Abe Nadir from Community: accurate portrayal of Asperger's? (psychologist, anxiety, college)
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Speaking for myself, It IS harder to lie, and on so many levels, lying makes no sense.
Researchers have recently discovered that Autistic people tend to have significantly larger amygdalas than non- Autistic people.[ conversely, psychopaths usually have smaller than average amygdalas. One reason they feel no guilt] for this reason, among others, we feel guilt intensely.
Lying is, well, lying. Lying to me is excrusiatingly physically and emotionally painful. I remember as a child hearing about criminal court cases with a judge and a jury to determine the guilt or innocence of a person suspected of committing a crime. I thought this was CRAZY, because, from my perception, with my neurological wiring, if a person had committed a crime, of course they would admit it and willingly "do their time" because the feelings of guilt would be too overwhelming and being a part of justice being denied would be too terrible to withstand.
This is me though. It is not known if ALL Autistic people have the larger amygdalas. I know that because I am a breast cancer survivor, [at least so far] when my oncologist suspected it had spread to my brain, that the tests showed that my amygdala is about 20% larger and more densely packed with neurons than the average persons [more importantly, no cancer!]
Am I CAPABLE of lying? Of course. Enough so that you will never need to worry that if you ask me if the pants you are wearing make your butt look big and flabby, that I will say yes.
Let me preface these replies by stating that I have formal education in neuropsychology and neurobiology, and wrote my doctoral dissertation on aspects of the Asperger's personality. I don't offer this to boast...it's to frame my point of view and offer my credibility on the subject. I'm an Aspie, but I am also well-versed in the disorder from a clinical and research perspective.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sophie899
I don't know where the media gets this idea that people on the spectrum are "nerdy and smart" - autism is more than just a social disorder, it is a developmental disability. Most people on the spectrum do not have "genius" intellect or special abilities. Mental retardation occurs more on the spectrum than savantism.
I mean no offence, but I have some corrections.
First, 'disability' isn't appropriate clinical terminology for characterising the condition. Autism and Asperger's are neuro-developmental disorders, but many on the spectrum are not particularly functionally disabled.
Second, beware of making generalisations about people on the Autism Spectrum. While the U.S. has consolidated all four Autism Spectrum Disorders under one diagnosis, the rest of the world has not. There is some evidence that those with Asperger's Disorder actually do have a slightly higher IQ than their neurotypical counterparts, on average. MENSA is a voluntary organisation, so it's not a perfect study pool, but there is a disproportionately high percentage of people with Asperger's in MENSA relative to the general population. The same is reported by gifted and talented programmes in my home country [UK]. Also, there are centres in New York and London [just that I know of] which specialise in diagnosis and other services for Aspies with high IQ. They make a very tidy sum from that specialisation. I wouldn't imagine there would be any cause to open such centres if a healthy number of Aspies weren't intellectually gifted. High-functioning Autistics (HFAs) are also known to be quite bright.
It's only in profound Autistics that what you call 'retardation' is found [barring other contributing factors], though that notion has been challenged as adaptive tools for measuring the IQ of these individuals improve.
Third, there is a considerable difference between savantism and genius, prodigy, and giftedness. Savantism is a rare phenomenon in which someone with substantial neuro-developmental limitations has an 'island of genius' in a particular area. Plenty of people with exceptional IQ are not savants, and there are savants who are not, in all areas of intellectual measurement as quantified in an IQ test, 'genuises'.
Note: Autistics' circumscribed interests ('special interests') are not the same as the 'island of genius' of a savant. An Autistic person may have intense interest in a subject without uncommon ability.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Javier77
General question to all of you who have Aspergers/ Autism....can you lie?
The bit about not being able to lie is a myth. From research, and having participated in Autism Spectrum communities online and in person, I can tell you from experience that many Autistics can lie just fine. Some even lie compulsively.
The stereotype of Aspies and Auties as especially honest people comes from our marked tendency to be highly sensitive to justice and fairness. That doesn't mean we can't lie...it only means that many of us don't like to. That said, we often don't make good liars, for our inability to read others' nonverbal communication, or readily manipulate our own nonverbal presentation in service of a lie. Additionally, many Autistics have difficulty using their imagination to make up fictional stories, which would also make lying more difficult. And, as vicky3vicky noted, lying doesn't make much sense to many of us, as we tend to be quite logical, concrete thinkers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vicky3vicky
Researchers have recently discovered that Autistic people tend to have significantly larger amygdalas than non- Autistic people.
This is only partly true. Research from Cambridge ARC, University of Washington, Cornell University and elsewhere has only found that young children with Autism have larger amygdalae than their neurotypical counterparts. By adolescence, amygdala size in the neurotypical population catches up with or even surpasses the amygdalae of Autistics.
Autistics whose amygdalae are enlarged in adulthood are not the norm. If it occurs, it likely has naught to do with their Autism.
Last edited by Moson; 02-27-2016 at 06:31 PM..
Reason: Changed 'and' to 'or'
Additionally, many Autistics have difficulty using their imagination to make up fictional stories, which would also make lying more difficult.
Do you think this would also extend to the world of the arts, or creativity in general? Can an Aspie be a good author, poet, or screen writer, etc, activities that involve a lot of imagination and out-of-the-box thinking?
Let me preface these replies by stating that I have formal education in neuropsychology and neurobiology, and wrote my doctoral dissertation on aspects of the Asperger's personality. I don't offer this to boast...it's to frame my point of view and offer my credibility on the subject. I'm an Aspie, but I am also well-versed in the disorder from a clinical and research perspective.
I mean no offence, but I have some corrections.
First, 'disability' isn't appropriate clinical terminology for characterising the condition. Autism and Asperger's are neuro-developmental disorders, but many on the spectrum are not particularly functionally disabled.
Second, beware of making generalisations about people on the Autism Spectrum. While the U.S. has consolidated all four Autism Spectrum Disorders under one diagnosis, the rest of the world has not. There is some evidence that those with Asperger's Disorder actually do have a slightly higher IQ than their neurotypical counterparts, on average. MENSA is a voluntary organisation, so it's not a perfect study pool, but there is a disproportionately high percentage of people with Asperger's in MENSA relative to the general population. The same is reported by gifted and talented programmes in my home country [UK]. Also, there are centres in New York and London [just that I know of] which specialise in diagnosis and other services for Aspies with high IQ. They make a very tidy sum from that specialisation. I wouldn't imagine there would be any cause to open such centres if a healthy number of Aspies weren't intellectually gifted. High-functioning Autistics (HFAs) are also known to be quite bright.
It's only in profound Autistics that what you call 'retardation' is found [barring other contributing factors], though that notion has been challenged as adaptive tools for measuring the IQ of these individuals improve.
Third, there is a considerable difference between savantism and genius, prodigy, and giftedness. Savantism is a rare phenomenon in which someone with substantial neuro-developmental limitations has an 'island of genius' in a particular area. Plenty of people with exceptional IQ are not savants, and there are savants who are not, in all areas of intellectual measurement as quantified in an IQ test, 'genuises'.
Note: Autistics' circumscribed interests ('special interests') are not the same as the 'island of genius' of a savant. An Autistic person may have intense interest in a subject without uncommon ability.
The bit about not being able to lie is a myth. From research, and having participated in Autism Spectrum communities online and in person, I can tell you from experience that many Autistics can lie just fine. Some even lie compulsively.
The stereotype of Aspies and Auties as especially honest people comes from our marked tendency to be highly sensitive to justice and fairness. That doesn't mean we can't lie...it only means that many of us don't like to. That said, we often don't make good liars, for our inability to read others' nonverbal communication, or readily manipulate our own nonverbal presentation in service of a lie. Additionally, many Autistics have difficulty using their imagination to make up fictional stories, which would also make lying more difficult. And, as vicky3vicky noted, lying doesn't make much sense to many of us, as we tend to be quite logical, concrete thinkers.
This is only partly true. Research from Cambridge ARC, University of Washington, Cornell University and elsewhere has only found that young children with Autism have larger amygdalae than their neurotypical counterparts. By adolescence, amygdala size in the neurotypical population catches up with or even surpasses the amygdalae of Autistics.
Autistics whose amygdalae are enlarged in adulthood are not the norm. If it occurs, it likely has naught to do with their Autism.
I made this account just to reply to you. You sound like a neurotypical buying into media myths or a self diagnosed aspie who believes Asperger's is a part of being "intellectually gifted".
As a 27 year old person with Asperger's who was diagnosed in childhood you are very much wrong about it not being considered a developmental disability, it is. I wouldn't be getting money from the government each month if that wasn't the case. Asperger's is part of the autism spectrum, autism in a broader term is a developmental disability. My I.Q is not in the genius range and neither do I have any special talents, I have tested full scale as having an I.Q of 96 (which is average).
I have never had a job, I have never lived in my own (and never will probably) I can not drive or manage my finances, I have never even dated. I did not even complete high school. Please tell me how Asperger's is not a disability again? I am very much disabled as well as all the people with *formally diagnosed* Asperger's I have met at my local autism center. It is even a challenge for me to shower, get dressed and brush my hair - this is very common with Asperger's. I have to have a caseworker to remind me to do those things. I also have trouble with executive function and memory to the point where I have forgotten to take my asthma medications with my in my purse and have suffered an accute attack needing to be intubated and hospitalized.
Your lack of information on the seriousness of Asperger's as a disability is terrible. Where are you getting these idea from? The "Big Bang theory"
Last edited by Aspie1353; 02-29-2016 at 08:40 AM..
I made this account just to reply to you. You sound like a neurotypical buying into media myths or a self diagnosed aspie who believes Asperger's is a part of being "intellectually gifted".
As a 27 year old person with Asperger's who was diagnosed in childhood you are very much wrong about it not being considered a developmental disability, it is. I wouldn't be getting money from the government each month if that wasn't the case. Asperger's is part of the autism spectrum, autism in a broader term is a developmental disability. My I.Q is not in the genius range and neither do I have any special talents, I have tested full scale as having an I.Q of 96 (which is average).
I have never had a job, I have never lived in my own (and never will probably) I can not drive or manage my finances, I have never even dated. I did not even complete high school. Please tell me how Asperger's is not a disability again? I am very much disabled as well as all the people with *formally diagnosed* Asperger's I have met at my local autism center. It is even a challenge for me to shower, get dressed and brush my hair - this is very common with Asperger's. I have to have a caseworker to remind me to do those things. I also have trouble with executive function and memory to the point where I have forgotten to take my asthma medications with my in my purse and have suffered an accute attack needing to be intubated and hospitalized.
Your lack of information on the seriousness of Asperger's as a disability is terrible. Where are you getting these idea from? The "Big Bang theory"
My Aspie brother is very much like you. He gets government benefits for his condition, has always lived at home and has never been able to hold a job for very long. He has trouble with daily self-care tasks and also doesn’t drive, which I hear is quite common. I’ll be honest; I wouldn’t want his life. He’s a lovely person but his struggles are massive.
Despite this, I don’t think your attack on Moson is at all fair.
For example, he is right that “disability” isn’t correct clinical terminology for characterising ASD as a whole. He was responding directly to Sophie’s comment, that “Autism is more than just a social disorder, it is a developmental disability.” She wrote it as though this is the clinical perspective and true across the board, which any clinician specialising in Asperger’s can tell you it’s not—that “disability” is a more subjective term and that not all Aspies are or consider themselves to be “disabled”. Well-known authorities on Asperger’s and autism from Tony Attwood to Simon Baron Cohen and Temple Grandin have stated as much.
Moson was dead right in saying “Beware of making generalisations about people on the Autism Spectrum,” and defended against a specific comment that suggested autistics are more likely to be “mentally retarded” than intellectually gifted, which is patently false. I don’t see a problem with him pointing out his thoughts and supporting evidence, anecdotal and otherwise, to contest her statements. As the saying that’s already been posted here goes, “If you have met one person with autism, you have met ONE person with autism.” Your experience of Asperger’s is your experience. His is his. You both say you are diagnosed Aspies, and there are thousands like each of you. Autism is a SPECTRUM. I don’t see Moson’s post as suggesting a “lack of information on the seriousness of Asperger's as a disability” at all. I just see him focusing on dispelling myths and misinformation, and offering insight into another valid point of view and segment of the community. That doesn’t mean he doesn’t know about or acknowledge other segments.
In my own experience as a longtime ally of the spectrum community, I have observed a deep and unproductive divide between people who have more severe symptoms and traits that cause significant disability and those who are able to function very well. It may be why awful organisations like Autism Speaks (which is run by allistics) are the most organised and influential voices in the public square, and I find that a terrible shame. I have seen way too many instances where people whose Asperger’s is more extreme lash out at other Aspies by saying they “sound NT,” just because their experience of the disorder is different. There is nothing wrong with wanting to see more emphasis on the whole spectrum of Aspies, not just the most impaired part of it. The end result of internal resentments is that there ends up being more discrimination within your own community than you get from allistics.
There is also a difference between how Americans view Asperger's and how we have begun to view it in Britain. I don't see your country of origin listed here, but since this forum is mostly American, I'm going to guess that you live in the States. If you do, you should know that more and more people in Britain see Asperger's in its totality as a condition with many gifts as well as challenges, and a wide range of experiences of the disorder. if you don't want to be treated like you're downright "defective" I'd say this is a very good thing.
And on your comment about the self-diagnosed; I see a lot of diagnosed Aspies with severe symptoms make nasty comments about self-diagnosis. The reality is that many adults who have done extensive personal research and strongly believe they are on the spectrum don't have the money or access for professional assessment, so they can't get diagnosed. Also, you are 27 and Asperger's was in the diagnostic manuals when you were a kid. The diagnosis didn't exist on the books before the 1990s. Many older adults have lived so long without the diagnosis even being available to them that they have gradually adapted their behaviour to an extent that only a true expert can diagnose them, and true experts are both expensive and hard to find/see. That doesn't mean those people don't have Asperger's. You judging the self-diagnosed in any way for not having the benefit of a formal diagnosis is just as wrong as allistics judging you for any reason because you do have one.
Last edited by FurPan; 03-01-2016 at 11:43 AM..
Reason: misspelling
This thread seems to be netting City-Data Forum a bunch of new Aspie sign-ups! I read here a lot, but didn’t join officially until I saw this thread and the comments about self-diagnosis.
I have a family history of major mood disorders and personality disorders. I knew I was "different" from most other people from my first social awareness, and over the years I have seen close to 20 doctors and therapists in search of answers for what the heck my deal is. I’ve been diagnosed with 11 different mental illnesses, personality- and learning disorders based largely on my family history, but almost every time I saw a new doctor they would throw out my current working dx and diagnose me with something else. None of those diagnoses withstood the test of more than two professional opinions, and none of them ever felt like they really fit me.
Then I got extremely lucky, when two newly-made friends with Asperger’s came to conclusion that I am an Aspie. I did a ton of research and was **stunned** to finally see almost everything about me explained by a single condition. I happened to already be seeing a doctor for depression, and when I brought her my case for an Asperger’s diagnosis, she was seriously taken aback. She completely agrees that I have it but says she would never have come to it on her own.
But there was a catch: Since Asperger’s was rolled into Autism Spectrum Disorder in the DSM 5 in 2013, many people with a pre-existing Asperger’s diagnosis fail to qualify for the dx when re-evaluated. (So what, then? Are their very real symptoms and impairments miraculously cured?!) I didn’t fit the new criteria myself, though I did fit the bill for Asperger’s Disorder from the previous edition of the DSM. My psychiatrist was sensible enough to diagnose me based on the old criteria. She thinks from her experience that the DSM change was a huge mistake.
I am now married to one of the Aspies who first identified me and have made many Aspie friends. Nobody in my life doubts that I have Asperger’s, and my diagnosis has since led to identification and diagnosis of ASD in two other family members. But if I had gone to another doctor and been assessed based on the new ASD criteria, I wouldn’t have got the dx at all. I would have easily got it when I was a kid, but I’ve worked hard over the years to develop a convincing NT “mask” that would now make diagnosis by an unfamiliar doctor very difficult. Not to mention that I am unemployed and uninsured. The only reason I even have access to a psychiatrist is because I was suicidally depressed a couple of years ago, which made me eligible for my state’s public mental health system.
My own story makes me very sympathetic to people who are self-diagnosed. It upsets me to see any dismissal of their situation or the validity of their self-diagnosis. I would be one of them myself if things had lined up just a little bit differently for me after Asperger’s was on my radar.
I also want to chime in real quick about the IQ question. I was given both the Wechsler and Stanford-Binet batteries when I was in fourth grade, and my average score between the two was 167. My recently-diagnosed Aspie niece tested at 158, and my Aspie husband scored almost 180 on a test administered by the Air Force. I am a member of MENSA, and I can confirm that it’s loaded with diagnosed Aspies, in much greater proportion than the dx is thought to occur in the overall population. I haven’t seen enough credible data to agree that the average Aspie has a higher IQ than the average NT, but it sure sounds possible. But even if there was more data, the problem with averages in a minority population is that a decent cluster of outliers on the high end can skew the mean. So in real terms, the “average Aspie” may actually have a normal-range IQ (90-110). It is a little weird how many Aspies I know with above-average IQ, though, even outside MENSA. Seven out of the 10 Aspies I know well who have tested score over 140.
P.S. to the OP: I don’t like to lie but I can, and my husband and I both have what you would probably call “above-average” ability in art and creative writing. Abed and Sheldon are stereotypes that definitely exist in the real-life Aspie community but they are definitely not representative of us as a group.
Asperger's is Autism. New research has shown Autistics are often oxygen deprived at birth. Which is why the I.Q is much lower in Autistics consoled to regular people. I don't buy the Aspie genius/nasa/Mensa stuff as I have been around Asperger's teens and adults through volunteer work and post of them can not even tie their shoes. Repetitive interests dominates these people lives and they on average can not function in society without significant support.
Ok, I confess I opened this thread cos I suspect I could have Asperger's...
I've always been very introvert, so I was labeled as shy and a loner when I was a kid...and the infamous word "quiet" was a constant...quiet tends to be an euphemism for dumb.
I tend to obsess about a few topics, they come and go, but always have a subtle, lingering presence. I suck at social gatherings, either by being too intense, or just too indiferent.
In the IQ department, I scored 114 at age 13, and have above average skills at writing (poetry, fiction, etc).
I've seen a few chapters of the Big Bang Theory (not my cup of tea), and had no clue Sheldon was supposed to be an Aspie...I just thought he was supposed to be nerdy and weird. I dont really connect with him.
But when I saw Abe from Community, it stroke a chord...all that data dropping about pop culture, all that natural ankwardness..it feels a bit similar to my own experience.
Anyways, according to most sources, there's no cure for it , so not much to do about it, except accepting yourself and mitigate the negative symptoms by cognitive therapy and suplements like Omega 3. (a quick google search shows lots of stories about Omega 3 doing wonders for peple with autism.)
It's good to see this thread is getting so many interesting comments.
Ok, I confess I opened this thread cos I suspect I could have Asperger's...
Anyways, according to most sources, there's no cure for it , so not much to do about it, except accepting yourself and mitigate the negative symptoms by cognitive therapy and suplements like Omega 3. (a quick google search shows lots of stories about Omega 3 doing wonders for peple with autism.)
I suspected as much. Have you taken an online self-test? If not, I would suggest this one, and one of the first two listed here. If you score within range, it's worth doing some more serious reading. I highly recommend Tony Attwood's book, The Complete Guide to Asperger's Syndrome. You may also find it useful to check out one of the major online forums for people on the Spectrum. Reading about and interacting with real Aspies, in real time, is an excellent way to clarify your own situation.
There is some [mostly anecdotal] evidence that Omega 3 supplements benefit children with ASDs, but most credible research shows no more effect in Autistic adults than in neurotypicals. I'd suggest you view claims about such treatments with great scepticism, as parents of profoundly Austistic children are often desperate to find whatever help they can, and are responsible for most of what you'll find online.
You're correct that there is no cure for any Autism disorder. Recent studies by prominent Asperger's researchers like Grainne McAlonan demonstrate essential structural differences in Autistic brain [and even between Aspies and Auties], suggesting that we're dealing with something a supplement can't meaningfully address.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Javier77
Do you think this would also extend to the world of the arts, or creativity in general? Can an Aspie be a good author, poet, or screen writer, etc, activities that involve a lot of imagination and out-of-the-box thinking?
This is an excellent question. Not every Aspie experiences each hallmark symptom to the same degree. While some have great difficulty being creative, artistically, many others are accomplished artists, musicians, writers, poets, even comedians. As for ‘out-of-the-box thinking,’ Aspies without creative aptitude in the arts may be extraordinarily novel thinkers in other areas, such as science or mathematics. PayPal founder Peter Thiel has spoken about this often, as quoted in this article:
You may also find this other article very interesting, about the benefits of Asperger’s. It has a bias, but it also highlights the frustration of one representative young Aspie who seems to feel a bit like Aspie1353 does, here in this thread:
I was blessed with both scientific and artistic aptitude, but I admit that I am a statistical outlier. Most of my own challenges and blind spots are social, not creative or practical.
I made this account just to reply to you. You sound like a neurotypical buying into media myths or a self diagnosed aspie who believes Asperger's is a part of being "intellectually gifted".
Your lack of information on the seriousness of Asperger's as a disability is terrible. Where are you getting these idea from? The "Big Bang theory"
Aspie1353, I sincerely apologise if I have offended you…however, I was responding to the specific comments of others, so I was speaking with a specific focus. I absolutely agree that many Autistics suffer a great deal of disability, but as with all aspects of the human condition, Asperger’s symptoms, traits, and levels and areas of impairment occur on a curve. I appear to be quite far on one end, and you quite far on the other. But to be frank, I am weary of my entire half of the curve being ignored, as NTs paint all Aspies with the broad brush of tragic disability. I have many diagnosed Aspie friends who are also more like me than how you describe yourself, some with diagnoses directly from the Autism Research Centre at Cambridge, true experts on the condition. I’m not ‘buying into’ anything, and I get my ideas from credible sources. There is simply more than one side to the coin.
I take very strong umbrage at the implication that I sound like I’m neurotypical. Rather, I sound like someone who isn’t willing to throw the baby out with the bathwater and call my neurology a sad mistake of nature, ignoring the growing body of evidence and understanding that our condition is one of enormous scope...not to mention a great many individuals who enjoy a number of advantages to their condition, which offset the liabilities.
You may have a tested IQ of 96, but that doesn’t preclude the possibility that Aspies as a group may have higher-than-average intellectual capacity. The plural of ‘anecdote’ is not ‘data’, and actual data is gradually leaning in a particular direction. That doesn’t leave you in the dirt…it makes you part of a very interesting and diverse family that we can both advocate for together, each from our own experience.
Relatedly, please don’t alienate Aspies like me with attacks. I am your fellow and ally, and argue quite forcefully on a regular basis for better services, support, and understanding for other Autistics who didn’t get quite so lucky in the hand the Universe dealt them. Push Aspies like me away and you’ll have to rely entirely on NT authorities who can’t truly understand any of your experience at all. I sought a PhD for the purpose of helping my community…all of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FurPan
Despite this, I don’t think your attack on Moson is at all fair.
In my own experience as a longtime ally of the spectrum community, I have observed a deep and unproductive divide between people who have more severe symptoms and traits that cause significant disability and those who are able to function very well.
Thank you for your kind defence.
Yes, there most certainly is a division between these camps. It doesn’t bode well for us ever having our own united voice as a community, and it genuinely distresses me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FurPan
The reality is that many adults who have done extensive personal research and strongly believe they are on the spectrum don't have the money or access for professional assessment, so they can't get diagnosed. Also, you are 27 and Asperger's was in the diagnostic manuals when you were a kid. The diagnosis didn't exist on the books before the 1990s. Many older adults have lived so long without the diagnosis even being available to them that they have gradually adapted their behaviour to an extent that only a true expert can diagnose them, and true experts are both expensive and hard to find/see. That doesn't mean those people don't have Asperger's.
This, this, this.
Add to your list these other barriers to diagnosis:
(1) There is no standard diagnostic tool for diagnosing adults with Asperger’s, ASDs are barely discussed in the educational curriculums for mental health professionals, and most clinicians don’t see enough autistics in their practises to make a nuanced diagnosis.
(2) Based on data, anecdotal evidence from the clinical community, and my own case, the majority of adult, self-identified Autistics seeking diagnosis have previously-diagnosed comorbid conditions, with symptoms which overlap with ASDs. As a result, less-experienced evaluators are prone to mistaking genuine cases of ASD for an illusion created by the sum of a patient’s other disorders.
(3) Similarly, many adults with significant history of mental illness in their families have significant difficulty getting diagnosed with an ASD, as clinicians immediately attribute their symptoms to other diagnoses that align with family history.
(4) The clinical criteria only describe a small portion of Autistic traits and symptoms. While an individual may not experience enough of those few ‘official’ symptoms with obvious clinical severity [at least three must meet that rather subjective test], they may experience many others not listed in the DSM or ICD quite markedly, making the diagnosis clear when a knowledgeable clinician examines the Big Picture. There are relatively few clinicians who are equipped to do that.
I could go on.
The bottom line is, if a person has done their research and is certain the Aspie shoe fits, who is anyone [especially another lay person] to doubt them? Our medical systems are imperfect, ASDs are not typical ‘mental health’ conditions, research of ASDs is relatively new and producing new information regularly, and there is no objective medical test to determine ASDs. Thus, to my mind, self-identification is just as valuable a tool as anything a doctor has at their disposal.
Last edited by Moson; 03-02-2016 at 04:32 AM..
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