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Old 01-05-2017, 11:01 AM
 
1,985 posts, read 1,457,005 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC View Post
I am going to repost this from the OP...

ObamaCare has aided the growth of the malignancy that is destroying U.S. health care: a massive federal administrative apparatus and regulatory machine that diverts trillions—not millions or even billions—of “health care” dollars away from health care services to pay itself, to pay the health care bureaucracy.

Costs will come down in simply removing the feds from the equation.

Also - many people in health care want to help others, which is why they go into health care in the first place - and part of helping others is making prices affordable so people can use their services.
I seriously doubt costs will drop in that scenario unless regulation was added to guarantee upfront pricing. When it comes to health people are not rational about costs just feeling better as such the industry will almost always have the upper hand in the cost of anything but routine checkups.
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Old 01-05-2017, 11:01 AM
 
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
2,940 posts, read 1,813,499 times
Reputation: 1940
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
If it were ONLY about curtailing diseases, there could be some argument to be made that it is the fed's responsibility. But how is anything other than preventing diseases that could affect the general population for the greater good of society?

You want to abuse your OWN body for your entire life, don't expect me to pick up the tab when you fall apart.
Because diseases happen not just because of what we eat or our lifestyles...
On top of that, we all live in different areas of the country and different environments. We can't control everything, but we can try to mitigate as much as we can as a whole rather than worrying about it ourselves.
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Old 01-05-2017, 11:02 AM
 
34,619 posts, read 21,621,539 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
The majority of the American people support a Medicare-for-all single payer system.

Majority in U.S. Support Idea of Fed-Funded Healthcare System | Gallup
I'm sure they do since most of them believe it will be better than reality.

All you have to do is hear the masses calling for higher corporate taxes while being completely oblivious to the fact that those taxes are passed on to us one way or another.
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Old 01-05-2017, 11:05 AM
 
14,221 posts, read 6,963,795 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
I'm sure they do since most of them believe it will be better than reality.
Medicare is reality and is very popular.

Arent you a libertarian who believes everyone should fend for themselves? Grandma with early onset dementia should shop around for private insurance at age 70? Its so out of touch with reality that its no wonder you guys prefer to talk about weed and the constitution in order to lure people into social darwinism.
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Old 01-05-2017, 11:05 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
I damn sure would if I were paying the bill and seeing what I'm getting for my money.
Without me knowing, they can raise and raise and raise the cost without accountability. There is no threshold, with other peoples money and their best interest isn't you, but their bank accounts.
You know you can ask now. That was the idea behind high deductible and HSA plans. The trouble turned out that most people liked having things paid for and as such went with conventional plans. Those that did not usually calculated the cost and realized they used so much health insurance that the high deductible plan was cheaper. That forced insurance companies to adjust the plan costs which the put HSA and high deductible plans back out of the main stream.

One of the issues was that medical companies were very dodgy about giving actual costs. Instead they would say things like it should be $500 but it may cost you up to $1000. People don't like that.
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Old 01-05-2017, 11:10 AM
 
1,985 posts, read 1,457,005 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tokinouta View Post
If America loved the idea of single payer non profit then we'd already have it. What prevents us from expanding medicare for all is that people don't vote in government bodies who are for it, or we'd have it. It's pretty simple. What we have now is a divide, some do, some don't. That isn't the same.

Who ran on this premise? Bernie Sanders, and he didn't even make it out of the gate. When we elect a president and a congress/senate who all agree with this then we have a chance. So far we are too divided to get that together.

Meanwhile, most all Americans would love to have affordable healthcare regardless of which system they think will provide it. It's not because some people are mean and others are nice.
They like it. Lobbyists and special interest and the medical industry (which makes up over 20% of GDP) don't. Hence it gets blocked.
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Old 01-05-2017, 11:13 AM
 
8,631 posts, read 9,139,445 times
Reputation: 5990
Quote:
Originally Posted by lepoisson View Post
An easy solution to this would be:

1) Everyone joins the Medicare/Medicaid system and health insurance companies are almost completely eliminated.
2) Raise the medicare/medicaid tax to help fund the massive increase of people in the system. Remember that you and your employer no longer has to pay for health insurance.
3) Now that the medicare/medicaid system has control, they also have the ability to tell hospitals and pharmaceutical companies "sorry, that $8000 MRI you billed should cost no more than $500. Here's a check for $500" and "sorry, that $50 bandaid costs $1 at CVS, here's $5 to cover the cost of the bandaid plus applying it to the patient".

But because of lobbyists in the insurance, medical, and pharmaceutical industries, this will almost never happen.
In all first world countries all employers still contribute to medical coverage and so does the recipients. They do so to the state, not shareholding entities. Many use a mixture of both for-profit and state insurance also, like our Medicare does.
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Old 01-05-2017, 11:13 AM
 
34,619 posts, read 21,621,539 times
Reputation: 22232
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
Medicare is reality and is very popular.

Arent you a libertarian who believes everyone should fend for themselves? Grandma with early onset dementia should shop around for private insurance at age 70? Its so out of touch with reality that its no wonder you guys prefer to talk about weed and the constitution in order to lure people into social darwinism.
And on the other side you want total government control and confiscation to pay for your wants.

Your plan - the government takes from everyone with more than you to pay for everything you want.

With my plan, most 70 year old grandmothers will have a couple hundred thousands dollars left in their HSA.
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Old 01-05-2017, 11:15 AM
 
1,985 posts, read 1,457,005 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
Median income of a general practitioner (family doctor) in the US is $138,000.

Physician / Doctor, General Practice Salary

The median income of an oncologist in the US is $282,000.

Physician - Hematology/Oncology Salaries by education, experience, location and more - Salary.com

They are not getting super rich nor are they paid too much.

Stop with the envy.
Average household income in the US in around $58,000 so on the low end one person is being paid 2.4 times as much as the average household and on the high end they are being paid almost 5 times as much. While I agree those are not high salaries they are not low either. The highly paid oncologist and surgeon will likely be things of the past in the next 20 years thanks to automation so that doesn't concern me, It's more the general cost of everything at every level in healthcare.
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Old 01-05-2017, 11:16 AM
 
638 posts, read 310,491 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
Your plan - the government takes from everyone with more than you to pay for everything you want.
BINGO!
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