Most anti-socialist demographic in USA the most dependant on government? (Mexicans, drug)

[GregW]

The most effective way to change the society created by the old biddies is to outlive them.

[old_cold]

Originally Posted by muleskinner

VERY TRUE!!!!! These are the exact same people that come into my store everyday talking as if they got their morning news straight from the National Inquirer...."Obama To Start House to House Gun Search"..."Obama is a Communist"...."Obama FAKE Birth Certificate FOUND AT PARIS HILTON'S HOUSE!!!!".

These guys are mostly from up north , in their 70's,retired from a middle class blue collar job and they are now living down here for the milder winters and cheap living.They are VERY "deluded" as you put it so well.Insane is closer to the truth.

THEY are the ones who ALWAYS (morning after morning after morning etc etc etc) start the "gun ban" conversations that have no merit or the "big tax,big gov't" conversation and then leave out and get in a pickup truck that has a faded "W" or Bush/Cheney sticker on the back window and never realize how truly backwards and stupid that they really are.

I DO feel sorry for them tho' because the world has changed while they were out working all day,everyday for years on end to look forward to what they are doing right this second and now nothing makes sense to them and they view everyone else as crazy.Bad deal.

Funny! I have known idiots like that all my life and they were young people then.
And idiot is an idiot.....don't lump them them in with the rest of us please.
Even funnier....when it came to finances, they were generally in favor of liberal policies!

[KevK]

Originally Posted by old_cold

If the government wasn't in charge of our health care program we wouldn't have to be concerned with this to begin with.
Generally, once the government starts something, there are no true fixes to the screwups....just one bandaid after another.

Acn you say the same about the huge amount that goes to red states in the form of farm subsidies?? Let's cut out all farm subsidies and open all the agri markets to "free trade" and then we can measure in DAYS how long the American farmer will last when all the cheap sugar, fruit and meat start pouring over the borders! Let's see if we can get the Republicans to go along with that!

[sweetclimber]

Originally Posted by Bluefly

To the larger point, it is interesting that a lot of conservatives look at the "blue states" as welfare states, yet the blue states are in reality the economic engines of our nation, generating far more tax revenue than they take in while red states top the list for taking in far more tax revenue than they generate.

The constant attacks from conservatives about 'socialism' (which seems to be equated with horrible places to live, like Finland and Switzerland ) is akin to atheists who constantly go after extreme religious Biblical literalists fundamentalists to make their point. It's just too easy and not really representative

Most "liberals" live in cosmopolitan, global economies and recognized long ago that there is an inherent value in, for example, having government run fire departments and provide libraries and make sure their neighbor 20 feet away doesn't build a monstrosity that ruins the neighborhood and perhaps provide for a neighbor in Mississippi who might need a helping hand for a while.

Career welfare is horrific, but helping people - or multinational banks - out for a few years while they get back on their feet seems reasonable for the greater good.

Texas is the second most powerful state in America economically and it is solidly conservative (red).

[GregW]

I am glad I have counted on a pension and social security for my retirement because if I had invested enough money into the market to provide for my old age my dreams would have been shattered and I would be faced with near poverty. Instead, I will have enough money to be confortable. Not extravagant, but not one prescription from the poorhouse (do they exist anymore?)

[GregW]

Problem with allowing "agriculture to die" in this country is that we could starve if the trade died for whatever reason. I agree with subsidized Farmer Brown enough that he is willing to do the work needed but I am not willing to subsidize corporately owned farms being used as tax shelters or ADM.

[Bluefly]

Originally Posted by sweetclimber

Texas is the second most powerful state in America economically and it is solidly conservative (red).

It's a general trend supported by statistics, not an absolute. I also don't know whether Texas produces more tax revenue than it takes in.

The larger point stands.

[KevK]

Originally Posted by Bluefly

^
I do have sympathy for such people. When I watched the Sarah Palin rallies, what you're seeing is the last stand of a crowd that is in no way psychologically prepared for a global economy, a multi-cultural society, or a society where political boundaries naturally fade as our national differences become about as important as the difference of living in Utah rather than North Carolina (not much).

This is a very scary time for these people and you're seeing their fear manifest on these forums. They go on and on about big government or small, but that's not what it's really about. Reagan ran up the biggest deficits in history and then Bush did as well, expanding government in unprecedented ways. Both sides are big government, it's just a question of whether you want that government building bombs or wind turbines with your money.

What they're really scared of is losing their way of life. They see the power concentrated in the major cities and along the coasts, becoming more cosmopolitan in culture and economy and they can't control it.

This is a common trait throughout history. Many were deathly fearful of the United States forming and taking away the colonies by which many had previously defined themselves. Now, their ideological descendants proudly define themselves by the borders of the United States and are fearful of a globalizing society beyond that - thus the cries to build walls and military bases along the border.

Some day, people will have the same fears of transitioning from just an earth-based society to an intergalactic one. But, we'll make the transition anyway and they will eventually come along. They always do.

I honestly think that most of these folks mean any harm. They were just raised up in a time of depression and wars and a different set of norms. They do not really "hate" anybody but they just are set in their ways and they do not understand ours. And when they see an old white guy (McCain) up there waving the flag and Bible, that is something they can identify with. A black man as President is not something they can identify with. I remember when one of my relatives (in her 90s now) told me when she was in the hospital some years ago that "oh, they have a coloured (what the old people call black people) doctor here" as if she never expected to see such a thing.
She doesn't hate black people. She just came along in a different time and has a different set of ideals and beliefs about what "normal" is. And what is "normal" to these folks is the 30s and 40s. Anything after about 1955 is not normal to them. Leather jackets, the twist, rock and roll, blue jeans, 57 Chevys- they opposed all that too. Then long hair and the 70s were a disaster for them. And now openly gay people on TV and a black President???? That just overloads their circuits a bit too much!

[ReefAreCoolToo]

this is just ****ing stupid baseless arguement...

Older folks that been working all their life, yes deserved to received social security and medicare and such from the government. They already did their time. What's wrong with that? Most of them folks are the backbone that built this country of today......not all but a lot of them.

On the other hand, handing out $ to the fools that never works in their life, depending on welfare, having multiple kids and having the sense of entitlement and some chip in their shoulder that the world owed them....is wrong!

[Bluefly]

Originally Posted by KevK

I honestly think that most of these folks mean any harm. They were just raised up in a time of depression and wars and a different set of norms. They do not really "hate" anybody but they just are set in their ways and they do not understand ours. And when they see an old white guy (McCain) up there waving the flag and Bible, that is something they can identify with. A black man as President is not something they can identify with. I remember when one of my relatives (in her 90s now) told me when she was in the hospital some years ago that "oh, they have a coloured (what the old people call black people) doctor here" as if she never expected to see such a thing.
She doesn't hate black people. She just came along in a different time and has a different set of ideals and beliefs about what "normal" is. And what is "normal" to these folks is the 30s and 40s. Anything after about 1955 is not normal to them. Leather jackets, the twist, rock and roll, blue jeans, 57 Chevys- they opposed all that too. Then long hair and the 70s were a disaster for them. And now openly gay people on TV and a black President???? That just overloads their circuits a bit too much!

That's a good point. I have an uncle in his mid-80s. He basically is the Clint Eastwood character in Gran Torino.

My Mom once asked me, "How come his comments about blacks and gays don't bother you?"

I told her because he comes from a different era and I respect that the world was a very different place when he was growing up. He's an incredibly loving man who would do anything for his family and has. There's a great deal I have learned from him, even if he doesn't want to live next to black people.

One day he just looked at me with a look of true astonishment and simply said about my life and values, "The world is so different today." It wasn't hostile, just outside his realm of experience.