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I guess I don't remember you're trying grape seed ex, but maybe you didn't stay with it. Or didn't take enough. I got my last supply of pine bark on ebay and it was pretty inexpensive. So I'm working with it. Yes, these two antioxidants are not cheap cheap, but they do so much if people stay with them.
Look at the price of today's drugs and they come with enough side effect warnings to choke a horse.
Young people today spend so much on technology but not on their health. I can say that for everyone into the high priced tech world.
Well I don't have to pay much for the drugs that's the only problem because it's covered by insurance (the allergy med that he wrote out wasn't covered but if I really wanted to he'd probly find one that was since they're always quick to cover it). It's just like a dollar copay for that. It bums me out..that they cover these chemicals but not supps/herbs
But maybe I'll buy some on Amazon so I don't have to use regular money.
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Side effects? Of course herbals have side effects- they are drugs.
Here are a few:
cerebral bleeds associated with ginko, garlic, and ginseng.
central serotonin syndrome with St. John's wort
extra-pyramidal symptoms and parkinsons with kava-kava
peripheral edema with licorice
congestive heart failure with salvia
hypertension with ginseng
They still have less than drugs. I did forget about salvia. That's similar to weed so I don't really believe in that one.
None of the herbs or sups I use have many at all and whenever I look at drug interactions, there's less herbs that interact with other medicines and usually a whole bunch of the non herbal kind that interact with each other. Potent stuff if you ask me. Actually a lot of doctors I've seen when they ask me what medications I use I will ask them if they want to know what herbs/sups I take and they say no so clearly even they know herbs/sups are safe and are only concerned about traditional meds. Do you notice also when people commit suicide they do it by traditional medicine a lot? However I never hear of cases where people will use herbs/sups to commit the act. I know some people need the traditional kind but some people can probly avoid it.
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Libs believe that herbals are safe and effective because they come from NATURE. Most pharmaceuticals ARE DERIVED FROM NATURE in their parent forms.
Well yeah but they ruin it with all those chemicals added in. By all means take drugs if you want but I refuse as much as possible. If I ever get another UTI I am NOT going to the doctor to fix it. I will check it myself and fix it myself. Cost me money to buy the UTI test and they don't sell it everywhere but I'm not doing it. They put me on not one but three antibiotics in a year span..one for UTI one for yeast and one for BV. Oh yeah and one of those antibiotics I had to take a nausea pill cuz it was making me nauseous. Ridiculous! All I wanted to know what is going on down there. I didn't ask to be written a script
Last edited by Nickchick; 10-04-2016 at 01:21 AM..
Well I don't have to pay much for the drugs that's the only problem because it's covered by insurance (the allergy med that he wrote out wasn't covered but if I really wanted to he'd probly find one that was since they're always quick to cover it). It's just like a dollar copay for that. It bums me out..that they cover these chemicals but not supps/herbs
But maybe I'll buy some on Amazon so I don't have to use regular money.
They still have less than drugs. I did forget about salvia. That's similar to weed so I don't really believe in that one.
None of the herbs or sups I use have many at all and whenever I look at drug interactions, there's less herbs that interact with other medicines and usually a whole bunch of the non herbal kind that interact with each other. Potent stuff if you ask me. Actually a lot of doctors I've seen when they ask me what medications I use I will ask them if they want to know what herbs/sups I take and they say no so clearly even they know herbs/sups are safe and are only concerned about traditional meds. Do you notice also when people commit suicide they do it by traditional medicine a lot? However I never hear of cases where people will use herbs/sups to commit the act. I know some people need the traditional kind but some people can probly avoid it.
You don't know about drug interactions because the supplement industry is not regulated and therefore not required to have such warning labels (if what you're buying is even what you think you're buying). There's also little interest in doing the research by the alternative medicine field.
Several supplements I took before I was diagnosed with cancer have serious problems interacting with chemo and other medications I needed to take. Memorial Sloan Kettering has a comprehensive database of supplements. Almost every single one has side effects and adverse reactions - even aloe vera (which I would generally consider totally benign!). While the chart shows side effects and bad reactions with traditional drugs, it does not take into account how multiple supplements might adversely impact your body, particularly if you don't really know what's in your supplements in the first place.
Quote:
Well yeah but they ruin it with all those chemicals added in. By all means take drugs if you want but I refuse as much as possible. If I ever get another UTI I am NOT going to the doctor to fix it. I will check it myself and fix it myself. Cost me money to buy the UTI test and they don't sell it everywhere but I'm not doing it. They put me on not one but three antibiotics in a year span..one for UTI one for yeast and one for BV. Oh yeah and one of those antibiotics I had to take a nausea pill cuz it was making me nauseous. Ridiculous! All I wanted to know what is going on down there. I didn't ask to be written a script
Chemicals like H20? You have no idea what "chemicals" are in your supplements.
You were not given an antibiotic for yeast as antibiotics tend to cause yeast infections. When I've had UTIs to the point of needing doctor intervention (you don't want it to spread to a kidney infection), I've always been recommended to pick up an OTC anti-yeast med as well as make sure my sugar and simple carb intake is low.
I am an insulin-dependent diabetic. A few years ago I read a book by Richard K. Bernstein, M.D. Dr. Bernstein (now some 81 years old), had developed type I diabetes in 1942. Long story made short, he obtained his college degree in engineering, yet kept experimenting with food and diets to better control his blood sugars.
Dr. Bernstein wrote about how, prior to the early 1970s, one had to visit a medical doctor to get their blood sugar levels measured. As such, a diabetic would be lucky to know their numbers once a month, if they could afford the fee for the visit and test.
A company developed a home glucose meter in the early 1970s. Dr. Bernstein was outraged that the medical profession lobbied against this device being made available to the public; said medical profession desired people to continue to come into the office and pay for a glucose test (back then, about $25.00 per visit).
Dr. Bernstein was also outraged that the 'official' diabetic diet actually caused more harm than good. He developed his own diet, after much experimentation, in which he stressed low, low intake of carbohydrates.
When the medical profession ignored his recommendations, and dismissed him as a quack, he quit his job as an engineer, went to medical school, and became a licensed physician. He then started treating his own patients, and began publishing his recommendations.
Of course, afterwards, other doctors (like Adkins) jumped on his low-carb bandwagon. However, he was the first to drastically revise the diabetic diet guidelines (still pretty much ignored by the ADA and such). He was also pleased that the medical profession lost their fight to prevent the public from doing their own testing at home (I test my sugars 4-6 times a day).
You don't know about drug interactions because the supplement industry is not regulated and therefore not required to have such warning labels (if what you're buying is even what you think you're buying). There's also little interest in doing the research by the alternative medicine field.
Several supplements I took before I was diagnosed with cancer have serious problems interacting with chemo and other medications I needed to take. Memorial Sloan Kettering has a comprehensive database of supplements. Almost every single one has side effects and adverse reactions - even aloe vera (which I would generally consider totally benign!). While the chart shows side effects and bad reactions with traditional drugs, it does not take into account how multiple supplements might adversely impact your body, particularly if you don't really know what's in your supplements in the first place.
Chemicals like H20? You have no idea what "chemicals" are in your supplements.
You were not given an antibiotic for yeast as antibiotics tend to cause yeast infections. When I've had UTIs to the point of needing doctor intervention (you don't want it to spread to a kidney infection), I've always been recommended to pick up an OTC anti-yeast med as well as make sure my sugar and simple carb intake is low.
Sloan, Mayo, City of Hope and others are using OPC's in the form of grape seed ex and pycnogenol in many of their cancer research --- do a search you'll find the info on this.
I am an insulin-dependent diabetic. A few years ago I read a book by Richard K. Bernstein, M.D. Dr. Bernstein (now some 81 years old), had developed type I diabetes in 1942. Long story made short, he obtained his college degree in engineering, yet kept experimenting with food and diets to better control his blood sugars.
Dr. Bernstein wrote about how, prior to the early 1970s, one had to visit a medical doctor to get their blood sugar levels measured. As such, a diabetic would be lucky to know their numbers once a month, if they could afford the fee for the visit and test.
A company developed a home glucose meter in the early 1970s. Dr. Bernstein was outraged that the medical profession lobbied against this device being made available to the public; said medical profession desired people to continue to come into the office and pay for a glucose test (back then, about $25.00 per visit).
Dr. Bernstein was also outraged that the 'official' diabetic diet actually caused more harm than good. He developed his own diet, after much experimentation, in which he stressed low, low intake of carbohydrates.
When the medical profession ignored his recommendations, and dismissed him as a quack, he quit his job as an engineer, went to medical school, and became a licensed physician. He then started treating his own patients, and began publishing his recommendations.
Of course, afterwards, other doctors (like Adkins) jumped on his low-carb bandwagon. However, he was the first to drastically revise the diabetic diet guidelines (still pretty much ignored by the ADA and such). He was also pleased that the medical profession lost their fight to prevent the public from doing their own testing at home (I test my sugars 4-6 times a day).
I know one doctor in my town who lost his license since he went outside the so called medical box of treatments...there are others I have followed who were working to help people working and thinking outside the so called conventional box. This is what the AMA does to doctors who think and do outside their rules and regs. Same goes with cancer treatments. Many who go with conventional treatments of drugs/cut/burn and not getting better and going to mexico for alt treatments, but too late by then...I remember Coretta S King's story with cancer.
The doctor who lost his medical license still works in alt treatments as a naturopath doctor. He's been thru the mill with the AMA.
I guess I don't remember you're trying grape seed ex, but maybe you didn't stay with it. Or didn't take enough. I got my last supply of pine bark on ebay and it was pretty inexpensive. So I'm working with it. Yes, these two antioxidants are not cheap cheap, but they do so much if people stay with them.
Look at the price of today's drugs and they come with enough side effect warnings to choke a horse.
Young people today spend so much on technology but not on their health. I can say that for everyone into the high priced tech world.
That's kind of amusing. If a supplement doesn't work, well, that patient made some mistakes. If a prescription drug doesn't work, it's the fault of "Big Pharma". MmmKay!
No, if a supp doesn't work, we try other ones. They are very affordable to keep trying others. And when they don't work, we're not left with side effects, I haven't anyway.
With prescription drugs that don't work, most give us side effects. That was me with a pharma drug for OA inflammation, I ended up with stomach ulcer and trip to ER. That was in the 80's and that major event started me on a totally new path for my health issues.
Just recently I found out WHY my blood pressure was spiking and stayed elevated in spite of meds, it was due to Ibuprofen which I've been taking for OA and hip replacement mess PAIN.
Talking to a friend yesterday and she's a guina pig for BC chemo drugs. She says the cancer is spreading but they are trying another one. She's never been into alt medicine althou I talked to her about grape seed ex for a couple yrs, but she didn't hear me.
I have two friends from the net who are treating for BC with alternatives and they are doing well.
Nutrition and Iodine and other alt cancer protocols and there are many.
People are so closed to alt medicine, which really should be the first lines of attack.
But the big big money isn't there for big drug thinkers aka AMA.
If only, the pharma drugs didn't come with their long list possible side effects. WHY can't they be produced without the dangers? No one answers this.
Last edited by jaminhealth; 10-04-2016 at 01:15 PM..
That's kind of amusing. If a supplement doesn't work, well, that patient made some mistakes. If a prescription drug doesn't work, it's the fault of "Big Pharma". MmmKay!
Exactly. The alternative treatment (I refuse to call it medicine since it's not) crowd always has an excuse handy that makes the failure a human one instead of the failure of some supplement. How they continually justify their magical thinking is beyond me.
Exactly. The alternative treatment (I refuse to call it medicine since it's not) crowd always has an excuse handy that makes the failure a human one instead of the failure of some supplement. How they continually justify their magical thinking is beyond me.
I can say the same about the Pharma Drug lovers.
I know enough people who use both types of treatments. I use a couple meds but first for any issues I grab alternative/holistic remedies to try before I run to doctors for their drugs. Talk about spending $$$$...
I don't know why some are so angry about alternative/holistic healing protocols and those who choose to go their first. Maybe they have not been harmed enough with drugs or won't say so. Maybe they'll never open their minds to the roots of healing or healing as best we can. For me it's management with advancing OA.
A lot of health conditions could be lessened with prevention and feeding the body what it needs. Everything depletes as we age and no drug can fix that.
Hope you are all up on your Vit D...talk about something that depletes. Or if you've never been in the sun for a long time, your tank has been empty for a long time.
No, if a supp doesn't work, we try other ones. They are very affordable to keep trying others. And when they don't work, we're not left with side effects, I haven't anyway.
With prescription drugs that don't work, most give us side effects. That was me with a pharma drug for OA inflammation, I ended up with stomach ulcer and trip to ER. That was in the 80's and that major event started me on a totally new path for my health issues.
Talking to a friend yesterday and she's a guina pig for BC chemo drugs. She says the cancer is spreading but they are trying another one. She's never been into alt medicine althou I talked to her about grape seed ex for a couple yrs, but she didn't hear me.
I have two friends from the net who are treating for BC with alternatives and they are doing well.
Nutrition and Iodine and other alt cancer protocols and there are many.
People are so closed to alt medicine, which really should be the first lines of attack.
But the big big money isn't there for big drug thinkers aka AMA.
Many on this forum have no idea how much it cost to develop or manufacture drugs. I am just a grunt; but I have personally disposed of $43,000,000,000 of vaccine that would not make it to market in time before the expiration date. I also know of many larger so called 'dumps' for various reasons. We make enough vaccine to cover the expectations of the following year; but sometimes other companies will beat us to market or have better sales or a better products available.
Nothing we do is 'cheap'. You go out and buy a 5 gallon container from Lowes for about $20. A 20 L (about the same size as your 5 gallon) container, of pharmaceutical grade that can stand the heat of our autoclaves, can cost us $1,500. We do not use products that have not been approved or validated for the job. We cannot just change anything without going through several reviews - there is no substitution allowed (without approval that can take years).
Even 'throwing out the trash' is expensive. Everything has to be autoclaved because we cannot take the chance of spreading any biological contamination. Some of the rules, to me sound stupid - like we cannot exceed a set temperature (but those are the rules we agreed to and that is what we must do). If the temperature is too high, or too low, or the humidity is too high, the vacuum cycles did not function properly, or we did not autoclave the correct amount of time; the waste is run a second time until it meets the preset parameters. Most loads take an hour or hour and a half and they use a lot of energy. Even throwing out the waste becomes a three man operation: One loader and one check signer and one manager to review the load book, run sheet and print out from the autoclave. Then unloading can involve a fourth person/checker and another manager signature.
These are the regulations and practices that our industry lives with; if we want to survive. It is easy to complain about how expensive your drugs are; it is another thing to see 'why'. Our FDA created most of these regulations to insure that we do not give you an impure, contaminated, or ineffective product. Natural/homeopathic remedies do not have to pass through the hurdles we pass through and one day your industry will pay the price.
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