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We'll yeah, if you live in a black and white world.
This is the real world where it's much more complex:
1. Women always want men to make the first move (or first approach). If he doesn't make the first move, then he won't be getting laid and now gets to wonder why he was too scared to make the first move. And the woman wonders if there was something wrong and why he didn't make the first move. Women hardly ever make the first move. Look no further than Tinder, where countless women say they will not text you first. Why? Fear of rejection or embarrassment. The burden is on men to risk rejection, not women.
2. Women sometimes play hard to get (interpret that as you want)
3. Women can send mixed signals and put themselves in unfortunate situations. For example, a woman may think accepting drinks at the bar and dancing all over someone is just having a good time, the man might think he's getting laid. A woman might think getting a ride home is just a ride home, a man might think he's getting laid. A woman might think going to a guy's hotel room to party is just to party, a man might think he's getting laid. Certainly buying a woman drinks, taking her to dinner, dancing on her, driving her around, and her going to your hotel or house doesn't entitle you to have sex but you can see where a man becomes confused, especially when you add point #1 into the mix.
4. Sex can never be discussed in a beforehand consensual manner. It makes the woman feel like a w****. Sex must "just happen" and be" spontaneous." A man will never get laid if he ever insinuates or implies a date or interaction will lead to sex, the woman would feel used as if that's all he wanted. This aspect just complicates matters.
5. As I said before, women never make the first move (or the first approach) and don't want to make the first move for fear of rejection. So sadly we live in a society where men are expected to make the first move and as we know, sometime men abuse that expectation into a criminal and barbaric act.
6. Some women dress provocatively. Now hold on, a woman can dress how she wants. But she shouldn't be surprised at the response and stares if she has her breasts hanging out and booty hangout out at the local clubs where drunk and immature men go to also have fun. A woman wants to feel sexy, that's not a crime. But you have to understand what type of response it will generate in that particular environment.
I'm not blaming women, I'm simply explaining how complex the real world of dating is when women expect men to make the first move, send mixed signals, and refuse to discuss sex beforehand.
The much bigger problem for #metoo is all the claimed outrage over mundane incidents. There is little effort made to distinguish actual sexual assault and normal attempts to initiate sexual relations.
I get the feeling that "normal attempts to initiate sexual relations" might differ among "certain" people. A woman tells someone they aren't interested then that certain someone needs to respect that and not turn flirting into harassment. I suspect there are certain people here who don't get that. I suspect some are into the Incel movement. What might be mundane to YOU is not to us. We don't like it.
It isn’t about blaming the victim. It’s about looking at the events that led to the rape to see if there were things he or she could have avoided that could have prevented the rape and use it as an example to others as part of a safety talk. It doesn’t mean the victim deserved the rape. It means there were choices that could have helped to prevent the rape. The rapist could have chosen not to rape is an easy argument. It’s like locking the doors to your car or home to minimize risk of robbery. Leaving those doors and windows increases the risk of robbery by making it easier for a criminal to act. Taking reasonable precautions reduces your personal risk.
It isn’t about blaming the victim. It’s about looking at the events that led to the rape to see if there were things he or she could have avoided that could have prevented the rape and use it as an example to others as part of a safety talk. It doesn’t mean the victim deserved the rape. It means there were choices that could have helped to prevent the rape. The rapist could have chosen not to rape is an easy argument. It’s like locking the doors to your car or home to minimize risk of robbery. Leaving those doors and windows increases the risk of robbery by making it easier for a criminal to act. Taking reasonable precautions reduces your personal risk.
This.
I love how some went as far as accusing me of having the rapist mentality for suggesting there were more that could have been done.
By the way, I'm a dude married to another dude. Don't care much for doing anything to or with a woman.
Say I'm walking through the ghetto at night and I get mugged. Well, perhaps I shouldn't have walked through the ghetto at night alone huh?
Say I'm a girl who decides to get drunk and high on God knows what drugs in the middle of a bunch of hypersexualized jocks who have always been taught that girls were just playthings.
Why is it that we can't bring up some basic common sense safety tips without being accused of victim blaming?
Bring it up all you want, as long and you understand it's not a legal argument.
Say I'm walking through the ghetto at night and I get mugged. Well, perhaps I shouldn't have walked through the ghetto at night alone huh?
Say I'm a girl who decides to get drunk and high on God knows what drugs in the middle of a bunch of hypersexualized jocks who have always been taught that girls were just playthings.
Why is it that we can't bring up some basic common sense safety tips without being accused of victim blaming?
What if you are standing at a well lit ATM in a nice neighborhood, and someone walks up and puts a gun to your head and takes your money ? What did you do wrong and what could you have done differently ?
Same with rape. Not every rape takes place because alcohol or drugs were involved, sometimes women are simply attacked and there is nothing they could have done to prevent it.
Bring it up all you want, as long and you understand it's not a legal argument.
But juries in past cases, HAVE recognized these things, so its important to keep in mind. Im referring to that recent rape trial, where the jury admitted they took into consideration how the woman was dressed, in deciding guilt or not, many people were upset at this, and many thought it was wrong they did that, but they still did it, and Id imagine juries in the future will do the same thing, so it must be considered a factor, juries are made up of other people, people are different, have different opinions on these things, thats going to effect decisions ultimately.
I keep flipping the script around and it sounds goofy. Do men have to worry about their attire? Not where I live. I could dress as sexy as I like, and I don't think a woman is going to get all inflamed, and say "I got's to get me some of that!"
We'll yeah, if you live in a black and white world.
This is the real world where it's much more complex:
1. Women always want men to make the first move (or first approach). If he doesn't make the first move, then he won't be getting laid and now gets to wonder why he was too scared to make the first move. And the woman wonders if there was something wrong and why he didn't make the first move. Women hardly ever make the first move. Look no further than Tinder, where countless women say they will not text you first. Why? Fear of rejection or embarrassment. The burden is on men to risk rejection, not women.
2. Women sometimes play hard to get (interpret that as you want)
3. Women can send mixed signals and put themselves in unfortunate situations. For example, a woman may think accepting drinks at the bar and dancing all over someone is just having a good time, the man might think he's getting laid. A woman might think getting a ride home is just a ride home, a man might think he's getting laid. A woman might think going to a guy's hotel room to party is just to party, a man might think he's getting laid. Certainly buying a woman drinks, taking her to dinner, dancing on her, driving her around, and her going to your hotel or house doesn't entitle you to have sex but you can see where a man becomes confused, especially when you add point #1 into the mix.
4. Sex can never be discussed in a beforehand consensual manner. It makes the woman feel like a w****. Sex must "just happen" and be" spontaneous." A man will never get laid if he ever insinuates or implies a date or interaction will lead to sex, the woman would feel used as if that's all he wanted. This aspect just complicates matters.
5. As I said before, women never make the first move (or the first approach) and don't want to make the first move for fear of rejection. So sadly we live in a society where men are expected to make the first move and as we know, sometime men abuse that expectation into a criminal and barbaric act.
6. Some women dress provocatively. Now hold on, a woman can dress how she wants. But she shouldn't be surprised at the response and stares if she has her breasts hanging out and booty hangout out at the local clubs where drunk and immature men go to also have fun. A woman wants to feel sexy, that's not a crime. But you have to understand what type of response it will generate in that particular environment.
I'm not blaming women, I'm simply explaining how complex the real world of dating is when women expect men to make the first move, send mixed signals, and refuse to discuss sex beforehand.
None of that has to do with rape. Men being expected to make the first move has nothing to do with rape. Everyone has bad dates and miscommunications. It shouldn't lead to assaults OR accusations because someone misread signals. You're not on the same page, then go your separate ways.
Men should NEVER expect sex for taking a woman out on a date. Great if it happens but don't feel entitled or things can go bad and you end up with accusations or embarrassment like Aziz Ansari or worse.
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