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Drink two bottles of vodka and call me in the morning. You won't be calling today, tomorrow or never. You can OD on alcohol.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WIZENC
That's why people are scared to legalized weed because they think it will have a domino effect on other drugs. It will be stupid to legalize all drugs just for the simple fact of you thinking you might save money on enforcement. Also you can OD on all the other drugs except weed. Last time I checked you can't OD off of alcohol and cigarettes.
I wonder if we decriminalize rape whether rapes will decrease? How about if we kill any kind of prohibition that creates a blackmarket, maybe that will be the way to go, no? Yeah, let's no longer have laws against anything that creates a blackmarket, let's allow everyone to walk around and do anything they wish as all the laws against anything society collectively deems harmful don't seem to stop the proscribed acts.
Last edited by Moderate Guy; 02-13-2009 at 10:39 PM..
You have to be open minded and use your brain to understand this issue. This rape example is a poor example because large criminal enterprises do not profit from rape. Rape is a violent crime that permanently scars and terrorizes the victim and the family of the victim. Smoking weed is not a violent crime and does not victimize others. However there is a trillion dollar market in prohibited drugs that the prohibition laws create. It is the prohibition that causes the gang/drug culture not the drugs themselves. Reference the crime surge associated with alcohol prohibition in the 1920's for the perfect example. Remove the prohibition and the problem becomes manageable.
There is no such trillion dollar rape market that would emerge if rape was legalized. Rape has a huge social stigma that prevents people from actively raping men/women on regular basis. In fact, in most parts of the word and many parts of the US, raping someones wife or daughter would lead you to finding a serious inter-personal repercussions outside of the legal issues. (shotgun/baseball bat to the noggin/tremendous social outcast/social untouchable)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miles
I wonder if we decriminalize rape whether rape will decrease? How about if we kill any kind of prohibition that creates a blackmarket, maybe that will be the way to go, no? Yeah, let's no longer have laws against anything that creates a blackmarket, let's allow everyone to walk around and do anything they wish as all the laws against anyting society collectively deems harmful doesn't seem to stop the proscribed acts.
You have to be open minded and use your brain to understand this issue. This rape example is a poor example because large criminal enterprises do not profit from rape. Rape is a violent crime that permanently scars and terrorizes the victim and the family of the victim. Smoking weed is not a violent crime and does not victimize others. However there is a trillion dollar market in prohibited drugs that the prohibition laws create. It is the prohibition that causes the gang/drug culture not the drugs themselves. Reference the crime surge associated with alcohol prohibition in the 1920's for the perfect example. Remove the prohibition and the problem becomes manageable.
There is no such trillion dollar rape market that would emerge if rape was legalized. Rape has a huge social stigma that prevents people from actively raping men/women on regular basis. In fact, in most parts of the word and many parts of the US, raping someones wife or daughter would lead you to finding a serious inter-personal repercussions outside of the legal issues. (shotgun/baseball bat to the noggin/tremendous social outcast/social untouchable)
I am being open minded and using my active brain - which thankfully remains so because I have not developed a craving for mind altering harmful drugs that destroy both the body and the mind.
My analysis isn't premised solely on gangs and illict money and the like - it is concerned with the lives of children growing up to be productive, healthy elements of society.
There's no price tag too high for that end result.
So are you saying that the only reason that children do not partake in huge gang rape sessions is because of government law? Children that use drugs do so because they are introduced to drugs and someone close to them are profiting from the usage. Who profits from rape? Drugs are unique in that it is the prohibition that directs provides the profits. Take away the prohibition and it is no longer in anyone's interest to have children using drugs.
It is the social mores that dictate behavior and not huge government programs. It is has been proven that prohibition directly increases drug use by creating a black market that depends on those laws. The black market monster that directly profits from the use of the drugs is the reason why usage increases. The law prohibiting the use of the drugs seem to actually increase usage. Why do more American children smoke dope than in Holland where it is legal? Take that black market monster away and the use of drugs are no longer in anybody's interest.
In the social situation where the drug black market is non-existent the social stigma attached to drug use will gain traction over the appeal of the drug itself. Remove the prohibition and the drug will lose its manager, its publicist and its entourage. The social mores against drug use are strionger than many people think. people do not like drugs and people do not like drug users, that alone is enough to curb drug usage With the lack of anybody profiting from the distribution usage will dwindle. It is the social mores that dictate behavior and not politicians.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miles
I am being open minded and using my active brain - which thankfully remains so because I have not developed a craving for mind altering harmful drugs that destroy both the body and the mind.
My analysis isn't premised solely on gangs and illict money and the like - it is concerned with the lives of children growing up to be productive, healthy elements of society.
There's no price tag too high for that end result.
So are you saying that the only reason that children do not partake in huge gang rape sessions is because of government law? Children that use drugs do so because they are introduced to drugs and someone close to them are profiting from the usage. Who profits from rape? Drugs are unique in that it is the prohibition that directs provides the profits. Take away the prohibition and it is no longer in anyone's interest to have children using drugs.
It is the social mores that dictate behavior and not huge government programs. It is has been proven that prohibition directly increases drug use by creating a black market that depends on those laws. The black market monster that directly profits from the use of the drugs is the reason why usage increases. The law prohibiting the use of the drugs seem to actually increase usage. Why do more American children smoke dope than in Holland where it is legal? Take that black market monster away and the use of drugs are no longer in anybody's interest.
In the social situation where the drug black market is non-existent the social stigma attached to drug use will gain traction over the appeal of the drug itself. Remove the prohibition and the drug will lose its manager, its publicist and its entourage. The social mores against drug use are strionger than many people think. people do not like drugs and people do not like drug users, that alone is enough to curb drug usage With the lack of anybody profiting from the distribution usage will dwindle. It is the social mores that dictate behavior and not politicians.
Don't be single-focused on the rape angle. If you re-read my posts, I challenge the rationale that one should remove laws which apparently don't proscribe behavior in general which we as a society collectively legally oppose. That rationale can lead to chaos.
But I'll tell you what - I'm so incensed by the arguments of posters like yourselves and others for the legalization of any narcotic - having witnessed the lost lives of so many colleagues and close relatives whom I cared for - that it would be best for me to depart this thread. Let's say we agree to disagree.
... I challenge the rationale that one should remove laws which apparently don't proscribe behavior in general which we as a society collectively legally oppose. That rationale can lead to chaos.
The problem is that there is a big difference between "collectively" and "legally" opposed. They are not always the same and this is where the trouble starts.
I think the reality is that we do not "collectively" oppose the use of marijuana.I don't smoke pot but I am not opposed to others doing so.My life experience has shown me that alcohol is a far more dangerous drug.
My guess would be that close to a majority or perhaps even a majority of us either smoke pot and don't think it's a big deal or don't smoke pot and don't think it's a big deal or do smoke pot and are hypocritically, publicly opposed to it.
Laws are on very shaky ground in these types of situations and can in fact do more harm than good by breeding contempt for laws in general.I spend a lot of time in Italy and one of the things you notice after a while is that there is a big gap between the laws and what people actually believe and do.This is not good and it might explain why they have such a hard time governing themselves. There are countless laws on the books that have more to do with the past relationship between the government and the church than with any real "collective opposition" to things.There is official legal opposition but little or no collective opposition on a whole host of topics. As a result,Italians blatantly laugh at and have little respect for government and go on doing whatever they want to do.After a few generations of this, kids learn from an early age there are laws and then there is reality,which is often very different.
Essentially,the whole Italian culture functions the way we did during prohibition only the mentality has spread into all facets of life .
I think that the disrespect for laws in general that this type of situation creates and the chaos that it can breed is far more dangerous.
My guess would be that close to a majority or perhaps even a majority of us either smoke pot and don't think it's a big deal or don't smoke pot and don't think it's a big deal or do smoke pot and are hypocritically, publicly opposed to it.
Aint it funny how life is.....those like me who do not fall into your categorization above are the "weirdos"; and the potheads mumbling incoherently, damaging themselves physically, emotionally, becoming a drain on their families and society in lost man-hours and wasted dreams - these and their sympathizers are the sane majority!! Wow, what a conclusion.
and the potheads mumbling incoherently, damaging themselves physically, emotionally, becoming a drain on their families and society in lost man-hours and wasted dreams - these and their sympathizers are the sane majority!! Wow, what a conclusion.
The problem here is that you go along with the social stigma that everyone who has ever smoked weed is a dropout loser. I mean, that Michael Phelps...what a loser he was!
Er...wait...he's the fastest swimmer alive. You see, not all people who smoke weed smoke it chronically. Many will use it once in a while in recreation.
And quite honestly, I'd rather deal with a pothead than with a yuppie who hasn't gotten his coffee yet.
Legalize methamphetamine and make sure the drug addicts have an unlimited supply of it. That will solve many societal problems.
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