Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Ask yourself what does it take to screw up an an already hot economy that has just been goosed with a trillion dollars of stimulus? Answer: tariffs. You don't even need good old Econ 101 for this.
Let's not forget it was up quite a bit when the bad news came out. So it is off highs by about 500. Like I said above somewhere though, the market is not the thing to worry about here. This was a very, very bad manufacturing number that followed a bad one last month. Manufacturing is in recession in the US now. It joins retail and agriculture. This increasingly looks like it is not going to end well.
Obama placed a 522% tariff on Chinese steel. You read that right, and I did not mistype. 522%. Few lefties seem to know, or are willing to admit this. Of course, this did not help, because we were not buying much Chinese steel. Most companies don't like the quality. We as consumers were buying finished goods from China instead, and that's what Trump decided to target.
The WSJ was right in 2016. The worst was yet to come, because Trump took charge and really starting rolling those tariffs out!
The way to get a change and save a crucial US industry we cannot just have every steel mill lost. It was a security reason also.
Going at it with a scalpel and not a hatchet with name calling and what the world sees as too much at one time causing even possible new arms race.
With the Chinese leader cutting a US trip even short ....,Trump is winning nothing.
Trump in the past canned Obama the least respected President in the world realm and actually. That finger point had 4 fingers pointing back. Definitely IT IS TRUMP TODAY IN THE WORLD LEAST RESPECTED.
How many Cabinets members, advisors and much more. Need to be forced out after Trump initially praised each one as best when appointed. THEN O MANY DO THE SPILLING OF THE TRUTH BEHIND THIS MAN THEY LOST RESPECT FOR AND EVEN EORK FOR ANOTHER GOP NOMINEE EVEN TO TELL-ALL BOOKS.
Does everyone lie?
Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire
Under Obama, the stock market was propelled forward by ZIRP and QE. Plenty of money was sloshing around, but very little of it actually trickled down to ordinary Americans, unless they were investing heavily in the stock market. For ordinary workers, it wasn't a particularly prosperous time. As a result, the average American could care less if the wealthiest 1% are getting hammered by falling stocks. Some of them (particularly dems who cheered the death of David Koch recently) are glad it's happening. Dems are particularly happy that stocks are falling on Trump's watch, as was the plan all along when the stock market bubble was blown.
But this is all noise to the average American. Things that do matter to the average American... Do they have a job? Do they have food on the table? Do they have reliable transportation? These folks don't give a crap about the phony stock market. They demand real results, and dems basically ignored them for an entire decade. After Trump won, dems began wishing for economic collapse (which would crush these people) just to make Trump look bad. It will take a long time before the democratic party can win back their trust, after all the abuse they have tolerated from them.
The thread IS ABOUT THE STOCK MARKET. 401k's are common among the working middle-class and what the GOP wants everyone to do. Lessen to eliminate SS then.
So YES IT EFFECTS THE MIDDLE-CLASS. I have a very few years till retirement. The last thing we want. Is a mediocre stock market that shows sluggish returns. Not everyone (especially more average Americans with a work offered 401k) want to play roulette with moving investments around. I maintain what is to be safer less risk stocks. All feel ripples today. Sure the 2% have brokers to advise, move around and ply the market and more likely to win.
Our buying power is not increasing. The migration south bleeding still the North continues. Middle-America continues to be squeezed and one income increasingly impossible unless in depressed areas that remain so .
The last bold point gets old. Pure rhetoric that has no point in helping defend Trump.
Let's not forget it was up quite a bit when the bad news came out. So it is off highs by about 500. Like I said above somewhere though, the market is not the thing to worry about here. This was a very, very bad manufacturing number that followed a bad one last month. Manufacturing is in recession in the US now. It joins retail and agriculture. This increasingly looks like it is not going to end well.
Maybe you are not worried about the market, but the truth is that it was higher in Jan 2018 (20 months ago), than today. It has returned nothing. Yes, it is only one indicator, and now we have others like the manufacturing numbers. We also have bailouts, and skyrocketing national debt.
We are being told that the economy is red hot (better than ever before), which rings a bell from 2008 when McCain and Bush sat in front of the TV cameras and said the economy was on solid foundation. McCain actually suspended his campaign to travel to DC to make that announcement (because of "historic crisis in our financial system"). However, the collapse had already begun.
The economy was like a gallon of ice cream on Bush's lap and all he could do was watch it melt away.
"Great" economy like under Clinton/Obama would be about 12% a year.
Dow would be 31,300
Therefore it has "tanked" a vast amount below what even a good, let alone "great" or "best ever" type of economy would be.
I've been in stocks since the early 1980's and always invested for myself. My average is about 10.6 over decades.
Please....don't tell me that 3% is good. In addition, you are not addressing the actual point of the thread. That is, the Manufacturing Report and ALL of the other data.
Good job at really twisting around the intent of the thread. The OP said that the market was tanking TODAY. I was addressing that. If you think a 1% drop is tanking, you have no clue about the stock market.
I found a Breitbart article saying that the NY branch of the banking cartel known as the Federal Reserve was pumping $100 million or something into the economy. That usually means they are trying to "fix" something that is broken.
The 2008-2009 "fix" of Bush/Obama was merely a bandaid anyway. All these guys did is use some banking hocus pocus and create lots of money out of thin air, creating lots of inflation that raised the cost of living.
European nations do not annualize their quarterly GDP growth like the US does. Essentially, you need to multiply Europe's GDP numbers by 4 or divide the US's GDP numbers by 4 to get a comparable approximation.
Wow!
I didn't know that!
From the provided link...
"The Eurozone quarterly economic growth was confirmed at 0.2 percent in the second quarter of 2019, slowing from a 0.4 percent expansion in the previous period."
So it's 0.8% instead of 0.2%.
Sure am glad you cleared that up.
For a minute there I though the USA was doing WAY better than the EU.
"The Eurozone quarterly economic growth was confirmed at 0.2 percent in the second quarter of 2019, slowing from a 0.4 percent expansion in the previous period."
So it's 0.8% instead of 0.2%.
Sure am glad you cleared that up.
For a minute there I though the USA was doing WAY better than the EU.
Yeah, it's still weak, but not as weak as the numbers show.
Of course, that means the 0.8% growth at the end of 2017 was more like 3.2% annualized.
It's actually more complicated than just multiplying or dividing by 4, but that's a good approximation.
I found a Breitbart article saying that the NY branch of the banking cartel known as the Federal Reserve was pumping $100 million or something into the economy. That usually means they are trying to "fix" something that is broken.
The 2008-2009 "fix" of Bush/Obama was merely a bandaid anyway. All these guys did is use some banking hocus pocus and create lots of money out of thin air, creating lots of inflation that raised the cost of living.
First of all, no reasonable person would read, quote or learn anything from a BB article....but that said.
The economy was wrecked completely under GWB. Let's not start neutering those facts. The Great Recession was worse then the Great Depression using most measures. To quote GWB "we're gonna lose this sucker"......what was when a $1 money market stopped being worth $1. I remember the very day and I was scared too...having worked my entire life for those funds in the money market!
If there was ANY redemption to GWB...and it certainly was small compared to the crime...it was that, on the way out, he and Obama and the Fed and such started the ball rolling to "save this sucker".
Obama and Bernake and anyone with a head on their shoulders knew it would take a decade or more to work our way out of that mess...and so most of the policies were slow and deliberate. Don't rock the boat and slowly lower the inventory of foreclosed real estate. Slowly bring up the capitalization of the banks. Slowly regulate Wall Street and Banking (we should not that the GOP has fought against this even before Trump.....as if they didn't care about fixing things!)....
It was working. In every sense. That's the right way to do things. We were perhaps 80% out of the mess when Trump took office, which is why I say if he did nothing we'd be FAR ahead of the game.
But instead....he ruined things and some will be paying for decades for it. That's a big price to pay for being hardheaded or authoritarians. If the "forgotten man" wanted to spit on the bike seat so no one - including he - could ride, then he has succeeded. But I'll still be riding.
Problem is...I care about the country and others.....I know, a big negative on me!
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
