poorest performing. Their has never been any evidence the CP improves schools. It is simply a way for teachers and faculty to vent their frustrations at their poor students. The fact that many of the students tend to receive it over and over again through the year also speaks to its ineffectiveness. If it was such a miracle worker the kid would get beat once and never want to come back. They may happen once and a while, but those students seem to be in the minority.
I see little difference from a disruptive 17year old in school and an 18year old in the military. I do recall when CP was used on both as remedial action.
The issue is not with fine schools containing disciplined students in your example but in the unruly student body members who disregard rules and know they are untouchable because of the rules.
If a child is constantly disruptive and disrespectful that is a very good indication that the teacher should not be in their profession. Any adult who cannot teach discipline, without getting physical, has no business being a teacher. Or even owning a pet, for that matter.
You are discounting the fact that there are some kids, no matter who the adult is, will absolutely not follow any rule whatsoever and for whom disrespect and disruption is a way of life. In many cases they are encouraged by their parents as in "No one can tell my kid what to do but me.".
And, due to various Federal and State education laws, not much can be done until the student either ages out, drops out or commits some act of gross misconduct which gets him kicked out.
The above is not an advocacy for corporal punishment but real life.
They can physically defend themselves. No student has the right to hit a Teacher.
Teachers, of course, should not be allowed to assault students either.
If Teachers or students place their hands on an erogenous zone (butt, private areas, breasts) it should be reported and swift action taken.
Whether that be to file a CPS Report, or call the parent. OR depending upon the age, even the police.
Especially if the physical violence was intentionally done to cause physical pain.
But Teachers nowadays, in general, don't become physically violent with children. Not in my State.
They will loose their Teaching Credential over it. I feel for the Teachers.
Kids are getting worse and becoming more difficult to manage.
Everyone has the right to self-defense. If a student gets physical with a teacher, the teacher certainly has the right to defend themselves. Conversely, if a teacher gets physical with a student, the student certainly has the right to defend themselves.
The point being, one is never in the right when they get physical. It does not matter if it is the student or the teacher, it is still wrong.
Kids should not be hit.. if they mouth off , down to the principal. If they mouth off again at that teacher they should be thrown out of that class for good. Call the parents to let them know what the child did and why they will not be welcomed in that class again.
My father is a retired schoolteacher and retired Lt Col in the army. I guarantee you he did not need a paddle to maintain an orderly classroom.
Matter of fact, he was hired largely due to his ability to maintain order and much beloved by his students - who approach me to this day.
I went to elementary school in AL. Teachers there paddled for any stupid reason. Got a question wrong on the test? That's one lick. Late for class? That's two. Chewing gum? Three. Male teachers paddled female students as long as they had a 'witness'. Please.
That was the public school. So glad my son had such different opportunities.
You are discounting the fact that there are some kids, no matter who the adult is, will absolutely not follow any rule whatsoever and for whom disrespect and disruption is a way of life. In many cases they are encouraged by their parents as in "No one can tell my kid what to do but me.".
And, due to various Federal and State education laws, not much can be done until the student either ages out, drops out or commits some act of gross misconduct which gets him kicked out.
The above is not an advocacy for corporal punishment but real life.
I am discounting nothing. Even the most disruptive child can be disciplined. It just takes finding the technique that works. For example, use peer pressure. Every time the child acts inappropriately, punish the entire class instead of the disruptive child. Let the child's peers deal with the child's disruptive behavior. Another example, is by embarrassing them in front of their peers. It may be old fashioned, but there was a reason why wearing a "Dunce" cap while sitting in a corner of the classroom was used for so many years. The list of possible ways of instilling discipline is endless, and can be tailored to fit specific situations, and none of it needs to be physical.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
