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Bottom line, if the Republicans plan is to get more and more like Democrats to try and win votes...then LET THEM DIE. Good riddance I say. Let the Left have one party rule for a while, and more people will be inclined to revolt at some point. By all means. Let's have Obama v2.0 from 2017 to 2025, with veto/filibuster proof Dem majorities in the House and Senate. By all means. America does nothing for its own good until it feels pain, so I say turn up the socialist heat and let it start to burn nice and hot.
If my non-vote for the quasi-Dem Republicans means everyone gets to that pain faster, so much the better I say.
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Originally Posted by texan2yankee
The Millennial Generation that is now coming of age will have little choice but to embrace some level of libertarian thought given the enormous size of today’s government (federal, state and local combined). They will be stuck trying to pay the bill, a very large one, for all the liberal programs that started back in the 1930′s, accelerated in the 1960′s and went into hyper drive in the past decade.
The old joke that a Republican is a Democrat that has been mugged can be adjusted for today, a Libertarian is an idealist that has to pay the piper.
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Originally Posted by Volobjectitarian
Well, we already crossed the Rubicon with more people collecting than paying in, on the national scale. So a plurality is dependent on government and will likely always vote for more profitable dependency in the short term, with no regard whatsoever for the long term. All any politician, even my dream hypothetical libertarian folks, can do at this point is try to ride the wave and maybe slow the eventual collapse a bit, because nothing can stop it now. Even all my libertarian idealism needs real plurality embrace, and there's too much short term comfort to be had, and all the long term discomfort is outta sight, outta mind.
I think when the millenials hit their 50s or thereabouts, the whole house of cards should be sufficeintly bloated to begin collapsing under its own weight, and maybe a few things change. I think it gets a ton worse before anything gets even marginally better.
Amen, so do you really think things will hold together for that long?
I personally find myself torn on the political side.
I cannot support many of the actions of the GOP power structure - those who've been running things for so long they no longer have an idea of how to be an "average American".
I support many of the things espoused by the Libertarians but realize they do not, as yet, have a sufficiently strong base in order to take control from the existing major parties.
I consider myself Independents but that too has no base big enough to play a role in the current rigged American electoral system. When I say "rigged" it's because I believe that's exactly the way things are right now. The political professionals have all the clout and the average voter has little or no say in what both parties do.
Here in Nevada, we have the new Congressional District in which a black liberal Democrat was elected. He does not, in any way, support my beliefs or desires. But, what is going to be my choice this coming November? So far, the GOP has not names anyone to run against him and I haven't even seen anyone of name recognition announce. Sadly, it looks like my only choice is to vote for someone I know has little chance of winning. I think that's what turns off most voters and causes them to not even bother to go to the polls.
I will go because there will be other things on the ballot I feel will be equally important - and will take the time to research the ballot to understand who and what is on it. Sadly, far too many will either be too busy or won't care. Those who WILL vote will be those whose party makes an effort to get them there.
Amen, so do you really think things will hold together for that long?
Well, part of me says heck no, but then part of me understands who and what our political ruling class is, and that they'll use the media, Wall St, the Federal Reserve, and their monopoly on lawmaking and coercive force to keep things running profitably for themselves and keeping everyone in America lulled into the same Brave New World lethargy we currently enjoy.
Panem et circenses can work for a good long while when you create the bread out of thin air as we do with money, you control the circus entirely as they do with the media and Wall St, and you can have your allegedly external, independent banking folks cook all the books and make all the balance sheets look prettier than the reality.
What I cannot predict is the external global forces that will pull back the curtain on The Wizard of DC and reveal all this to a public, or how much the public will care/understand once they do see behind it. I try to be fair, but it is hard to overestimate just how lazy and stupid the US populace really is.
So yeah, I think the millenials can get to 50, maybe 60 as a group prior to anything tangible happening that speaks of decline/unraveling.
Wow. the level of delusion that somehow with a 12 or 18% portion of a party....that they represent the right viewpoint, and hey guys! We're going to win!
Uhmm...no. Start looking at reality. You know who determines elections these days more then any other? Independents. Know who doesn't like extreme left/right/liberal/tea party/libertarian views? Independents.
We want a functional government that understands compromise. REAL compromise, not "my way or the highway compromise"
Hey, the motley crew that sat down and composed the Declaration of Independence, only had 5% support for give me liberty or give me death. 95% wanted the king to take care of them, or were afraid of the king and all the kinds men.
Compromising the Bill of Rights, is not an option, without an amendment brought to the vote.
Every law, regulation, or rule, is a direct attack on liberty. How many does this nation need?
It's important to remember that neither the GOP nor the Tea Party are Libertarian. The Tea Party had quite a few Libertarians in it at first, many of the Ron Paul crowd, but it was then coopted by the NeoCons and Religious Right who are the opposite of Libertarian.
Wow. the level of delusion that somehow with a 12 or 18% portion of a party....that they represent the right viewpoint, and hey guys! We're going to win!
Uhmm...no. Start looking at reality. You know who determines elections these days more then any other? Independents. Know who doesn't like extreme left/right/liberal/tea party/libertarian views? Independents.
We want a functional government that understands compromise. REAL compromise, not "my way or the highway compromise"
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Originally Posted by BentBow
Hey, the motley crew that sat down and composed the Declaration of Independence, only had 5% support for give me liberty or give me death. 95% wanted the king to take care of them, or were afraid of the king and all the kinds men.
Compromising the Bill of Rights, is not an option, without an amendment brought to the vote.
Every law, regulation, or rule, is a direct attack on liberty. How many does this nation need?
Good question, greywar, why dont you answer that....How many more laws, rules, regulations, and direct attacks on liberty does this nation need?
Every law is a attack? So laws about things like-fraud, pollution, poisoning, etc etc etc are bad? OMG its against the law to go 110MPH in a school zone! You're attacking my freedoms!
Thats just foolish.
Now do we need all the laws we have? Probably not, whats the right number? Whatever it takes to make our society work.
The challenge in the past has been Libertarians despised and alienated the "Christian Conservatives " in the party, they were too dogmatic and rigid, (all or nothing) therefore they have been getting nothing for years. I believe we are going to see a lot bigger coaliton of "Conservatives" Christian, Tea party , Libertarians, being led by Cruz, Rand Paul, Marco Rubio , etc....
Hey, the motley crew that sat down and composed the Declaration of Independence, only had 5% support for give me liberty or give me death. 95% wanted the king to take care of them, or were afraid of the king and all the kinds men.
Compromising the Bill of Rights, is not an option, without an amendment brought to the vote.
Every law, regulation, or rule, is a direct attack on liberty. How many does this nation need?
only 5% REALLY? the other 95% wanted the king to take care of them? You don't say! WOW, I never knew that.....probably because its a falsehood. But do go on, please, lets hear more! Let me say something!
Did you know that the phrase is not an actual quote, just a memory? that the speech its referring to was never actually written down? and that the majority voted for sending troops from virginia as a result? Of course you didnt. Because you've never researched it, and are just repeating something you heard, nothing related to reality.
Every law is a attack? So laws about things like-fraud, pollution, poisoning, etc etc etc are bad? OMG its against the law to go 110MPH in a school zone! You're attacking my freedoms!
So, you refuse to have an honest discussion.
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Thats just foolish.
Yes, everything you say is foolish.
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Now do we need all the laws we have? Probably not, whats the right number? Whatever it takes to make our society work.
Honestly... That takes about 6. 6 of the Ten Commandments are all we need. No other laws are required to have a sound, sensible, sane, and enduring society. And you need government to enforce only 3 of them. Theft, killing and false witness.
Everything else will take care of itself.
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