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This is a long complicated story involving one of my nieces. I'll give you a little history of her situation because it very well might be part of the current problem. It's a complicated situation with her because my sister lost custody of her when she was around 1 to her in-laws. My parents considered fighting but realized my niece was better off away from my sister.
My sister was given supervised visitation every 2 weeks and did not take advantage of that. So my niece stayed with my parents every two weeks. Her other grandparents are pretty well off financially and like my niece once told me, they are filthy rich and spoiled the f&ck out of me. I'm glad they got to raise me.
So living with wealthy grandparents and every two weeks visiting her other grandparents who were not as wealthy but seemed to be trying very hard to compete and she always managed to get what she wanted. As a little kid when she would be at my parents I would stop over to visit. From a very young age she was a story teller. Very factually she would tell a long detailed story that seemed believable. Many times the story ended with, "Just kidding". Nobody thought much of it at the time. She was just a little kid telling stories. But she grew up.
At age 17 she out of the blue wanted to move in with my mother for her senior year of school. Dad passed away a few years ago and mom gets lonely and was happy to have her. I live very near and am there nearly everyday to do the yard work and whatever mom needs help with. I noticed she still tells stories but they don't end with a just kidding. My mother is allergic to cats but my niece brought a cat home one day and told a long story about how her friend had to go visit relatives for two weeks and wanted her to cat sit and if she didn't watch the cat they were going to have it put down before they leave. A month later I asked about her friend. She said she knew grandma would probably say no so she kinda lied. Over the next year 4 cats and 5 dogs were stinking up the house.
Then about half way through the school year she said she had to quit school because everyone hated her. When asked what happened so suddenly for everyone to hate her so bad. Her story was one of the kids in school had a party one weekend and there was booze and drugs there (but she didn't have any of course) and the party got busted by the cops and before the cops came in everyone was told to lie and when the cops took her into a different room and asked her where the booze and drugs came from she got nervous and told the truth. She said one of the kids dad bought the alcohol and cocaine for the party. That kids dad happens to be a cop. Now for some reason, my mother believes every word the kid says. When I heard what had allegedly happened I asked why the police did not call my mother. She was at the time the kids legal guardian and the kid was 17. I'm pretty sure it's not legal for the police to bust a party and take the kids one by one into a different room of the house the party is at. I never got an answer.
The kid can act very sweet but she has a vicious side when she wants to show it. The story I heard from several of her classmates was, she viciously started picking on one of the girls in her class. I don't know why she targeted that girl but the girl was very depressed partly because her older brother had cancer and was close to the end. My niece kept telling her she was worthless and ugly and should go ahead and kill herself and get it over with. My niece was the new girl in class and the one she was picking on was well liked and popular and the rest of the class turned on her and she quit school. My mom still believes the cop buying booze and drugs story.
My mom for some reason will not accept or believe anything bad about the kid. Some of her stories involve her needing money for this or that. Shortly after quitting school she needed $800 because she had a job that her boss needed her to do half the country away and it was an emergency and if she didn't go he would lose his business and he couldn't bring her money because his wife was having a baby but will pay her $2000 when she gets back and without question mom wrote the check. From what I can tell, she has managed to get over $20,000 from my mom. That is money I know she can't afford.
There's more but this is enough to see that the kid isn't a normal typical kid telling little lies as kids do. A cop buying booze for a minor would be a career ending thing for a cop. Her lies are becoming dangerous. She feels no remorse for any of the things she says or does. If anyone says anything about the money she is swindling from her grandmother she just says, I'm a kid, I've had a ****ty life because of my mom and dad, I deserve to have fun and do what I want and whatever your game is just get this, I've been at this a long time so you don't stand a chance.
Another family member told her that swindling an elderly person out of money is a crime so you should probably stop it. Her reply was, bring it. My grand parents are filthy rich and can afford the best lawyers and I will win.
Mom denies giving her as much money as she does but she also has me help balance her checking account. I doubt my 77 year old mother spends $500 every so often on itunes or eats at Taco Johns 6 days per week. The kid needed a new car and it couldn't wait so mom co-signed for her, made the down payment for her and paid the first 6 months insurance. There were several transfers from moms account to hers every month for a while and the amount varied. She was overdrawing her account every month usually between $400 and $800. The car was recently repoed. She didn't make one single payment on the car. She also got mad at mom because she wanted another car and moms credit is tanked because of the last one.
To me this seems like a symptom of something bigger. It's sad that neither of the grandparents looked into getting her some help while she was a minor. My personal feelings are neither side wanted to admit there was a problem with her because, well, her dad is just as messed up as my sister so both sides could point the finger and say she's this way because of your kid.
I'm at a loss. If you read this and have some insight I'd appreciate it. I fear there is no way to get help now unless she escalates things even more and someone gets hurt or worse. She has an over inflated sense of herself. Nothing is ever her fault. She is quick to point out and over exaggerate things that others do. Mom is the victim here and won't admit it.
This is a long complicated story involving one of my nieces. I'll give you a little history of her situation because it very well might be part of the current problem. It's a complicated situation with her because my sister lost custody of her when she was around 1 to her in-laws. My parents considered fighting but realized my niece was better off away from my sister.
My sister was given supervised visitation every 2 weeks and did not take advantage of that. So my niece stayed with my parents every two weeks. Her other grandparents are pretty well off financially and like my niece once told me, they are filthy rich and spoiled the f&ck out of me. I'm glad they got to raise me.
So living with wealthy grandparents and every two weeks visiting her other grandparents who were not as wealthy but seemed to be trying very hard to compete and she always managed to get what she wanted. As a little kid when she would be at my parents I would stop over to visit. From a very young age she was a story teller. Very factually she would tell a long detailed story that seemed believable. Many times the story ended with, "Just kidding". Nobody thought much of it at the time. She was just a little kid telling stories. But she grew up.
At age 17 she out of the blue wanted to move in with my mother for her senior year of school. Dad passed away a few years ago and mom gets lonely and was happy to have her. I live very near and am there nearly everyday to do the yard work and whatever mom needs help with. I noticed she still tells stories but they don't end with a just kidding. My mother is allergic to cats but my niece brought a cat home one day and told a long story about how her friend had to go visit relatives for two weeks and wanted her to cat sit and if she didn't watch the cat they were going to have it put down before they leave. A month later I asked about her friend. She said she knew grandma would probably say no so she kinda lied. Over the next year 4 cats and 5 dogs were stinking up the house.
Then about half way through the school year she said she had to quit school because everyone hated her. When asked what happened so suddenly for everyone to hate her so bad. Her story was one of the kids in school had a party one weekend and there was booze and drugs there (but she didn't have any of course) and the party got busted by the cops and before the cops came in everyone was told to lie and when the cops took her into a different room and asked her where the booze and drugs came from she got nervous and told the truth. She said one of the kids dad bought the alcohol and cocaine for the party. That kids dad happens to be a cop. Now for some reason, my mother believes every word the kid says. When I heard what had allegedly happened I asked why the police did not call my mother. She was at the time the kids legal guardian and the kid was 17. I'm pretty sure it's not legal for the police to bust a party and take the kids one by one into a different room of the house the party is at. I never got an answer.
The kid can act very sweet but she has a vicious side when she wants to show it. The story I heard from several of her classmates was, she viciously started picking on one of the girls in her class. I don't know why she targeted that girl but the girl was very depressed partly because her older brother had cancer and was close to the end. My niece kept telling her she was worthless and ugly and should go ahead and kill herself and get it over with. My niece was the new girl in class and the one she was picking on was well liked and popular and the rest of the class turned on her and she quit school. My mom still believes the cop buying booze and drugs story.
My mom for some reason will not accept or believe anything bad about the kid. Some of her stories involve her needing money for this or that. Shortly after quitting school she needed $800 because she had a job that her boss needed her to do half the country away and it was an emergency and if she didn't go he would lose his business and he couldn't bring her money because his wife was having a baby but will pay her $2000 when she gets back and without question mom wrote the check. From what I can tell, she has managed to get over $20,000 from my mom. That is money I know she can't afford.
There's more but this is enough to see that the kid isn't a normal typical kid telling little lies as kids do. A cop buying booze for a minor would be a career ending thing for a cop. Her lies are becoming dangerous. She feels no remorse for any of the things she says or does. If anyone says anything about the money she is swindling from her grandmother she just says, I'm a kid, I've had a ****ty life because of my mom and dad, I deserve to have fun and do what I want and whatever your game is just get this, I've been at this a long time so you don't stand a chance.
Another family member told her that swindling an elderly person out of money is a crime so you should probably stop it. Her reply was, bring it. My grand parents are filthy rich and can afford the best lawyers and I will win.
Mom denies giving her as much money as she does but she also has me help balance her checking account. I doubt my 77 year old mother spends $500 every so often on itunes or eats at Taco Johns 6 days per week. The kid needed a new car and it couldn't wait so mom co-signed for her, made the down payment for her and paid the first 6 months insurance. There were several transfers from moms account to hers every month for a while and the amount varied. She was overdrawing her account every month usually between $400 and $800. The car was recently repoed. She didn't make one single payment on the car. She also got mad at mom because she wanted another car and moms credit is tanked because of the last one.
To me this seems like a symptom of something bigger. It's sad that neither of the grandparents looked into getting her some help while she was a minor. My personal feelings are neither side wanted to admit there was a problem with her because, well, her dad is just as messed up as my sister so both sides could point the finger and say she's this way because of your kid.
I'm at a loss. If you read this and have some insight I'd appreciate it. I fear there is no way to get help now unless she escalates things even more and someone gets hurt or worse. She has an over inflated sense of herself. Nothing is ever her fault. She is quick to point out and over exaggerate things that others do. Mom is the victim here and won't admit it.
This is bad.
Yes, things will escalate, and she will probably never learn, even when she is arrested. She could get lucky and be supported by a relatively harmless but still toxic guy who is conned by her charms. But the most likely scenario will involve addictions, multiple arrests and worse.
Why did her mom lose custody? That seems like a very important detail you omitted.
Your mother seems unable to handle her finances. Have you considered getting power of attorney and taking over her bank account? An eldercare lawyer may be able to help.
Why aren't the custodial parents (sister's in-laws) taking more responsibility here? Has anyone reported the theft?
How does a 17 year old get a car loan?
Why are you not more involved in protecting your mother from your sociopathic niece? What this kid is doing to your mom is ELDER ABUSE. Start by getting rid of the pets and packing the kid back off to her LEGAL guardians.
Your gut instinct sounds right regarding your niece. Unfortunately, I think things will not go well for her. They will escalate. She will probably end up in some serious trouble. Maybe that will be good for her but she probably won't learn from it.
I hate to say it but she sounds like a sociopath. That's just my gut feel and of course, it's worth exactly what you paid for it. I'm not a psychiatrist obviously!
She's at least 17 now, right? Your mom needs to get her out of her house. She may need your help and your emotional support. The minute this heathen is 18 (and she probably already is) she needs to get out of everyone's house. You can't control all of that but you can - and must - help your mother.
No, your niece will not win any sort of lawsuit against her grandparents. They are enabling terrible behavior, plain and simple. Her behavior borders on, and may have already gone into, criminal behavior.
Yes, things will escalate, and she will probably never learn, even when she is arrested. She could get lucky and be supported by a relatively harmless but still toxic guy who is conned by her charms. But the most likely scenario will involve addictions, multiple arrests and worse.
Why did her mom lose custody? That seems like a very important detail you omitted.
Thanks for taking the time to read this rather long post. Sorry I forgot to add this detail. My sister lost custody of her first child because she is a violent drunk and she happened to be holding her infant daughter while arguing with her first husband and threw her child at him like a rock. I should also mention my sister did drink alcohol while she was pregnant.
Sociopath.
Her entire life will ripple out from what you have seen. Protect yourself and your finances from her, but other than that, there is little to be done. Enjoy the parts of her that you can, but don't believe anything.
Your mother seems unable to handle her finances. Have you considered getting power of attorney and taking over her bank account? An eldercare lawyer may be able to help.
Why aren't the custodial parents (sister's in-laws) taking more responsibility here? Has anyone reported the theft?
How does a 17 year old get a car loan?
Why are you not more involved in protecting your mother from your sociopathic niece? What this kid is doing to your mom is ELDER ABUSE. Start by getting rid of the pets and packing the kid back off to her LEGAL guardians.
As for mom being unable to handle her finances, I've considered looking into it and my own lack of knowledge has prevented me from moving forward. I need to do some research and make the call.
My niece was 17 when she moved in with mom. She is 19 now. As for my sisters getting involved that gets tough. One of my older sisters lives nearby and visits frequently and has tried talking to my niece about a few things. Mainly asking her to pick up after herself and be more respectful towards mom. That sister is told to stop picking on the kid. Mom has a history of over protecting my niece and her mother so any criticism of either is not welcome. My other older sister drinks daily with my younger sister (nieces mother) and the relationship there is strained at best.
The only physical property that I know was taken belonged to my moms cousin who was storing some fishing gear in an unused building on the farm. She didn't personally take anything but told her boyfriend the stuff was for sale so his friend gave her the money and took the stuff. The cousin talked to mom about it and mom became upset so he withheld from getting the police involved to keep the peace.
I believer she was 18 when she purchased the car and with a big enough down payment and a co-signer had no trouble getting the loan.
I have tried becoming involved and again, anything negative said about the kid upsets mom. If this all began with just my niece, it could easily be seen as a case of mom is getting older and not thinking clearly. The over protecting thing started with my youngest sister. (my nieces mother) She was adopted from my oldest sister who had epilepsy and a drinking and drug habit and died very young. So technically, my youngest sister is my niece and her daughter is my great niece. My sister displayed much of the same behavior. So mom has a history of treating that line a certain way. I don't know if she does it out of guilt or something but any negative things said about them is considered being mean and picking on her/them for no reason. I would love to resolve this before mom dies because leaving things the way they are condemn the three biological children and puts the adopted member and her child on a pedestal without reason.
Mom had been denying giving the kid excessive amounts of money but as I was balancing her checking account for her I showed her the copies of canceled checks and she said it's my money and I should be able to spend it on whatever I want.
When someone mentioned elder abuse and swindling from mom, my niece lashed out bragging about the wealth of her other grandparents and their ability to out lawyer anyone on this side of the family.
There is a lot of alcohol abuse within my family so just to clarify, I chose to stop drinking about 8 years ago. Not out of necessity but because I was seeing too much alcohol abuse around me and for all my faults I didn't want to add alcoholism to the mix. Mom and dad were never heavy drinkers at least within the time frame of my memory. Mom had 2 brothers and both were problem drinkers. Dad had 8 brothers and sisters and he was the only one who was not an alcoholic. His drug of choice was work. He was a workoholic which causes it's own set of problems.
Dear lord when I lay it all out like this, my family is a mess. Liars are protected and anyone saying the truth is put in the bad guy category.
Sociopath.
Her entire life will ripple out from what you have seen. Protect yourself and your finances from her, but other than that, there is little to be done. Enjoy the parts of her that you can, but don't believe anything.
This is something I was afraid to hear but can't be denied. It is getting very difficult to enjoy any part of her anymore. A couple years ago I considered her a normal teenage girl with a bright future if she stayed on the right path. Before it became all to easy to pick out the lies I enjoyed visiting with her. The behaviors and lies are all too easy to pick out but it's a taboo subject that isn't supposed to be talked about.
There are 2 items that scare me at this point. The poor girl she decided to verbally attack and told daily to kill herself probably won't be the last person she abuses. There are a lot of her former classmates that are still angry about what she did and tried to do and they share the information on social media. A girl a couple years younger than her knew the girl my niece picked on and is one that warns people about her has some text messages from my niece asking her to stop ruining her life. She says in the message, yes I did it. I didn't like her and I said what I said. There I admitted what I did now stop messing my life up. This girl has multiple messages all basically the same but worded differently.
The other item is the lies she told about the police officer to cover up the real reason her classmates hated her. If the wrong person believes some of her lies, lives could be seriously messed with.
Your gut instinct sounds right regarding your niece. Unfortunately, I think things will not go well for her. They will escalate. She will probably end up in some serious trouble. Maybe that will be good for her but she probably won't learn from it.
I hate to say it but she sounds like a sociopath. That's just my gut feel and of course, it's worth exactly what you paid for it. I'm not a psychiatrist obviously!
She's at least 17 now, right? Your mom needs to get her out of her house. She may need your help and your emotional support. The minute this heathen is 18 (and she probably already is) she needs to get out of everyone's house. You can't control all of that but you can - and must - help your mother.
No, your niece will not win any sort of lawsuit against her grandparents. They are enabling terrible behavior, plain and simple. Her behavior borders on, and may have already gone into, criminal behavior.
Trust me, your advise is worth more than I paid for and anyone who has ever been in a position to seek psychiatric help refuses to admit she is anything but normal.
She is 19 now and mom continues to turn a blind eye. She takes any criticism of my niece as a personal insult. The kid says something like don't be stupid grandma and all is well. Anyone whether it be on of my sisters, me or even my 30 year old daughter tell her not to talk to her grandmother that way is taken as a personal insult by my mother. This is now second generation overprotecting bad behavior. That's were my frustration comes in. How do I protect someone who does not want to be protected?
I may have a chat with the police officer that she claimed sold booze and drugs to minors and get his advise. Since mom is still mentally sound according to her doctor and she is willing to happily help her grandchild fulfill her dreams by writing the check with a smile, can it be considered a crime? To push for that would mean not only fighting the lies of the criminal but going against the wishes of the victim.
I would like to point out one thing here. I am feeling less crazy by getting this all out without the need to protect feelings. I just want to say thanks for being here and taking the time to read and post.
How to deal with a family member who is unable to tell the truth...How I would deal with it is to stay far away from that person..no contact with them at all...ever.People like will not change unless they choose to get help with their issues.
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