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I’m not sober at the moment and I’m very tired so I apologize in advance if my response isn’t as clear as I’d prefer:
I didn't say that the service sector alone is the answer, I also mentioned more high-tech industries. Manufacturing industries which require advanced technology, substantial capital investments, highly skilled workers, etc. are ideal for developed countries because the barriers to entry are still to high for medium-income, newly industrialized countries. This is one reason you've probably seen an emphasis on so-called green jobs in the media as of late. If the government were to get serious about it, the US could become a major producer of 'green technologies' (think windmills, solar panels, etc.). Other high-tech industries could also be developed. 'Lower-tech' industries, such as automobiles, have fewer barriers to entry which means that medium-income countries are more able to develop them and since their labor costs are lower it becomes economically efficient to allow them to produce those goods rather than us.
The problem is that such high-tech industries often require favorable governmental policies to get started and these are the types of policies that the US has been slow to implement (which is one reason we have 'lost out' in the race to develop many high-tech industries to countries like Japan). For one, we need to invest much more in R&D: the private sector is terrible at doing this, the risks are just too high, and the benefits too diffuse, for it to be cost effective. We also need to reform our education system so that more individuals have the opportunity to get an education, so that there is more incentive to go into the hard sciences, mathematics and engineering and so that the quality of our education system improves. Unfortunately, our elementary and secondary education system is not up to par anymore. We also need a better system of life-long education; because of the rapidity with which industries are rising and dying we need to become more adept at providing worker ‘retraining’ to those who may be middle-aged but have lost their jobs. In other words, we should have programs set up specifically to train those who have lost jobs as a result of outsourcing for other jobs.
Another area that could provide jobs to those who have lost their livelihoods to outsourcing is infrastructure investment. US infrastructure, as you probably know, is in sorry shape. Roads are crumbling, bridges are structurally unsound, water systems are In disrepair… We need better, more efficient power plants, windmills, etc. Substantial government investments in these areas could provide jobs for a significant number of people for a long period of time. Such improvements in infrastructure would further promote related industries/suppliers thus creating more jobs. Unfortunately, it’s often difficult to get political support for government provided investments due to fear of ‘big government.’
As for the service sector, keep in mind that it is comprised of a lot more than just financial services. Healthcare, education, tourism, restaurants, information technologies, consulting, etc. are all parts of the service sector. As I already said, we need to overhaul our education system so that more people have more opportunities at more stages in their life; this would lead to major increases in employment in education. Clearly healthcare can also be expanded substantially. Many service sector jobs are not easily outsourced. Government support for education, healthcare, tourism and such could all help stimulate job growth here. A more highly educated, better skilled workforce would allow us to expand information technologies jobs, accounting, etc. as well.
I want to be clear that what I've said is, in all honesty, a gross oversimplification of what's really going on. The global economy is extraordinarily complex and the changes occurring in it due to technological innovation are happening at an unprecedentedly fast pace. The take-away point is that developed countries simply are not going to be able to cling to low-tech manufacturing jobs forever unless they want their economies to weaken and fall behind. Flexibility is the key here. Developed countries that are willing to make the necessary investments, which are highly adaptable in the policy tools they choose to use, which are not afraid of shedding industries in which they have lost their comparative advantage despite intense political pressures to protect them are going to be the winners in the coming decades.
It’s important to recognize that the only policy tools that can slow outsourcing (import/export quotas, tariffs, subsidies, etc) are economically inefficient; they provide concentrated benefits but much greater, though highly diffuse, costs. These policies tend to hurt consumers to aid producers (and their employees) by causing inflated prices. They distort markets and are, in the end, unsustainable. They will certainly work in the short-term but they will retard innovation, allowing other countries to develop and expand their leads.
I'm not interested in your responses to other posts...just this one. Do you realize that taxes and labor a part of the cost of doing business or did you misspeak on the issue, here;
To be honest, and I feel a bit bad in retrospect, I was actually just mocking you because you made two simple statements without elaborating on either and without connecting them. I knew what you were trying to say, I was just being a jerk. For that, I apologize. My comment about the textbook was really a means of saying that your theory about corporate taxes and unions was... highly flawed, that it was far too simplistic. The reason I asked you about my other posts is because those were really much more proper responses to what you were trying to argue.
So what's the answer? I see a lot of attacks from liberals critical of corporations,...so please inform us about the solution. Should government FORCE corporations to stay in America REGARDLESS of government policy toward that sector? Should government simply nationalize corporations and run them? Should corporations just pay taxes and not worry about the bottom line,...profits,...or returns for their stockholders?
Please explain.
And I see a lot of "conservative" apologists for the companies who sent their jobs overseas to make greater profit.
Some people support the profit margin over what's good for the country in general.
...apparently most think it's fine to lose jobs and corporations to overseas countries instead of trying to keep jobs incountry. That will be OK until everyone figures out that EVERYBODY can't sit on their collective butts on the government dole if there are no taxpayers left. When corporations leave, many jobs follow them. Therefore America loses both corporate AND personal income taxes.
Who ever said that?
This has been going on for decades, many of us have been against this since the onset.
Just seems silly that those of you who have had their head in the sand for decades are screaming now.
Don't know where you get your source of news, but obviously you didn't listen to steel companies and workers in the 1970's. They've been complaining at that time!!!
I was raised in Pittsburgh; I know about the steel industry.
That complaining went away and this issue hasn't been seriously addressed in years.
I’m not sober at the moment and I’m very tired so I apologize in advance if my response isn’t as clear as I’d prefer:
Hey, pretty good for a drunk guy. That one post has more sense in it than some of these folks manage to put up in a month. Hope some of them will actually read it...
And I see a lot of "conservative" apologists for the companies who sent their jobs overseas to make greater profit.
Some people support the profit margin over what's good for the country in general.
It seems that you're in good company,...no other liberal has attempted to answer question that has been posed numerous times. Instead of attacking 'conservative apologists',...why not outline your solution for the problem of losing corporations to other countries, and all the associated taxes/spending that disappears when they move. Nationalization? Government-run competition? Force the corporations to stay?
I've read the theory that manufacturing has shrunk in all countries,....which makes the loss of a major corporation like Emerson even MORE important. Larger fish swimming in a progressively smaller pond has a larger impact when lost......
When I started my own businesses, I had an old friend who once gave me a good piece of advice,..." No one can TAKE your business from you,...but if you LOSE it, someone will be there to grab it. It's much easier to protect your business association than to try to get it back once it is gone"..........
I was raised in Pittsburgh; I know about the steel industry.
That complaining went away and this issue hasn't been seriously addressed in years.
Well then your original quote:
Quote:
Could have fooled me since no one complained until after 20 Jan 2009.
was 100% wrong, you have to admit.
BTW, I grew up in Johnstown, PA. The reason the complaining went away was because the US steel industry was purely destroyed and 90% of the people who could complain either left town for another job (like me and my brother) or retired early (dad), went nuts, or died. It was like a virtual "nuclear economic bomb" went off in that town. Johnstown is now economically dead compared to what it was like in the 1960's. I notice virtually all the steel industry is also gone in Pittsburgh when I drive through there.
On a side note, I don't trust government statistics. If you look at unemployment rates since 1990 for Cambria county, it doesn't look that bad - certainly not worse than average for the country. However, the reason it's not bad is most of the people left town! It's a ghost town relative to what it was when I grew up there in the 1960s!
I’m not sober at the moment and I’m very tired so I apologize in advance if my response isn’t as clear as I’d prefer:
I didn't say that the service sector alone is the answer, I also mentioned more high-tech industries. Manufacturing industries which require advanced technology, substantial capital investments, highly skilled workers, etc. are ideal for developed countries because the barriers to entry are still to high for medium-income, newly industrialized countries. This is one reason you've probably seen an emphasis on so-called green jobs in the media as of late. If the government were to get serious about it, the US could become a major producer of 'green technologies' (think windmills, solar panels, etc.). Other high-tech industries could also be developed. 'Lower-tech' industries, such as automobiles, have fewer barriers to entry which means that medium-income countries are more able to develop them and since their labor costs are lower it becomes economically efficient to allow them to produce those goods rather than us.
The problem is that such high-tech industries often require favorable governmental policies to get started and these are the types of policies that the US has been slow to implement (which is one reason we have 'lost out' in the race to develop many high-tech industries to countries like Japan). For one, we need to invest much more in R&D: the private sector is terrible at doing this, the risks are just too high, and the benefits too diffuse, for it to be cost effective. We also need to reform our education system so that more individuals have the opportunity to get an education, so that there is more incentive to go into the hard sciences, mathematics and engineering and so that the quality of our education system improves. Unfortunately, our elementary and secondary education system is not up to par anymore. We also need a better system of life-long education; because of the rapidity with which industries are rising and dying we need to become more adept at providing worker ‘retraining’ to those who may be middle-aged but have lost their jobs. In other words, we should have programs set up specifically to train those who have lost jobs as a result of outsourcing for other jobs.
Another area that could provide jobs to those who have lost their livelihoods to outsourcing is infrastructure investment. US infrastructure, as you probably know, is in sorry shape. Roads are crumbling, bridges are structurally unsound, water systems are In disrepair… We need better, more efficient power plants, windmills, etc. Substantial government investments in these areas could provide jobs for a significant number of people for a long period of time. Such improvements in infrastructure would further promote related industries/suppliers thus creating more jobs. Unfortunately, it’s often difficult to get political support for government provided investments due to fear of ‘big government.’
As for the service sector, keep in mind that it is comprised of a lot more than just financial services. Healthcare, education, tourism, restaurants, information technologies, consulting, etc. are all parts of the service sector. As I already said, we need to overhaul our education system so that more people have more opportunities at more stages in their life; this would lead to major increases in employment in education. Clearly healthcare can also be expanded substantially. Many service sector jobs are not easily outsourced. Government support for education, healthcare, tourism and such could all help stimulate job growth here. A more highly educated, better skilled workforce would allow us to expand information technologies jobs, accounting, etc. as well.
I want to be clear that what I've said is, in all honesty, a gross oversimplification of what's really going on. The global economy is extraordinarily complex and the changes occurring in it due to technological innovation are happening at an unprecedentedly fast pace. The take-away point is that developed countries simply are not going to be able to cling to low-tech manufacturing jobs forever unless they want their economies to weaken and fall behind. Flexibility is the key here. Developed countries that are willing to make the necessary investments, which are highly adaptable in the policy tools they choose to use, which are not afraid of shedding industries in which they have lost their comparative advantage despite intense political pressures to protect them are going to be the winners in the coming decades.
It’s important to recognize that the only policy tools that can slow outsourcing (import/export quotas, tariffs, subsidies, etc) are economically inefficient; they provide concentrated benefits but much greater, though highly diffuse, costs. These policies tend to hurt consumers to aid producers (and their employees) by causing inflated prices. They distort markets and are, in the end, unsustainable. They will certainly work in the short-term but they will retard innovation, allowing other countries to develop and expand their leads.
Thanks for the clarification! I pretty much agree with everything you've posted here.
Quote:
We also need to reform our education system so that more individuals have the opportunity to get an education, so that there is more incentive to go into the hard sciences, mathematics and engineering and so that the quality of our education system improves.
I've seen first hand how the junior high / high school education today is compared to what I've had. Although they talk the "science / math" talk, what schools really need to walk the science walk and get kids excited about the subject. They need to get more "hands on" with respect to various science subjects. Once in a while one teacher will do this, but most just teach to the textbook. There are so many new technologies that kids can be exposed to (robotics, CNC machines), but they are either not used at all or just some "club" on the side.
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