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We should have fought harder for plain equality back in the 1960s. Before integration, black people built their communities from scratch, and our businesses were supported by the people. There were black millionaires in the early 1900s, which back in those times would have been considered extremely wealthy. A million dollars back then might equal to 100 million or more today, and again there were black millionaires during those days. I'm sure everyone is familiar with Madam CJ Walker, who was born just two years after the Civil War. She was the first woman, not just black woman, to become a self made millionaire, selling hair products interestingly enough. So we had black people, towns, etc that were extremely successful even in the tough times of racism in this country. Imagine where we would be now had we simply fought for equality, and kept segregation for another couple of decades?
I believe integration would have happened on it's own, but a lot of black people wanted integration, even though white people didn't want that. What happened was once forced integration took effect, black people started going across town to shop at white shops. White people weren't doing the same thing, and thus black businesses lost their whole customer base. Communities began to fall apart, and business minded black folk left town knowing their community wouldn't support their businesses. So here we are today, and the black community is in shambles compared to what it once was.
Now, people look at this and I imagine most would call me crazy. They would think to themselves, 'Integration was a bad thing for the black community?' See people look at segregation and integration as 100% one way or the other, that these two words includes certain ideas that go with it. Segregation includes unequal, whereas integration includes equality. That's not the case at all, in fact these last 40 years have taught us that. On average, there are still more black people who are worst off within their total population, than there are white people within their total population. If things were truly equal, why are there those who still feel like black people need affirmative action? So no, integration doesn't automatically mean equality. The simple truth is wrongs were being done during segregation, but segregation itself wasn't necessarily bad thing for the black community. It wasn't killing our community to have an all black school etc. Most of Japan's population is ethnic Japanese, and I imagine a lot of their schools only comprise of Japanese students. Yet Japan is one of the most technologically advanced nations in the world. So they are doing alright even though they are mostly only one ethnic group.
In any case, integration kind of killed the black community because of what happened as a result of how it came about. It wasn't white people (majority) who were fighting for integration, it was black people. Black people got their wish, but it wasn't reciprocated very well. Black people went into white neighborhoods and businesses, and nobody came into black neighborhoods and businesses. Black kids went into white schools, and black schools were either shut down or left to crumble from the inside. We should have fought for equality, and let integration happen when both sides wanted it.
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Originally Posted by Heavenese
We should have fought harder for plain equality back in the 1960s. Before integration, black people built their communities from scratch, and our businesses were supported by the people. There were black millionaires in the early 1900s, which back in those times would have been considered extremely wealthy. A million dollars back then might equal to 100 million or more today, and again there were black millionaires during those days. I'm sure everyone is familiar with Madam CJ Walker, who was born just two years after the Civil War. She was the first woman, not just black woman, to become a self made millionaire, selling hair products interestingly enough. So we had black people, towns, etc that were extremely successful even in the tough times of racism in this country. Imagine where we would be now had we simply fought for equality, and kept segregation for another couple of decades?
HOW is it you define races having to use separate restrooms, eat at separate lunch counters, sit in different sections of the bus, drink at separate water fountains, etc., etc., etc. as 'equality'?
HOW is it you define races having to use separate restrooms, eat at separate lunch counters, sit in different sections of the bus, drink at separate water fountains, etc., etc., etc. as 'equality'?
Make all the restrooms, water fountains, etc of equal quality. We've seen all the photos. Everything white was of better quality than the hand me down stuff of black people. Yet besides all that, the main thing was having equal protection under the law. I think we could have handled the hand me down treatment, but the lynching and calling white people sir and maam was the crap that was truly uncalled for. We could build, and was building our own facilities. So if we got tired of the hand me down water fountains, we simply establish our own.
That's ok, they'll never be able to figure out what a fantastic screwing the first black president gave em.
Something springs to mind about what LBJ said about having black folks voting democrat for the next 300 years once they got welfare.
Meanwhile I work in construction management and I can assure every one of you if you are black you can forever forget about getting a construction job.
HOW is it you define races having to use separate restrooms, eat at separate lunch counters, sit in different sections of the bus, drink at separate water fountains, etc., etc., etc. as 'equality'?
The OP states that we would have gotten around to integration eventually. All those blacks should have just lived with the injustice until white American decided to get to it. As we've seen from the many posts on this board, quite a lot of Americans would have been quite satisfied if we never "got around to it." Which, I suspect, is what the OP really wishes had happened.
It's so easy to tell the oppressed to "be patient, we'll get to it eventually," when you are not the one living in oppression day in and day out.
Make all the restrooms, water fountains, etc of equal quality. We've seen all the photos. Everything white was of better quality than the hand me down stuff of black people. Yet besides all that, the main thing was having equal protection under the law. I think we could have handled the hand me down treatment, but the lynching and calling white people sir and maam was the crap that was truly uncalled for. We could build, and was building our own facilities. So if we got tired of the hand me down water fountains, we simply establish our own.
Real quality IS integration. NONE of is this "separate but equal" BS. Sheesh!
Word was in some place there were 3 water fountains for Blacks, anglo white and "Mexicans". That could get real sticky right there because a Mexican Mormon named Romney visiting the US had the use the "Mexican" fountain even tho he was def "white". OTOH: the white supremacist Leander Perez of 50 years ago, using the Mexican fountain would've raised a few eyebrows. lol
Integration means 1 water fountain for all compared to having 2 or 3.
The OP states that we would have gotten around to integration eventually. All those blacks should have just lived with the injustice until white American decided to get to it. As we've seen from the many posts on this board, quite a lot of Americans would have been quite satisfied if we never "got around to it." Which, I suspect, is what the OP really wishes had happened.
It's so easy to tell the oppressed to "be patient, we'll get to it eventually," when you are not the one living in oppression day in and day out.
You fall into the trap that segregation has certain things that go with it, and integration has certain things that it entails. That's not the case. I argue the fight for equality was great. The integration part was bad because it wasn't reciprocated. Nobody came back and shopped at black businesses. Nobody came into black neighborhoods. The Black community was left for dead due to integration. What segregation did was allowed black businesses to have customer base. It was a forced base, but businesses don't care about that. They simply need a customer base. Integration killed that for the black community. Why can't you and others see that?
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