ISIS leader: "If there was no American prison in Iraq, there would be no ISIS" (Palestinian, generation)
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I agree to the extent that sadam prevented this type of group from coming to power, but I don't think that if we never had a prison in Iraq all the isis fools would just go back to tending gardens.
No one ever said that they were tending gardens.
The point is that by imprisoning them when we really shouldn't have been in Iraq in the first place, gave them the idea to come together and form up something deadlier and more lethal than we could've imagined.
There never should've been any American run prisons in Iraq. That's the point.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iNviNciBL3
Who is "we" and why did you guys go into the middle east and make everything worse?
Americans PERIOD know nothing about the Middle East. Even our so called "experts" in the State Department know very little about the Arab world. We've never had more than a handful of diplomats that are fluent in the language and know how to carry themselves in the company of Arabs.
Robert Ames was a CIA Arabist who was fluent in the language, customs and lifestyle of the Arab world. One of the best spies we've ever had. He was killed in Beirut in the Embassy bombing. We've never had more than a tiny group of people with his skill and qualifications.
Read the book "The Good Spy" which is a story about his life. It becomes quite clear that we only THINK we have qualified people working in the Arab World when in fact, we have hardly anyone that knows much about the region.
Americans PERIOD know nothing about the Middle East. Even our so called "experts" in the State Department know very little about the Arab world. We've never had more than a handful of diplomats that are fluent in the language and know how to carry themselves in the company of Arabs.
So go start on learning everything about the middle east...
The point is that by imprisoning them when we really shouldn't have been in Iraq in the first place, gave them the idea to come together and form up something deadlier and more lethal than we could've imagined.
There never should've been any American run prisons in Iraq. That's the point.
Americans PERIOD know nothing about the Middle East. Even our so called "experts" in the State Department know very little about the Arab world. We've never had more than a handful of diplomats that are fluent in the language and know how to carry themselves in the company of Arabs.
Robert Ames was a CIA Arabist who was fluent in the language, customs and lifestyle of the Arab world. One of the best spies we've ever had. He was killed in Beirut in the Embassy bombing. We've never had more than a tiny group of people with his skill and qualifications.
Read the book "The Good Spy" which is a story about his life. It becomes quite clear that we only THINK we have qualified people working in the Arab World when in fact, we have hardly anyone that knows much about the region.
No, a lot of them do know about the Middle East. It is mostly the people at the top who don't. The President sets the rules and the State Department just executes whatever orders he gives. A lot of politicians honestly believe that Germany and Japan are normal cases and that all countries can be reformed the same way. They really do believe that the US has the most brilliant system and can reform any country in the world because Americans are so brilliant.
So go start on learning everything about the middle east...
Look, what's your point?
I'm not the one that believes that we should be forcing our will on the Arab World.
Quote:
Originally Posted by X14Freak
No, a lot of them do know about the Middle East. It is mostly the people at the top who don't. The President sets the rules and the State Department just executes whatever orders he gives. A lot of politicians honestly believe that Germany and Japan are normal cases and that all countries can be reformed the same way. They really do believe that the US has the most brilliant system and can reform any country in the world because Americans are so brilliant.
I misspoke actually when i said diplomats.
I mean in the Intelligence Services...and i'm absolutely right about that.
You can thank your big political greedy powers for what has become. Its all about Gold Oil Drugs and power. America created its own mess and now its backfiring, people dont like it , and we are claiming these people are animals and terrorists, meanwhile whose the real terrorists ?
We can talk all day about paleo this and neo that...but the fact of the matter is that TODAY, modern day conservatives (a.k.a. the Republican Party) has never seen a war that they didn't like. And even if liberals started this or that conflict, Republicans usually support those actions wholeheartedly and often supports them even when they've been shown to have nothing but a dead end ahead.
Republicans til this day defend our actions in Vietnam despite the fact that our goose was cooked the second we put boots on the ground there.
But that's here nor there; this is about ISIS, and we screwed the pooch big time.
You're right however about Buchanan's book. His two op-ed pieces in the book (one at the beginning and the other at the end) are breathtaking in their brilliance.
I was also shocked at how equanimous the tone of his book was given that he has a rep as an incendiary partisan.
Yet with dems in power we are still in the Middle East. Funny how many of the anti war critics complained about Bush are quiet when their chosen one is in office. The President controls troop movements. He can take us out of the Middle East at any time.
I've been saying for a while that we created ISIS....or shall i say that we SURELY created the conditions for it by yet again interfering in the internal affairs of a foreign nation thereby making a bad situation much worse.
This piece/interview in the Guardian by Martin Chulov features an interview with Abu Ahmed, who explains how they formed ISIS right under our noses by using Abu Bakr Al-Baghdadi (ISIS leader), who tricked the Americans into believing that he was a peaceful Sunni leader. This excerpt is unbelievable:
Pathetic. And it gets worse:
Congratulations my fellow Americans. You should be proud.
Careful. That description fits more people than you'd care to admit. People that you voted for and trusted.
Goes with creating the gangs in America......shows our government have no idea what or how poor people live. They think money solves all the problems, not seeing if they put people together in this way men will create violence.
Started in Los Angeles as a street gang in the 1960s, spread to Texas prisons in the 1980s.
You would think President Bush would have known this above!
Wonder what President Obama has been doing to take care of this.......just send a drone.
Strange how now this is being reported, when a month ago it was known ISIS was being trained by the US military, unknowingly.
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