Reason for bad Portland traffic? (Hillsboro: live, commute, highways)

[bluevelo]

Originally Posted by griz134

Portland needs to remove those red light, green lights at the bottom of the on-ramps. It's hard for a lot of cars to get up to highway speed when they have to enter from a dead stop due to a stupid red light. Cars are lined up on the ramps because they make you stop before you can enter the highwway.

Actually, the congestion on the freeway would be a LOT worse sans the ramp meters. Portland is not the only place with them.

[rhodan653]

Originally Posted by rosecitywanderer

I grew up here and the drivers make my blood boil. They get on the freeway at 30 mph and once they all do get on, they all go 55 mph and pace each other, blocking up all 3 lanes. It is beyond aggravating to the point that I only use the freeways when absolutely necessary. Taking the surface streets may increase my travel time but chances are I'll be less stressed when I do arrive. And when I do use the freeway, I get it up to at least 60 to 65 mph before the end of the ramp and when I'm on it, I don't slow down when people try to get on. I move over!

More proof that Portland drivers are complete idiots and then I promise I'm done. I was coming east on US-26 late one night around 11:30 or so and there were very few people on the road. I was using the right lane (as you should) and saw an ambulance coming up the left lane so I just stayed where I was and held my speed. The idiots behind me were pulling over and STOPPING on the freeway. Last I checked, you're only supposed to do that on surface streets. When on the freeway, just move over.

The other thing that is annoying out here is that when there is heavy freeway traffic and it is moving slowly, way too many people in the interest of "safety" leave two car lengths or more between them and the car in front of them. When traffic is moving that slowly, bunch up and make the most of the road way. The more "air" on the highway, the worse the traffic is. As long as you pay attention, you are not going rear end someone when you are only driving 25 mph. This practice in many cases results in traffic jams when there is no reason for one to exist.

[rhodan653]

Originally Posted by bluevelo

Actually, the congestion on the freeway would be a LOT worse sans the ramp meters. Portland is not the only place with them.

Just because other states think they do something (California as a example) doesn't mean they actually do anything to improve traffic flow. I would like to see real data on it as I think it is BS. Boston has virtually none of those on-ramp stop lights and I have to say that I actually think it works much better without them. Of course, people in Boston drive much, much faster as a general rule and the overall flow of traffic is far different. The lights just encourage people to be conditioned to do stupid things like stop on the on-ramp (even without a light) 100 yds prematurely to merge when they could travel farther down onto the express way and merge later and more naturally. I think some drivers do not want to "cut" people on the freeway which is a ridiculous thing to behold.

[pdxMIKEpdx]

Portland's solution on to how to remove traffic congestion is to severly limit the vehicles entering the highway instead of accomodating increased traffic flows.

Less cars means less congestion right? Brilliant!

Even the roads that carry the most traffic are in the most disrepair, and have been for decades!

Try driving down Grand, or Union/MLK, and the whole mess coming from the tunnel across the Ross Island bridge, and going the same route westbound.

The major thouroghfares should be at least "kept up", instead of the rustic potholed crappy state they are in.

With all the MAX/Streetcars/bike Lanes/ etc on other roads, I tend to believe that Portland tends to put the icing on the cake before it's done baking many ways.

If Portland would keep it's infrastucture maintained, it would be an even bettter city.

[rosecitywanderer]

However you have to remember that would go against their anti-car policies which I have been told I am a terrible person for not liking. When they make it easy (or even pleasant) to drive a car, you won't pursue alternative transportation methods. However this pro-mass transit movement may have an even more adverse affect on urban sprawl than more freeways would have ever had. Because driving downtown is a pain in the butt and getting down there via mass transit is even more so, people stick in the 'burbs which causes them to grow. Ta da!!! Urban sprawl even without a massive Los Angeles-style freeway network.

[Sarcastic_Twit]

Portland's attitude is to spend federal money instead of local money. So road improvement, or even bridge improvement, is overlooked or underfunded in lieu of MAX. There is little reason to even consider adding MAX lines except for the fact that the feds will pay most of it. The PDX to Milwaukie line includes a new bridge, but not for cars. It will cost over 2 times the amount to fix the Sellwood. Portland's cost is around $300 million while the overhaul is around $100 mil.

You get the sense that Portland isn't even trying anymore. The excuse for MAX used to be to reduce traffic and urban renewal. But the east side is getting worse, and traffic increased after MAX was built. Adding extra freeway lanes as well as more express bus lanes would have been less expensive and would have benefited more people, but would not have been paid for by the feds. There used to be express lines on the Banfield but were eliminated after MAX.

Next was to reduce sprawl. Except adding lines all the way to Hillsboro makes it easier to build places like Orenco Station. Textbooks, even the ones that say evolution is a hippie myth, teaches us that trains were what led to westward expansion, not increased density. The only places where Light Rail works is in already dense cities like in Boston, or in European cities. It's completely assbackwards for Portland.

Now the DEIS report says that the Milwaukie line won't reduce traffic, won't reduce energy consumption, and won't increase riders. Plus, the damned thing is only 7 miles long. You can petal that far.

BUT, the feds will pony up $1 billion for it. Plus the transplants eat this stuff up.

It would be sad and funny to see Obama use this as an accomplishment in a speech. "We spent $1 billion tax dollars for a Portland to Milwaukie light rail line... Wait, WTF? No, seriously, WTF?"

[shaun007miller]

[the colored caused all problems]

Wow, wait a minute. Are you saying that all the colored stoplights are the reason for bad Portland traffic? I'm so lost. Will you please explain?

[philwithbeard]

Ah, I think Hoehappa was trying to make a joke.
A joke in questionable taste, maybe, but not my call on that.

And no, the Portland On-Ramp stop & go lights are an attempt to regulate the number of cars entering the expressways so as not to cause massive rolling backups, well, ah, more rolling backups than already exist. There is a very good documentary on the whole traffic engineering bit I think it was produced by NOVA on PBS. There are very good engineering and statistical proof that those on-ramp stop & go really do aid the flow of traffic on freeways. They just need longer ramps for the merging cars to get up to speed; cars don't have V8 5.0+ liter, turbo fuel injected engines as much anymore. Sigh, I guess the days of 3-duce carbs and Hurst 4 on the floor transmissions with extra heavy duty clutch springs and thrust bearings have been over for maybe 40 years now.

[rainierman]

I used to live in Marin County, Calif. They pretty much figured it out on their own by simply avoiding the outside lane altogether, thus making the outside (right) lane only for getting in & getting out, allowing everyone to flow at 65mph, because when you have a continuous 3-lanes, drivers can easily.... never mind.. Portland doesn't even have continuous 3-lanes.

[beenhereandthere]

The exit ramps on most Portland highways (only 4, but anyway) are way too short, trying to get on the highway. Also when I lived there and had to go from Vancouver to Hillsboro for about 1 month, well, the AM commute wasn't too bad, however, coming home, was lucky if it took me 90 minutes, 2 hours on a real bad day.....