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Old 02-09-2019, 01:44 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,353 posts, read 45,091,355 times
Reputation: 13811

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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkpunk View Post
And many people complaining whom were Trump voters in the SALT states are not actually the higher income earners, they are in fact middle class...
The average household income in the US is $59,100. I can guarantee you such persons are not paying over $10,000 in SALT taxes.
Quote:
The higher income tax earners aren't really paying their fair share and you know it.
They're paying FAR more than their fair share. I posted the chart in an earlier post.

CHART

Quote:
The rich got the tax cuts indefinietly while the lower class and middle class have their's temporarily. It will take a Bush-era extension to redo that while the rich would need a total change in tax law to do that.
The corporate tax cuts? Since everyone pays corporate taxes, everyone got that exact same tax cut. Again, I posted the chart which includes which income groups pay corporate taxes.
Quote:
You're so full of it, that it is coming out of your ears. The left don't want to tax the middle class NYPD officers like the ones taking a bath on the Trump tax cuts who actually voted for Trump mind you.
Again, a $59,100 income household (US average) is NOT going to be paying over $10,000/year in SALT taxes.

Here's another chart that shows how much each income group pays in local/state taxes, and federal taxes. The chart indicates a $59,100 household pays less than 10% of their income in SALT taxes. That's less than $5,910, well below the $10,000 maximum.

CHART>> Chart: Total Effective Local, State, and Federal Tax Rates, by Income Cohort <<CHART

Data sources for chart: Tax Policy Center and Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy, two liberal think tanks...

Federal Tax Rates (includes individual and corporate income tax, payroll taxes for Social Security and Medicare, and the estate tax):

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/sites...F/T13-0035.pdf

Local and State Tax Rates (includes state income tax, real estate tax, private property tax, and sales tax):

Executive Summary | The Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy (ITEP)
Quote:
I didn't, but here are my qualifiers:

I live in a no SALT area and saw very little change in paycheck to paycheck once the 2018 taxed income started rolling in. I got this important e-mail stating the withholding changed and it was maybe the equivalent of an extra hour of work.
I took standard deduction every year I've done my taxes or should I say, needed to do taxes. I just haven't had enough to go itemized during the previous 6,250 let alone the double under Trump's tax plan.
I have a job where depending on events I make anywhere from 1.5K a year to 2.5K a year on top of my 9-5 job. Now this job, doesn't withhold federal income taxes and just withholds from the state and sends the payroll taxes. When i was doing my taxes last year, this income actually caused my first estimate to show I owed even after adding my 9-5 job which withholds taxes. I ended up using another service and had owed money and found a tax credit I use and maximize out due to teaching expenses.

By those qualifiers, I don't know on top of a new tax structure, I don't know why anyone in a similar boat to me wouldn't be unsure of their tax return. I feared the worst and it wound up I was owed some $40 above last year's return. But it didn't save me all that much money like was promoted by the Republicans when the tax plans were being considered. Granted, I didn't buy it, but you should see where I am getting at...

I don't know why you are so hung up on defending SALT. This was the main reason Trump supporters are turning on him based on the tax plans. I have no idea if they'll move to other areas or not, but I expect Trump finding less conservatives voting in those areas than last time. I mean, those states that use SALT are largely Democrat strongholds anyway...
Anyone who pays more than $10,000 in SALT and deducts every last unlimited penny of it isn't paying their fair share in federal income tax. Period. You know that. That's why the SALT deduction was capped, so higher income earners can't weasel out of paying the federal income taxes they should by deducting their high SALT taxes. That loophole is capped.
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Old 02-09-2019, 02:18 PM
 
12,017 posts, read 14,372,971 times
Reputation: 5981
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
That's exactly what I said. They're capital gains, so they're taxed as such.

Marginal tax rate means nothing, as not all your income is taxed at that rate. What's your actual effective federal income tax rate? Your tax liability (before withholding or quarterly estimates are deducted leaving either a balance due or a refund) will be on line 63 on your 2017 US 1040. Divide your tax liability (line 63) by your AGI (line 37) to get your effective federal income tax rate.

2017 US 1040
There you you go again.... Giving a free pass to those who are able to use capital gains rates as individual income rates.

The swamp is alive and well. I know damn well how to calculate an effective rate and it's higher than what you're hedge fund buddies pay
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Old 02-09-2019, 03:15 PM
 
Location: Buckeye, AZ
38,936 posts, read 23,986,372 times
Reputation: 14125
Quote:
Originally Posted by chopchop0 View Post
There you you go again.... Giving a free pass to those who are able to use capital gains rates as individual income rates.

The swamp is alive and well. I know damn well how to calculate an effective rate and it's higher than what you're hedge fund buddies pay
He is also using a chart by a foundation with a former Nixon aide who wanted to eliminate Social Security and Medicare and is using the same CEOs who brought us to the financial collapse to balance our debt. InformedConsent is informed by their bias and political leanings.
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Old 02-09-2019, 03:15 PM
 
16,375 posts, read 22,547,474 times
Reputation: 14403
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Every senior drawing from a pension and/or retirement account pays the same capital gains tax.
Seniors drawing from a retirement account don't pay capital gains rate. If it's an IRA or 401k or similar, they are paying regular income tax rates on it when they withdraw, NOT capital gains tax. If it's a ROTH IRA, then it's all tax free.

Seniors getting a defined benefit pension get a 1099 and this is income not capital gains either.

Capital gains is on post tax accounts/investments and these aren't defined as 'retirement accounts'.
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Old 02-09-2019, 03:18 PM
 
Location: Charleston, SC
7,102 posts, read 6,015,258 times
Reputation: 5712
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeyJude514 View Post
Multiple supporters of President Donald Trump over the past couple of weeks have taken to Twitter to air their grievances about the president’s signature tax cut plan. Here's one example.

https://twitter.com/973angie/status/1088151062111023104

https://www.rawstory.com/2019/02/tru...gops-tax-plan/

I suspect there is going to be much more of this as more people realize how badly Trump and the GOP screwed the middle class.
And you got it, people on Twitter are the most honest, trustworthy source of information to rely on when passing judgments!

Good find! I'm going to go out and rush to judgement now. All thanks to Twitter.
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Old 02-09-2019, 03:42 PM
 
20,955 posts, read 8,722,957 times
Reputation: 14051
Quote:
Originally Posted by sware2cod View Post
Seniors drawing from a retirement account don't pay capital gains rate. If it's an IRA or 401k or similar, they are paying regular income tax rates on it when they withdraw, NOT capital gains tax. If it's a ROTH IRA, then it's all tax free.

Seniors getting a defined benefit pension get a 1099 and this is income not capital gains either.

Capital gains is on post tax accounts/investments and these aren't defined as 'retirement accounts'.
Yep...sorta puts the level of the "debate" in question.

My retirement draw-downs are totally mixed - from IRA withdraws to dividends (qualified and unqualified) to capital gains and interest (taxable and tax-free). I probably missed some categories such as K-1's and some foreign reporting...although that probably ends up at one of the other rates.

That's why we need accountants. I was almost ready to give mine up now that I'm not working for $$ any more, but with this tax reform I think it's wise to see the Pros do it for at least one more year (probably not itemizing, but that doesn't change the investment stuff).
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Old 02-09-2019, 04:26 PM
 
Location: Suburbia
8,827 posts, read 15,354,763 times
Reputation: 4533
My federal withholding went from $858/month to $724/mo claiming zero. Wife's was about the same. Pay was for ten months. Child turned 18 at the end of the summer 2018. We went from owing about $300 to $5800.
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Old 02-09-2019, 04:33 PM
 
15,047 posts, read 8,899,674 times
Reputation: 9510
Average tax refund down 8.4 percent in first filing week

The average tax refund from the IRS dropped 8.4 percent in the first week of the 2019 filing season compared to the same period last year, according to agency statistics. “There are going to be a lot of unhappy people over the next month,” said Edward Karl, vice president of taxation for the American Institute of CPAs.

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/...d-down-1158440

Last edited by HeyJude514; 02-09-2019 at 04:44 PM..
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Old 02-09-2019, 05:38 PM
 
20,955 posts, read 8,722,957 times
Reputation: 14051
Quote:
Originally Posted by chopchop0 View Post
There you you go again.... Giving a free pass to those who are able to use capital gains rates as individual income rates.

The swamp is alive and well. I know damn well how to calculate an effective rate and it's higher than what you're hedge fund buddies pay
I think Romney proved that one out.....

"Romney earned $21.7 million and paid $3 million in taxes, for an effective rate of 13.9 percent"

Heck, I've paid a lot more than that. Just checked...and sure enough, 18% plus
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Old 02-09-2019, 05:58 PM
 
3,346 posts, read 1,275,766 times
Reputation: 3174
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeyJude514 View Post
Average tax refund down 8.4 percent in first filing week

The average tax refund from the IRS dropped 8.4 percent in the first week of the 2019 filing season compared to the same period last year, according to agency statistics. “There are going to be a lot of unhappy people over the next month,” said Edward Karl, vice president of taxation for the American Institute of CPAs.

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/...d-down-1158440
And yet the 1% are getting an average of $60,000 tax refunds. Redistribution of wealth to the top at the expense of middle class.

Only in Trump’s America.
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