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Old 08-19-2009, 09:20 PM
 
3,292 posts, read 4,473,578 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shorebaby View Post
If you also gave private insurance the right to print US currency too that would be fine. How can any private company compete with the government that has unlimited funds? It simply isn't a fair fight.
Well, then don't bring the regulation issue up as an argument if you're not going to bother answering my question, you are remarkably intellectually dishonest.
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Old 08-19-2009, 09:43 PM
 
15,446 posts, read 21,349,093 times
Reputation: 28701
Quote:
Originally Posted by dorock99 View Post
Personally, i think there is going to be a lot of room for private third party insurance companies willing to do all the paper-work and leg work for the government plan. Otherwise, i highly doubt government will be able to effectively compete with private companies in offering medical care. Prices maybe lower, but if the services is inferior to major providers, they will be viewed as a medical insurer of last resort.
The Post Office did okay at first but it was their later failures that caused the evolution of FedEx, UPS and the other package deliverers. However, where that was a case of private industries evolving because of Federal government failure, in this case, we are dumping a huge competitor right in the middle of established industries. I also believe the Federal government will do great at first but that is all it will take to drive private health care providers out of business. By the time public health care gets to the current sad condition of medicare, SS, and the Post Office, there won't be any private health care providers left.

I also believe that the new law will not allow you to easily move back and forth between the public and private options. I base this on the fact that retired Civil Servants are not allowed to give up their government health insurance even for a month without losing it altogether. Congress will seek to protect the public option just as they now protect the current Civil Service health plans. That is the sort of competitive advantage that no private industry can compete with because it's like a one-way mouse trap with the government plan being the inside of the trap and private industry being the outside, i.e., everyone eventually ends up inside.
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Old 08-19-2009, 10:25 PM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
17,531 posts, read 24,693,227 times
Reputation: 9980
Quote:
Originally Posted by shorebaby View Post
Oh not that old saw again. I would be very happy to have SS go away. I think I could do better than 2% return a year, I could pass it on to my heirs, and I don't have to worry about the fund going belly up.

I also think Medicare should be optional. What is with the left they want choice in universal healthcare but none for the elderly. Why is that?
But when everyone opts out both Social Security and Medicare collapse. Tens of millions of seniors are thrown onto welfare while losing their homes to Medical Bills


http://www.wickedsunshine.com/WagePeace/Consumerism/Images/AmericanFlag-Adbusters-BigCorporateFlag.gif (broken link)

The Republican Flag
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Old 08-19-2009, 10:25 PM
 
2,654 posts, read 5,465,073 times
Reputation: 1946
Quote:
Originally Posted by AeroGuyDC View Post
As a conservative, I find myself on the fence regarding the "public option." On one hand, I want all American's to have access to affordable health insurance, and I am also slightly offended by the obscene profits that insurance companies often make. I am especially offended by these profits while they turn away those with pre-existing conditions. Insuring the healthy appears to be the driving goal because its a cash cow for Big Insurance.

On the other hand, I don't believe government is being straight with us over who will pay for the "public option." As a result, I am not convinced that taxes won't be raised on the middle class. Further, history has shown that government cannot be trusted to draft, enact, and manage entitlement programs efficiently.

Therefore, I am on the fence on this issue. Where do other conservatives stand?
If its good enough for the rest of the first world, its good enough for us. Bring on Single payer UHC as far as this GOP'er is concerned.
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Old 08-20-2009, 12:05 AM
 
Location: Portlandia "burbs"
10,229 posts, read 16,297,759 times
Reputation: 26005
Personally, I think more focus and investigation needs to go into WHY healthcare costs so much. I'm amazed at how over-looked this is.

Depending on "where", higher-ranked nurses can make $50 an hour, if not more. I've had many typical office visits run damn near $200. Why????

Personally, I think doctors and clinics and hospitals charge what they do because they know they can!!! And the insurance companies go along and pay it.
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Old 08-20-2009, 12:17 AM
 
3,292 posts, read 4,473,578 times
Reputation: 822
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesbabe View Post
Personally, I think more focus and investigation needs to go into WHY healthcare costs so much. I'm amazed at how over-looked this is.

Depending on "where", higher-ranked nurses can make $50 an hour, if not more. I've had many typical office visits run damn near $200. Why????

Personally, I think doctors and clinics and hospitals charge what they do because they know they can!!! And the insurance companies go along and pay it.
No, they charge that because the insurance company bargains the price down.
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Old 08-20-2009, 12:58 AM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
2,553 posts, read 2,435,555 times
Reputation: 495
Quote:
Originally Posted by AeroGuyDC View Post
As a conservative, I find myself on the fence regarding the "public option." On one hand, I want all American's to have access to affordable health insurance, and I am also slightly offended by the obscene profits that insurance companies often make. I am especially offended by these profits while they turn away those with pre-existing conditions. Insuring the healthy appears to be the driving goal because its a cash cow for Big Insurance.
It's not a cash cow....it's an extremely risky type of insurance to be invoved in....life, accident, property & casualty, etc. are all much safer, predictable.....more stable with consistent profit. Many health insurers are out of the market now.....what you have left are a few big HMO's getting the lion's share of the group market. It's not obscene profits....you have to compare profit to the size of the business....the amount of money it operates on. If they're a national HMO, don't expect millions for profit.....a million could disappear from one patient with a serious illness.

You look at A.M. Best (all they do is rate insurers) ratings for a life insurance company and you'll see that any one worth getting a policy from is A++ (as high as you can get). If you look up a health insurance company, many won't be rated because they're not insurance companies.....HMO's....but, those that are will have ratings in the B's and even C's. I don't know if you'll even find one that's an A, A+ or A++....you'll be lucky to find an A- because they're not a cash cow.

You want pre-existing conditions covered....check out the rates here in NY state where it's mabdated that they cover them:

Premium Rates for HMO Standard Individual Health Plans by County

That page is part of the NY Department of Insurance's website. Look at some of those rates.....$4,000/month for family coverage!!! That's not because of profits....that's the cost of medical care!
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Old 08-20-2009, 05:29 AM
 
Location: Hoboken
19,890 posts, read 18,749,261 times
Reputation: 3146
Quote:
Originally Posted by FinkieMcGee View Post
Well, then don't bring the regulation issue up as an argument if you're not going to bother answering my question, you are remarkably intellectually dishonest.
It is a piece of the puzzle. You don't think there is more than one factor affecting competition? Re you suggesting that there is only one argument for each position? So there is only one reasone why you want a single payer system and if that were met by some other means you would be satisfied? The only thing dishonest is your argument.
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Old 08-20-2009, 05:32 AM
 
Location: Hoboken
19,890 posts, read 18,749,261 times
Reputation: 3146
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boompa View Post
But when everyone opts out both Social Security and Medicare collapse. Tens of millions of seniors are thrown onto welfare while losing their homes to Medical Bills




The Republican Flag

Ok calm down with the flag already. Do you need to include it in every post? It is pretty sophmoric. Now don't be silly. There is certainly a mechanism to gradually phase out SS so those who have planned their retirement around it will not be left out in the cold.
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Old 08-20-2009, 06:15 AM
 
3,566 posts, read 3,732,646 times
Reputation: 1364
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jill61 View Post
Yes, why don't we let someone more knowledgeable about the health insurance industry enlighten us.



http://commerce.senate.gov/public/_files/PotterTestimonyConsumerHealthInsurance.pdf (broken link)
Like I said it wasn't my intention to defend insurance company business practices. But that wasn't the issue I was addressing. I was focusing on insurance company profits and whether their profits were a valid reason to vilify them. The information you posted is irrelevant to that issue.
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