Quote:
Originally Posted by knowledgeiskey
Columbus set the impetus for imperialism. The British Empire conquered continental North America at the dawn of independence. So why is it even a day of remembrance?
Also, Columbus didn't even land in Continental North America, only the Caribbean.
|
Your argument is nuts. If you take that argument, then since we're a post colonial nation, we shouldn't celebrate Thanksgiving either.
You are mistaken about the history about the British owning everything here too. The Vikings came centuries before Columbus. The Spaniards came around the same time Columbus did. The French also came and so did the British. Even the Dutch had territory (I think in New York). I think the Portuguese came to South America.
The Spanish were actually more dominant than the British at the time of Columbus. The British started to rise after the Spanish Armada was largely destroyed by a storm in a naval battle between Britain and Spain.
Also, the French owned (supposedly, as Native Americans still resided there) about half of the continental US at the time of the Declaration of Independence was written.
As for which Europeans came here first, I think it was the Romans:
Experts discover Ancient Roman remains in America just after Christ | History | News | Express.co.uk
Also, I think people knew the Earth was round before even the Romans came around. The Bible says in Psalm 103: 12, it says: As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us.
That would imply that they knew that the Earth was round back then when that Psalm was written. (If the Earth was flat, you couldn't go west indefinitely or east indefinitely.
Also, Aristotle knew that the Earth was round too:
Proof is obtained from the evidence of the senses. If the Earth were not spherical, eclipses of the Moon would not exhibit segments of the shape which they do. As it is, in its monthly phases the Moon takes on all varieties of shapes - straight-edged, gibbous and concave - but in eclipses the boundary is always convex. Thus, if the eclipses are due to the interposition of the Earth, the shape must be caused by its circumference, and the Earth must be spherical.
On the Heavens II, 14, Aristotle, 350 BC
It's possible that Columbus read that verse in the Bible and also read Aristotle and hence believed in a round Earth.
Interestingly, a few decades before Columbus set sail, literature started to become more widespread with Gutenberg's invention of the printing press in 1439. Also, as you know, the power of the Catholic Church was defied by Martin Luther in 1517, beginning the Reformation.
Hence, it appears that Columbus sailed in 1492, in the twilight period of the Dark Ages. While it's true that many uneducated people thought the Earth was flat, the number of educated people was on the rise, thanks to those like Gutenberg. The Spanish monarchy also must have believed that the Earth wasn't flat (or else they wouldn't have spent a bundle of dough on his voyage to the East Indies if they thought he'd just fall off.)
Also, maybe not in the case of Columbus but certainly other settlements, especially British, settlement in the Americas later by the Pilgrims and then the colonists was actually a BLOW to European Imperialism in the long run. The people came to America to get AWAY from the British (and other) monarchies. The purchase of the Louisiana Territory was another blow to European imperialism in the Americas. The United States was the first American settlement entity (other than the natives already there of course) to chose to have its leadership in the Americas rather than in Europe.
Also, let's not be dumb and assume that only Europeans can be imperialistic. Let's not forget the Egyptian Empire, the Babylonian Empire, the Mede and Persian Empire (the Romans were technically Europeans, so I didn't list them for obvious reasons.)
Also, there was the Mongolian invasion of China, Persia, and even Europe and the attempted invasion of Japan. Also, Japanese Imperialism was in large part responsible for the Pacific World War II. (And let's not forget the Chinese takeover of Tibet and their puppet nation North Korea.) What about Russian imperialism and the USSR?
What about Aztec (or Mexica) Empire in Central American and their Imperialism? What about Mayan Imperialism in Central America?
Also, the idea of Columbus invading America and taking away loads of natives sounds hard to swallow. He was planning to sail to the East Indies. I doubt he brought that many weapons and soldiers with him. (Recall that Cortez would have been clobbered by the Mexica (Aztecs) without the help of both the diseases that they gave them (don't think it was planned) and the help of natives who hated the Aztecs. Also, the natives would have known where they were at but Columbus would have had little clue. It's likely that any natives that went with Columbus did so VOLUNTARILY.)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
(as a retired state employee - it was suggested (years ago) that we give up Columbus Day (out of the goodness of our hearts & for the benefit of state budget). What a ruckus. As of 2008, when I retired, Columbus day was being observed on Friday after Thanksgiving (instead of October). Which meant that I (as an employee not in "direct patient care) no longer had to take a personal vacation day to have a 4 day break. Folks not paying attention thought the state did away with us greedy state employees an unimportant "holiday." State employee political action groups/lobbyists, etc. took up the cause. Not sayin' it was right.
