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Hi - I don't know if you still need the info but -
A vet will go with the ip if they cannot get access to a vein (front or back legs). Lack of access could be from dehydration or low blood pressure (veins can collapse). If the vet is sedating first (separate injection which can be given under the skin like a vaccine or in the muscle) then the ip is not painful and a quicker way then injecting into the abdomen (an alternate route).
Home euthanasia with a vet is really good at reducing stress and anxiety in a pet so that is a good option.
Sorry you have to go through this I have been there.
Deb (licensed vet tech)
To expand on this a little for anyone else who may need the information...
If at all possible, an IP injection shouldn't be given unless sedation is given first. Usually the sedation is given in the muscle and it does sting a little, but only a little. Once the animal is asleep from the sedation the final injection can be given IP.
The reason for this is that the IP injection takes much longer to take effect (generally speaking) then giving the euthanasia solution into a vein. The animal can start to panic as they feel their heart rate slow or breathing slow. The solution itself can also cause a burning sensation.
Sometimes with very small animals like puppies or kittens a vein can be next to impossible to find. But even they can be sedated down with gas before being given the solution IP. This goes for even smaller pocket pets like mice or hamsters as well. There's really little good reason not to take this step...it can take longer for puppies or kittens to be gassed down, but it can also take longer for them to finally succumb to the IP injection.
Euthanasia solution should NEVER be given IC (into the heart) on a conscious animal.
When we euthanized my cat Nic his veins were collapsed from his kidney disease. They sedated him first and tried repeatedly to access a vein. They had to put him on gas to ensure the sedation didn't wear off because it was taking so long. I finally begged them to just give it IC and let my boy go. It was horrible for everyone, including the doctor and techs, but Nic himself wasn't feeling anything.
As for staying...I've always chosen to stay. I don't think that anyone should be made to feel guilty if they opt not to, though. I think you have to consider a few factors. First would be your pet and how they react to your vet. Are they so friendly that the vet is their good buddy? Are they nervous and need your presence?
Then you have to consider yourself and how you are likely to react. I saw many cases at our hospital where owners reacted in ways that only caused more stress for the animal. I don't mean simple tears but things like screaming/being combative/etc. If you feel you might react in this way it might be better for the pet if you are absent.
The last factor would be how you are likely to react after the pet is gone. Some people become fixated on the final images even if the euthanasia is peaceful and focus on that instead of the good memories.
While I think there are good reasons why some people choose not to attend and don't think anyone should feel guilty, I know that I myself never regretted being there. It was the last thing I could do for them as a responsible owner. I'm not a spiritual person, but there is something meaningful in knowing you have carried out your love and responsibility to the deepest level possible.
I also just wanted to reassure people that even if you opt not to present, your vet and the techs will handle your animal with just as much kindness and respect as they would if you were there. If you have a relationship with your vet and trusted them to care for your pet in life, you can be assured they will care for them as deeply in those final moments. We were careful at our hospital not to let euthanasia become just 'part of the job'...it was always something done with awareness and kindness.
Well said. We are fortunate to have had wonderful vets and techs whom we trust. The farewell our pets have received from our vet were always respectful, kind, and even loving. I only hope that I can pass with the same peace as my furry ones.
Thank you for your replies, it is very helpful to get this technical advice. I was worried about advising on something this important that I don't have expert knowledge of... 'fortunately,' we did end up going with the leg vein method preceded by sedation (I now know that proper pre-sedation is critical).
I'm not sure why one of the vets was such a proponent of the IP (abdominal injection) method... He is a good, compassionate professional and I trust his judgement; but given the relative dearth of info on IP we were just too unsure about it. This was esp. true given that the process takes up to 20 minutes- what if it wasn't comfortable for the animal, that's too long.
ParallelJJ, your comment about the possibility of the animal feeling panic as he feels his heart slowing down etc., during such an extended time period, confirmed my concerns about IP. I'm sure it has it's place, but as non-experts we couldn't say that it would be right in this instance. I understand that many home-vist vets use IP over leg vein, and I'd be interested if you know why that may be so?
DogMom, I agree that having this done at home makes all the difference- no weird smells and sounds, no stressful commute to the vet office... there's no place like home. I still feel strange about it all, but am so glad to have given her at least that.
Although she wasn't my cat, her mom was relying on me for much of the research, decisionmaking etc. plus I always want to help animals. It has really helped to have this forum to come to.
DogMom, I agree that having this done at home makes all the difference- no weird smells and sounds, no stressful commute to the vet office... there's no place like home. I still feel strange about it all, but am so glad to have given her at least that.
Although she wasn't my cat, her mom was relying on me for much of the research, decisionmaking etc. plus I always want to help animals. It has really helped to have this forum to come to.
Hmm. All of the vets I know that do home visits, including the ones I've worked with, use the IV route with sedation. I can think of a few possible reasons though.
Home visits tend to be something that one or two particular vets at the hospital do, not every vet that works there. Many vets don't like doing home visits. So it tends to be treated as more of an add-on service, not a mainstay of the hospital. Point being that many vets end up doing home visits alone because the techs are needed at the hospital. I know a vet who actually stopped doing home visits because she always did them alone and a client got creepy.
So the IP route may simply be easier if the vet doesn't have an extra set of hands to hold off a vein and position the animal correctly for an IV injection. The owner could help, but that puts them in the position of actually participating in the animal's euthanasia. The vet or owner could also be bitten if the owner doesn't know how to hold, or the whole process could just be more difficult.
Even with a tech to assist, the home environment also tends to have poor lighting and there's aren't any nice steel lifting tables. So again it might just be easier than trying to spot a vein on a big, sick dog while crouching on the floor.
I hate to say this, but the other reason I can think of is that the process being slower may give more of a sense of value since home visits can be expensive. That would be a really horrible motivation for the choice, but I know some vets who would do such a thing (none that I worked with, thankfully.)
These are just excuses, though...they aren't in my mind good enough reasons to justify using IP. Your doctor may well be a very good vet, but he may be coming from an older generation where this was a more common practice. I'm not sure, but IP may also reduce the chance of agonal breathing during the death process...that's when an animal takes big, gasping breaths. They aren't conscious or feeling any pain during this, but it can look unpleasant and upset the owners. Because the IP route is slower, I think it may reduce the chance of the body reacting with this reflex, so that's another possible reason.
Hi,
Well I can give a bit more perspective on the IP route now. My husband (a vet) does home euthanasias and he does do IP occasionally. The usual route is IV but if you have a pet (usually a cat) that has been in the clinic/hospital for awhile then you may not be able to get a vein. If the cat is sick and the veins are shot then having to shave and poke each leg for a vein is not something you want to do. To use the IP route the pet has to have been sedated (something with pain meds mixed with a sedative) but the needle (it doesn't have to be a long one to reach the peritoneal cavity) just is inserted and the euthanasia drug is then injected. This route takes a long time because the body has to absorb the drug but it is painless (as long as pre-sedated) and very peaceful. The pet drifts off slowly, almost as if in their sleep.
My husband says that he does not do this method as much as IV route but that it is very humane as is injecting the drug into one of the kidneys which is also done sometimes if there is no other option. He (husband) always tells the owners what he is doing and it is done in their presence. IV is faster (so is injecting into the kidney) but IP is an option when there are no accessible veins.
Hi,
Well I can give a bit more perspective on the IP route now. My husband (a vet) does home euthanasias and he does do IP occasionally. The usual route is IV but if you have a pet (usually a cat) that has been in the clinic/hospital for awhile then you may not be able to get a vein. If the cat is sick and the veins are shot then having to shave and poke each leg for a vein is not something you want to do. To use the IP route the pet has to have been sedated (something with pain meds mixed with a sedative) but the needle (it doesn't have to be a long one to reach the peritoneal cavity) just is inserted and the euthanasia drug is then injected. This route takes a long time because the body has to absorb the drug but it is painless (as long as pre-sedated) and very peaceful. The pet drifts off slowly, almost as if in their sleep.
My husband says that he does not do this method as much as IV route but that it is very humane as is injecting the drug into one of the kidneys which is also done sometimes if there is no other option. He (husband) always tells the owners what he is doing and it is done in their presence. IV is faster (so is injecting into the kidney) but IP is an option when there are no accessible veins.
Thank you, DogMomDeb. I think though that's a reason to do IP injections in general (meaning the collapsed veins typical of illness.) And so long as the animal is sedated, they don't feel anything even if it does take longer. It's not considered humane if done without sedation though.
But does your husband find he does more IP during home visits than he would in a clinical setting, and is there a reason for choosing that route more often during home visits? The other poster had heard that many home vets choose IP as their primary route for euthanasia, which is the first time I've heard that and I'm honestly curious if it's true and if so, why. It sounds like your husband typically uses IV though and only does IP if there's no vein accessible, which makes sense.
I actually don't know any vets who do IP injections routinely over IV, as opposed to only doing IP when there's no other choice (and never without sedation.) Tragically, there have been some recent cases where shelter workers were euthanizing awake animals with IC and IP injections. I think in some of the cases they weren't even successfully charged with animal abuse, which is terrible.
Thank you, DogMomDeb. I think though that's a reason to do IP injections in general (meaning the collapsed veins typical of illness.) And so long as the animal is sedated, they don't feel anything even if it does take longer. It's not considered humane if done without sedation though.
But does your husband find he does more IP during home visits than he would in a clinical setting, and is there a reason for choosing that route more often during home visits? The other poster had heard that many home vets choose IP as their primary route for euthanasia, which is the first time I've heard that and I'm honestly curious if it's true and if so, why. It sounds like your husband typically uses IV though and only does IP if there's no vein accessible, which makes sense.
I actually don't know any vets who do IP injections routinely over IV, as opposed to only doing IP when there's no other choice (and never without sedation.) Tragically, there have been some recent cases where shelter workers were euthanizing awake animals with IC and IP injections. I think in some of the cases they weren't even successfully charged with animal abuse, which is terrible.
No he does not routinely do IP for home euthanasias. Although the majority of home euthanasias are dogs (usually large breeds) and its a lot easier to get a vein on a dog as you know.
As a vet tech working in emergency I have seen IC only one time on a non-sedate patient. I objected to it at that time but was overruled. I did not see IP done for euthanasia cases there.
A couple of things I will say about a shelter worker doing IP or IC.
Usually shelter workers are not vet techs with education and training or even vet assistants with some training, they are people willing to work at usually a low paying job and the job is pretty much killing animals for a living. I am sure that there are some (not all) that go into it because they have no problem with that kind of process. Although I hope that the majority of shelter workers are humane and do not like the things that they have to do to these poor animals.
And going IP or IC is cheaper than having to use a sedation drug along with the euthanasia solution. And considering the fact that shelters do not get very much in the way of funding I can see why it happens. Again though I don't think that it is something that the worker comes up with it probably is something that is mandated by the powers that control that shelter (county/city).
If the majority of people would educate themselves on some of these issues then maybe shelters wouldn't have to be put into the position of just being a place that kills animals. But people tend to close their eyes to this kind of thing and go buy a pet from the pet store (that gets their animals from a puppy/cat mill) and then dump the animal at the shelter when they no longer want it.
sorry - climbing back down from soapbox now
No he does not routinely do IP for home euthanasias. Although the majority of home euthanasias are dogs (usually large breeds) and its a lot easier to get a vein on a dog as you know.
As a vet tech working in emergency I have seen IC only one time on a non-sedate patient. I objected to it at that time but was overruled. I did not see IP done for euthanasia cases there.
A couple of things I will say about a shelter worker doing IP or IC.
Usually shelter workers are not vet techs with education and training or even vet assistants with some training, they are people willing to work at usually a low paying job and the job is pretty much killing animals for a living. I am sure that there are some (not all) that go into it because they have no problem with that kind of process. Although I hope that the majority of shelter workers are humane and do not like the things that they have to do to these poor animals.
And going IP or IC is cheaper than having to use a sedation drug along with the euthanasia solution. And considering the fact that shelters do not get very much in the way of funding I can see why it happens. Again though I don't think that it is something that the worker comes up with it probably is something that is mandated by the powers that control that shelter (county/city).
If the majority of people would educate themselves on some of these issues then maybe shelters wouldn't have to be put into the position of just being a place that kills animals. But people tend to close their eyes to this kind of thing and go buy a pet from the pet store (that gets their animals from a puppy/cat mill) and then dump the animal at the shelter when they no longer want it.
sorry - climbing back down from soapbox now
*grins* I have a whole other soap box on that issue...most people DON'T get their pets from pet stores. Very few do actually. And almost all owned pets in the US ARE spayed and neutered, which is the other excuse shelter's use. Half of the shelter problem in this country is the shelters' fault due to bad marketing, blaming, refusing to let go of traditional mindsets, bad decision making, and a defeatist attitude.
But that's not the topic of this thread, so I'll leave that be (kicks soap box to the curb.) All I will say that to me there is NO excuse EVER for routinely doing IC injections on conscious animals. One wrong (low funding/owners leaving pets at the shelter) does not excuse the shelter worker from the weight of responsibility for their own choices. Animal cruelty is animal cruelty no matter who a person is employed by. Even if they had little training, it isn't hard to tell that an animal euthanized by IC is in pain and suffering. And in at least two of the cases I'm thinking of, the person doing the injections was a vet employed by the shelter.
Sorry, I think we just have to agree to disagree on this point.
*grins* I have a whole other soap box on that issue...most people DON'T get their pets from pet stores. Very few do actually. And almost all owned pets in the US ARE spayed and neutered, which is the other excuse shelter's use. Half of the shelter problem in this country is the shelters' fault due to bad marketing, blaming, refusing to let go of traditional mindsets, bad decision making, and a defeatist attitude.
But that's not the topic of this thread, so I'll leave that be (kicks soap box to the curb.) All I will say that to me there is NO excuse EVER for routinely doing IC injections on conscious animals. One wrong (low funding/owners leaving pets at the shelter) does not excuse the shelter worker from the weight of responsibility for their own choices. Animal cruelty is animal cruelty no matter who a person is employed by. Even if they had little training, it isn't hard to tell that an animal euthanized by IC is in pain and suffering. And in at least two of the cases I'm thinking of, the person doing the injections was a vet employed by the shelter.
Sorry, I think we just have to agree to disagree on this point.
I think we disagree on soapbox issues - yes.
But I don't think we disagree on the use of IC on conscious animals. I don't think it is route that is routinely used even in shelters. Even is shelters have no money to pay for a sedative/pain med pre injection - the IV route is almost always used on conscious animals.
I put my loving boy to sleep Tuesday evening at our home. We have a wonderful vet that comes to peoples homes for such. It killed me to pre schedule her to come, knowing that I had to set a time and date just made it so permanet- but I understood the need for it. My boy could no long walk- it would be selfish of me to let him suffer and longer. He loss of back legs useage came rather quick- although is was old and slower getting up- it became very quick where he could not get up any longer. I spent the most of the final day with him- hanging out watching TV and talking to him...just him and I. We said our goodbyes several times leading up to that day- not knowing these were the final days. Remebering back now certain moments he came to me and we loved on each other.
Being there to watch him take the first shot in the muscle which calmed him into a heavy sleep- he started snoring really loud (it was a funny moment) because we let the vet know that he was a snorer. Anyways- we were able to love him some more and tell him all the good things we need to. She gave us all the time we needed.
Then she gave him a shot in the vein and his front leg. This was the final one- which tells the body to shut down in order, breathe to go first, then heart then everything else. We loved him some more- my daughter just laid there with him the entire time. ( he was her furry brother)
Our vet then wrapped him up in a sheet and put him on a gurney and loaded him into her car. She then took him to the animal crematory and we should have him back within 3-4 business days. The crematory will delivery him to either or home, work or any other place we wish to have him sent. It was hard- but I wouldn't change anything about being there. I didn't want him put to sleep at some cold vet floor- or cold vet steel table- scared and hurting. I wanted him at home in his favorite place- our patio. He loved it there when the weather was nice. Tuesday 10/30/12 was a wonderful day in the south, cool crisp in the morning and warm in the afternoon and evening. He past around 1930ish. I will miss him dearly.
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