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Air traffic control and security should be privatized. TSA didn't exist before 9-11 and the only reason they were created is because private security messed up ONE TIME on 9-11, as if government workers are perfect.
Yeah let's use 9/11/01 as a reason to bash the TSA. Let's say it was a one time mess up. Yeah, that works. EXCEPT it was one security mess up in not one, not two but three different airports. That morning three airports in three different cities that each had one HUGE oops each that because of it, three airplanes caused almost 3,000 direct deaths and 6,000+ more injuries and countless cancer patients in late later years. But hey, let's just say it was one oops...
As for saying the private sector is any better at security than the public is a matter of inconclusiveness. I work at a football stadium and I can tell you from time to time banned items get through. Not often but it happens especially when banned items aren't always the same despite being the same item. I also see at other locations that some allow virtually anything or barely check bags especially if they are clear. TSA has missed things on occasion too and honestly with the amount of travelers in a single terminal, it shouldn't be a surprise.
FYI, as another poster said, how would a privatized airline security work in a government shutdown? If they are contractors, they would be barred from working. Also if they are not allowed to work, who would man the posts?
Yeah let's use 9/11/01 as a reason to bash the TSA. Let's say it was a one time mess up. Yeah, that works. EXCEPT it was one security mess up in not one, not two but three different airports. That morning three airports in three different cities that each had one HUGE oops each that because of it, three airplanes caused almost 3,000 direct deaths and 6,000+ more injuries and countless cancer patients in late later years. But hey, let's just say it was one oops...
As for saying the private sector is any better at security than the public is a matter of inconclusiveness. I work at a football stadium and I can tell you from time to time banned items get through. Not often but it happens especially when banned items aren't always the same despite being the same item. I also see at other locations that some allow virtually anything or barely check bags especially if they are clear. TSA has missed things on occasion too and honestly with the amount of travelers in a single terminal, it shouldn't be a surprise.
FYI, as another poster said, how would a privatized airline security work in a government shutdown? If they are contractors, they would be barred from working. Also if they are not allowed to work, who would man the posts?
Only three? I believe it was four. Two planes hit in NYC. One hit Pentagon. And the fourth crashed in a field in PA.
Only three? I believe it was four. Two planes hit in NYC. One hit Pentagon. And the fourth crashed in a field in PA.
The two planes that hit the World Trade Center towers both came from Logan Airport in Boston, MA; the one that hit the Pentagon came from Dulles Airport in Washington D.C.; and the one that crashed in the Pennsylvania field came from Newark Airport in NJ.
Yeah let's use 9/11/01 as a reason to bash the TSA. Let's say it was a one time mess up. Yeah, that works. EXCEPT it was one security mess up in not one, not two but three different airports. That morning three airports in three different cities that each had one HUGE oops each that because of it, three airplanes caused almost 3,000 direct deaths and 6,000+ more injuries and countless cancer patients in late later years. But hey, let's just say it was one oops...
As for saying the private sector is any better at security than the public is a matter of inconclusiveness. I work at a football stadium and I can tell you from time to time banned items get through. Not often but it happens especially when banned items aren't always the same despite being the same item. I also see at other locations that some allow virtually anything or barely check bags especially if they are clear. TSA has missed things on occasion too and honestly with the amount of travelers in a single terminal, it shouldn't be a surprise.
FYI, as another poster said, how would a privatized airline security work in a government shutdown? If they are contractors, they would be barred from working. Also if they are not allowed to work, who would man the posts?
did you know that if a lot of the INS jobs had not and are not contracted out those hijackers would have been caught and deported before they hijacked the planes?
LOL. You realize if it was private we would have no flights occurring right now. The ONLY reason they are able to keep flights going is that they are forcing government workers to come in. Private companies would already be closing their doors-some permanently. I actually was for privatizing air traffic control before....but now not so much when I look at this.
I mean if air traffic control wasn't contingent on government funding at all, if the controllers were paid directly by the local airport authority.
Yeah let's use 9/11/01 as a reason to bash the TSA. Let's say it was a one time mess up. Yeah, that works. EXCEPT it was one security mess up in not one, not two but three different airports. That morning three airports in three different cities that each had one HUGE oops each that because of it, three airplanes caused almost 3,000 direct deaths and 6,000+ more injuries and countless cancer patients in late later years. But hey, let's just say it was one oops...
As for saying the private sector is any better at security than the public is a matter of inconclusiveness. I work at a football stadium and I can tell you from time to time banned items get through. Not often but it happens especially when banned items aren't always the same despite being the same item. I also see at other locations that some allow virtually anything or barely check bags especially if they are clear. TSA has missed things on occasion too and honestly with the amount of travelers in a single terminal, it shouldn't be a surprise.
FYI, as another poster said, how would a privatized airline security work in a government shutdown? If they are contractors, they would be barred from working. Also if they are not allowed to work, who would man the posts?
Again, for the screeners to be paid directly by the airport authority and by the airlines and not by government funds at all. I know Israel's flag carrier airline El Al has their own private security teams that are the most efficient in the industry.
The two planes that hit the World Trade Center towers both came from Logan Airport in Boston, MA; the one that hit the Pentagon came from Dulles Airport in Washington D.C.; and the one that crashed in the Pennsylvania field came from Newark Airport in NJ.
So one airport had two lapses in security instead of one.
did you know that if a lot of the INS jobs had not and are not contracted out those hijackers would have been caught and deported before they hijacked the planes?
So are you saying INS should be contracted or were and that was why it didn't work? From all I heard with the hijackers, there was no red flags that could have popped up given information at the time. The only thing is now we could get this intel but many people hate it because it infringes on their rights... OK, so what's worse, having your right to liberty infringed on for a few minutes to prevent harm or we don't prevent harm and your right to life and liberty permanently infringed on due to a terror attack?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70
I mean if air traffic control wasn't contingent on government funding at all, if the controllers were paid directly by the local airport authority.
OK and how would it work to communicate with other towers? Let's say O'Hare versus Midway, Sanford versus MCO, LAX versus John Wayne or JFK/La Guardia versus Mid-Island (I forget the small airport in Long Island) have two separate governing local airport authorities (I know JFK, LGA and Newark were ran security wise by the NY/NJ Port Authority and I don't recall Mid-Island being one overseed by the port authority.) Say the Port Authority worked the JFK/LGA/NWK towers in concert, yet Mid-Island's was done by say LIATC, how would they work to have the air traffic control in concert? I think federalizing it streamlines that issue.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70
Again, for the screeners to be paid directly by the airport authority and by the airlines and not by government funds at all. I know Israel's flag carrier airline El Al has their own private security teams that are the most efficient in the industry.
Using Israel is a bit of apples/oranges comparison when compared to the US. Israel is know for being far more vigilante in security partially out of necessity due to all the bombings than the rest of the world, even the U.S. in the post 9/11 world. I also don't hear as much nay-saying by Israelis toward security vigilance as I do with America. I know people who hate going through detection anywhere in the U.S. whether you talk airports or sport venues and complain about it to no end. You never hear that with Israel who do this not just as airports or sports venues but malls. Imagine malls in America doing that, nope I can't because of the apprehension to it.
As for screening, I previously mentioned that the NYC metro airports besides Mid-Island I KNOW used the Port Authority prior to 9/11 because I flew out of LGA or JFK three times as a kid/teen prior to 9/11. The Port Authority was what they also used for bridges. That said, I stand by my comment that private security and local public security is no worse than federal public security. If anything, federal is again more streamlined IMHO as it is done the same way instead of different places following different bench marks and criteria for what is banned or allowed (which I see often depending on the venue.) I say this as a private security guard that works with screenings (though I never worked an airport.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by yspobo
So one airport had two lapses in security instead of one.
You can say that, the point is to claim "One oops is all it took" is a bit of a stretch to get a point across. At the very least it was a HUGE one if you consider it, just one.
Which is why I brought up the issue of meal preparation and also how companies go in and ask for their food to not be removed.
So, you're saying that the poor cannot, for example, fathom for themselves that a one pound bag of baby carrots (locally, $1.49) is both cheaper and healthier than a 13 ounce bag of chips ($3.89)?
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OK, so what's worse, having your right to liberty infringed on for a few minutes to prevent harm or we don't prevent harm and your right to life and liberty permanently infringed on due to a terror attack?
