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I think I qualify as one of the "pioneers" of a movement that now is in strong agreement with 3-5% of the electorate, and cordial with a lot more. My personal leanings go back to exposure to the writings of a diverse group ranging from Austrian and Chicago "school" economists, to Karl Hess, Murray Rothbard, ad Ayn Rand, and I witnessed the walk-out of about 40% of the leadership of the campus conservative group Young Americans for Freedom, nearly fifty years ago.
In those heady times, when most of us were young and crazy, it was possible to dream of a "society without coercion" -- and most of the division among young conservatives of the day centered along a rift between secular libertarians (always with a lower case 'l' in those days), and the usual religion-and nationalism-based collection of absolutes. A few years in the working world quickly dispelled that fantasy, while a formal Libertarian party, led by cerebral personalities such as the late John Hospers and Roger McBride, emerged.
During those same years, the Democratic Party attempted broaden its base by incorporating a number of groups formerly dismissed as part of the radical fringe, and by toning down the most strident among them. But coalitions such as this are naturally harder to keep together, and run up against many of the absolutes held sacred by some components of the conservative spectrum; hence, the swings from Carter, to Reagan, to the bushes and the Clintons -- each of whom had to deal with their own weak suits.
Enter Donald Trump -- a product of a media-obsessed society, and an anathema to the Old Politics as practiced by both Old Parties. During his campaign, he began by skewering the old Republican center -- the same viewpoint (though not the same personalities) that resented the rise of Barry Goldwater half a century before. Nomination in hand. t\he then took up a similar sword against the Democrats' coalition of "identities", and won -- aided in no small part by many of us who understand that what's thrown together in what used to be called a "smoke-filled room" (how Politically Incorrect! ) doesn't always play well out on the street; let alone the smaller communities which still wield more influence than those who smear us as "deplorables" are willing to admit.
There are a lot of us out here who viewed Mr. Trump as the lesser of three evils. We seem to be concentrated in the older Rust Belt states (possibly because of continued discord within the Blue Coalition, and the single trait that unites us is a knowledge of the SJW- and Snowflake-bait that won't work, and while I don't expect a landslide come Nov.6, I do hope that that particular lesson will be reinforced.
Last edited by 2nd trick op; 10-27-2018 at 01:39 PM..
Libertarians should vote for Trump based on tax cuts, de-regulation, and the ending of the individual mandate alone. Nor is Trump going to assail your freedom of speech with "politcal correctness" or accusations of "hate speech." The average citizen has manifestly more personal freedom under Trump that any fascist ****bag democrat, and it you fail to vote for DJT come November, you are implicity voting against your own freedom.
Trump has governed to the right of Reagan, who was beloved by at least some libertarians. Reagan himself once said 'libertarianism is the heart and soul of conservatism.
Trump chose a long time school choice advocate as Education Secretary. And Mike Pence was chair of the liberty caucus, which I guess is as it gets to the LP in the GOP since Ron Paul left.
Many things about Trump are not so libertarian, such as his support for the EX-IM bank. Like Reagan he has exploded the debt.
Trump appointed someone opposed to the 4th amendment. That alone should get a libertarian to vote against him.
The fourth Amendment has been null and void for years. Trump didn't start that. He already got the [i]Janus[i] decision (I disagreed), but still it was a First Amendment case. Another 1st Amendment case was the Colorado baker and the gay wedding cake.
If I'm a libertarian, which I decidedly am not, I'm reasonably happy with Trump. In politics, if you demand everything, you end up with nothing.
I’m a Libertarian. I voted for Johnson/Weld and would do so again.
Trump is “deplorable” from my Libertarian perspective: he loves Big Government and less freedom when it fits his supporters’ agendas.
Libertarian = less government and more liberty. Not Donald Trump.
That's not how we win. I identify as a Libertarian but I voted for Trump.
The way we win is by moving the political needle from the current left to the right. Electing Trump is despicable, but it would be a disaster allowing the leftist lunacy Hillary Clinton to become the president appointing leftist activists to the court.
Every vote not cast for Trump was a vote for Hillary.
Speaking only for myself, one of the hardest challenges for me to confront in a "post-industrial" workplace is the insincere sensitivity expected by a "consumerist" society.
Like a lot of people, I found my employment prospects diminished by both advancing age and the changing labor market. I'd worked in several industries that operated on a 24/7 basis, so call-center work seemed like a good fit at first. So I started out doing technical troubleshooting for an ISP. But as the customers learned more of the basics, most of us were involuntarily cross-trained and transferred to "general customer care" (and without any increase in pay, of course).
And I also quickly found out that a combination of helicopter parents and Special Snowflakes makes for a long, and tedious day. I didn't take well to being expected to "apologize" for the disappointments which are an integral part of daily life, and in which I had no part -- and being cited by an eavesdropping supervisor for bot doing so. Also the pressure to launch an insulting sales pitch, and being criticized for taking too long at something many of us simply don't have the personality to do. (Please don't teach me to ''put a smile in my voice"; I don't want to sound like a manipulator -- or an idiot.)
Somewhere in that nebulous field that defines the rights to life, liberty and property, there ought to be room for a right to some privacy, dignity and self-respect; but I'm not sure how to define it, or establish it -- and without inviting a meddlesome Big Brother/Sister to the party.
Last edited by 2nd trick op; 10-29-2018 at 05:14 PM..
Gotta run my daughter to swimming, but wanted to post a quick thanks for your perspective. And to help myself find this thread again when I come back. Looks like we share some ideals as well as a general location. Will post more later....
Trump is insanely bad from a libertarian point of view in my opinion. His actions where he simply lies and distorts reality have no place in any sane administration. They represent a existential risk to freedom, democracy, and libertarianism. The ideals he espouses do not lead to anything remotely like libertarianism.
Instead they lead to countries led by those who lie the best. When Trump talked about a 10% tax cut for the middle class recently, he was just making things up that he thought folks wanted to hear. Thats the sort of leadership that leads by deception. Any libertarian who sees that should recognize that while Trump SAYS things...he doesn't mean them, or care about them. They're just a way to manipulate people.
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) doesn't always play well out on the street; let alone the smaller communities which still wield more influence than those who smear us as "deplorables" are willing to admit.
