Is NC Triangle area for me? Suggestions? (Raleigh, Durham: real estate, apartments)

[lookn2mv]

Hi guys. I'm in one of those "crap, where should I move?? " scenarios right now--recent layoff, late twenties single w/no hard ties, dreaming of first-time home ownership and a more relaxed lifestyle, etc. The NC Triangle area was recently suggested to me by a friend who is pondering "Oregon alternatives" (using decidedly different criteria) and happened to mention that you guys have a thriving high tech economy, coupled with green trees and affordable housing--all of which sound great and have led me to get excited about "possibility" in NC. However, the idea moving across the country to an unfamiliar place is daunting and I want to try to suss-out whether this would really be a good move for me. I know that no place is perfect, but some things that concern me about NC (so far) are:

Bugs: Are roaches/ticks everywhere? Cockroaches CREEP ME OUT and apartment reviews suggest roaches are a pervasive problem; there's also a city-data thread about roaches in restaurants being fairly common. Plus, the idea of perpetual tick paranoia sounds awful for an outdoorsy person.
Drought: Are water rates ridiculous and neighborhoods ugly and brown - despite the appearance of being green on the internet?
Humidity: Can anyone compare the humidity to Houston or Austin, TX or Bloomington, IN to help me understand?

Is blatant racism and/or the good ol' boy network still alive and strong in the area? (Please forgive a stereotyped concern; I've never been to NC and admit ignorance.) How is the religious tolerance situation? I'd describe myself as a generic pagan with Buddhist overtones - who is respectful toward and educated about most religions. Would I be likely to have a problem?

Do these salary figures generally look accurate for the local software industry?
software quality assurance Salaries in Raleigh, NC - Free Salary Search
systems analyst Salaries in Raleigh, NC - Free Salary Search

Based on these concerns and the information below, does the Triangle area sound like a good fit for me at all? If not, do you have any other suggestions? I'm at my wits end trying to brainstorm my next move...

Where I've lived:
- San Diego, CA (current - fine, but too $$$)
- Bloomington, IN (g. school: too small, tornadoes terrify me)
- Eugene, OR (college: perfect size for the time, perhaps small for me now)
- Albuquerque, NM (great - love the food/culture, but small tech economy)

What I'm looking for: I'm an earthy, outdoorsy, computer geek at heart.
- nature (preferably lots of green trees, streams, hiking, mtns or at least lumpy hills)
- affordable housing ("normal people homes" in the $150-250K range)
- high tech jobs w/commute < 40min each way
- near college/university for continuing ed. options
- vegetarian friendly
- mass transit (I own a car, but love options)
- mild weather

Locations I'm considering:
- Portland, OR
- Austin, TX
- Albuquerque, NM
- Raleigh, NC

In an ideal world, I'd move back to Oregon in a heartbeat (i.e. it's beautiful and fits my personality well); however, housing there has gotten noticeably more expensive and the Portland high tech economy still is not the best which makes me nervous. My family is pushing for Austin, but I'm concerned about the comparative lack of green or outdoorsy activities and, frankly, the idea of being landlocked by the rest of "Texas".

[VickiR]

I'm laughing at your post because a thought has just occurred to me:

It used to be that people joined Match.com to find a compatible mate. Now I'm thinking someone should start a Match.com for the area that you are best suited to live in!!!

One thing I can tell you is that I've been to Austin, Texas. I thought it looked alot like Raleigh to me. However, I've lived in Raleigh for over 30 years and only stayed in Austin a week. The area, as far as trees and houses looked similar to me. I think Raleigh could be a tad more expensive than Austin but you can check Sperling's website and that should give you a good comparison.

Vicki

[lookn2mv]

I know, right. For a while I though a little quiz spit out decent results (since it gave several places I've lived/enjoyed); however, it gives those answers just as frequently if I completely throw my answers. Moderator cut: url removed
I guess I'm surprised to hear you thought Austin looked similar to Raleigh. Perhaps my opinion is slanted since I've only been there in February when everything is brown and dormant... Thanks for the input.

[VickiR]

We were in Austin in June so things were pretty and green.

Raleigh is kinda brown in February too. I guess I've lived here so long that I just don't notice some things like that.

I'm amazed at the number of people that just pick a place to live and then move there! It seems like that takes alot of courage and I've noticed more and more people doing it. Of course, alot of my clients are younger and then the parents decide they like it here, as well and before you know it, the whole family is here!

Vicki

[suncat]

Greetings from a fellow Duck (class of '86). I live in Portland now, but plan to move to Raleigh next year. Your list is very similar to what I'm looking for in a new city. I've been to the Triangle four times, and from what you've written I think it would be worth a look.

Mass transit is the only negative comparison to Portland I can think of. The weather is definitely nicer, and I think the people are friendlier and less pretentious. The Triangle seems to have more available white-collar jobs, too.

[lookn2mv]

Thanks for the perspective, suncat. Appreciate it. (class of '01)

As for geographic mobility, VickiR, I think it's become incredibly common--particularly as the whole "career" dynamic has changed such that there is noticeably less long-term "loyalty" from both employer and employee than there has been in decades past (i.e. people tend to move in search of jobs, even if no job is in hand). The other huge contributing factor that I see is the dramatic imbalance between cost-of-living and local wages in many parts of the country; that kind of dynamic hurts most people in those areas, but particularly those looking to retire (smaller, fixed income) and those looking to start out; hence, the "family flight" behavior you describe. My $.02, anyway...

[mdp_az]

Keep in mind that this area is more than Raleigh, its the Triangle region and includes Durham, Chapel Hill and other surrounding towns. From what you've said you're looking for, I think Durham or Chapel Hill might be a better fit for you than Raleigh. Chapel Hill's biggest negative (aside from UNC...I went to NC State ) is the high cost of living compared to other areas in the Triangle.

Durham is my personal favorite city in the Triangle and is also the closest city to RTP. Real estate is slightly cheaper in Durham than in Raleigh or CH, and the population is more diverse than other towns, too. There is a bus network in Durham, but IMO the strongest alternative transportion in Durham is the greenways and American Tobacco Trail that lead into downtown Durham and from there to RTP, providing an awesome bike commute.

[dcgrl]

I think the Triangle area might work for you. You sound like the kind of person who'd feel at home in the western part of the Triangle--Chapel Hill/Carrboro (where UNC is) or Durham (where Duke is). (although your house budget puts you more in the Durham camp) These towns are very liberal, tolerant, and your spiritual inclinations would not leave you feeling out of place.

Bugs. What can I say. I'd never seen a roach until I moved here. I quickly learned best practices to keep them out of my house. they can be an issue, but not a deal breaker for me (and I'm very squeamish). Ticks. Yeah there are ticks, too. from my perspective, it's one of the tradeoffs of living in a place that still has trees/nature.

Water. The drought has been severe this year. I hope we all learn from it and learn to manage resources better. We haven't watered anything at all this summer, and our landscape is still pretty green (except for where it's brown--we have many, many pines, and there's pine straw all over...)

Humidity. It's humid. Austin tends to be hotter (about 10 degrees hotter each month); they're kind of split on the humidity. It looks like Austin is more humid during the first half of the year and Raleigh is more humid the second half. Check this tool to compare climate: City Climate Comparisons

There are high-tech jobs here. I've been hearing some grumbling about people having a hard time finding work, but that's all third and fourth hand. I've known several people find work pretty easily in the high-tech sector here. If you live on the west side of the triangle, your commute will be much more reasonable than if you live on the east side (Raleigh, Cary, Garner, etc) (of course this depends on where you end up working)

Lots of vegetarians here. I've never worked with so many vegetarians.

Blatant racism. Yes, it still exists. But it exists everywhere--not just the south. I moved from the Boston area, and I have to tell you, despite its reputation for being liberal, that city has to be the least integrated place in America. I like that the diversity of the south is apparent on a daily basis and that people here recognize that racism isn't an old problem, it's persistent and requires work.

Mass transit. This is pretty much just in the form of buses. We lost an opportunity for light rail recently. But the bus system is OK, especially in Chapel Hill, where it's free.

The climate is mild, although this morning it was 32 when we got up. Brrr.

Your comment about being landlocked in the rest of Texas is EXACTLY why we chose not to move to Austin when we decided to shake things up. We really like that city and its music scene, but in the end decided we couldn't deal with driving all day, and still being in Texas. North Carolina is big enough as it is, but at least you can be somewhere else in a day's drive.

Good luck with your decision. Be sure to visit first!

[Gurl]

Originally Posted by lookn2mv

What I'm looking for: I'm an earthy, outdoorsy, computer geek at heart.
- nature (preferably lots of green trees, streams, hiking, mtns or at least lumpy hills)
- affordable housing ("normal people homes" in the $150-250K range)
- high tech jobs w/commute < 40min each way
- near college/university for continuing ed. options
- vegetarian friendly
- mass transit (I own a car, but love options)
- mild weather

I feel your pain! When I decided to move from Los Angeles, I was looking for much of what you want...

I don't hike, but I do like to be surrounded by nature (with a few bugs as possible). I bought a 'normal people home" in an established Durham burb, and I LOVE that every view from inside the house is TREES and SKY. I'm sure Mrs Steele will chime in soon about the beauty of her neighborhood, Woodcroft (which is next door to mind HVF). Woodcroft, imo, is one of THE most pretty neighborhoods around. You can go jogging on tree lined paths, and really see 'life'...BUT, you're not out in the boonies.

I'm a weather-a-holic, and I LOVE the weather hear. Even with the drought, there's still a fair amount of green around (especially compared to Los Angeles, imo)

Racism? I haven't noticed any more or less than any other city I've lived in. It sucks where ever it raises it's head.

Vegetarian? That's a tough one...you might want to look areas like Carrborro(sp) or Pittsborro(sp) or Hillsborro(sp). I haven't been yet, but one of them has Weaver Street Market, and yoga studios, etc. They'll probably be more progressive in terms of 'all things' from what I've gathered from reading things online. (again, I'm sure someone will add some clarity and corrected spelling )

Culture? eh. There's 'culture' here, but not like what you're expecting. That said, I think as more people from around the country (and world) move here, cultural pockets will start to develop, in the same fashion you see in other cities.

Bugs? I hate bugs, and haven't noticed a problem with them in my home at all.

All in all, I'm glad I made the move here. Even thought it's lacking in a few things I'd like to see (religious and cultural diversity) - all in all, I really like it here, and am happy with the move.

ATB.

[solarity]

I think Raleigh matches a lot of what you are looking for. I'll take on your religious question a little more specifically. I have what might be considered a New Age religion so can speak to the issue a little. I keep quiet about my religion until I know the person well and even then I like to keep quiet. I came from NH where most everyone is agnostic/athiest and don't really care one way or another if someone wants to practice something different. It is very Christian here and was a bit of a culture shock initially. Since I got past the initial culture shock I have discovered many agnostics and wiccans who also keep quiet. I also know many buddhists but that is more from the strong international aspect of the colleges in the area. So I can say the area is diverse with religion but many people don't take well to non-christian views, so most with diverse religion will keep it to themselves. I am cautious with what I share and don't feel its anyones business anyway, I'm never pressed on the issue. So on the surface it might seem difficult but its easily adjusted to.

As for all the rest of your criteria....Raleigh is a great match. It is super green here, yes it yellowed a bit in the drought but still not like the west and its short lived. Just one rain storm will revive the green. There are trees everywhere and many suburbs have regulations regarding this. Actually our tech park RTP is probably the greenest around! They have tons of restrictions on how many trees can be cut down, and it is heavily wooded in areas, most of the companies are hidden from the road from the trees. Commutes can be kept easily under 40 minutes.

I've only done apartment living for the most part. Cockroaches happen but not frequent and you can spray for them. Apartments have exterminators come regularly (well in my current place you have to request to be put on the list if you have a problem). I've never had a problem in our current townhome, but do have ants which I think was the result of the drought and they were coming in for water. Again apartments are great when it comes to having exterminators come if there is a problem. We would occasionally have roaches show up in my pervious places but it was infrequent and if you get a cat then you will have no roaches :P . We have 4 so that might explain our lack of bugs showing up lol.