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Is anyone else finding that the percentage of disgruntled, jaded men is extremely high these days? In dating, I come across so many guys who have been so burned by women that they come to view them so negatively and with such distrust that it really affects their dating life.
I went out with this guy last week who started the date acting like a jerk. I was very close to walking out until he saw that his behavior had affected me, and he apologized. He said that he had spent his life dealing with "phony" women and that he thought I was just another one of the "phony" ones.
What's scary to me is (1) that he jumped to the conclusion that I was "phony" so quickly, and (2) that he felt because I was "phony" that he had the right to act like an ass? Is this a male ego thing, to burn before you get burned?
How are you able to determine that they are all jaded because they've been burned by women so many times? I don't know how I would determine that about a girl unless she outright told me and even then I probably wouldn't believe her. Also what would it matter? It'd be a good opportunity for me to prove to her otherwise.
Location: Huntersville/Charlotte, NC and Washington, DC
26,700 posts, read 41,748,461 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timberline742
This.
Dating is just going out with someone and doing fun things. Dinners, plays, movies, events, hiking, biking, seeing bands, making out.
How in the world can these be negatives or something stressful!!!!
Have you forgotten about the anguish when seeing when they will let you have a second date, going back to the drawing board if they reject you, affording all those dates, when to contact them, etc?
From what I've observed, there's been a role reversal among men and women of this generation.
There are far more quality men than quality women. These women screw the men over (whether it be cheating, divorce, constant rejection, etc) and the men become bitter and jaded.
With your attitude about women, it's no wonder you are having a hard time in the dating/relationship world.
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
41,936 posts, read 36,974,024 times
Reputation: 40635
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dissenter
Have you forgotten about the anguish when seeing when they will let you have a second date, going back to the drawing board if they reject you, affording all those dates, when to contact them, etc?
What anguish? and "let me"?
What drawing board?
Sorry, I'm not sure what you're getting at.
If I had fun and want to hang out again, I'll ask them to hang out again. If they don't want to, they don't. No anguish there.
I really don't know what you mean by a drawing board.
And I'm going out anyway to bars/shows/events, so there is nothing really different to "afford".
And when to contact them? Uh, again, not sure what you mean? If I want to talk to them I will reach out, if I don't I won't. That's fairly simple.
...With reference to men being disgruntled in general, in the past more women dated, related, married, and stayed married to men that weren't so desirable but who provided at least outward stability and some social status. Women are more independent now (a good thing) and less likely to put up with this kind of situation. Some men won't adjust to this reality, and some honestly can't. Then they react poorly.
This is a crucial point, and I'm surprised that so few respondents have seconded it. For prior generations, the man's responsibility was almost entirely composed of establishing himself as a provider. His social skills and personal appeal were entirely secondary, apart from maybe initial physical appeal, and how well he impresses his future bride's father. In a more egalitarian society, social skills are crucial for both genders.
Some of the most vituperative critics of the new order are men with dead-end jobs and limited education. This is ironic, for in prior generations these men would have been servants or laborers, essentially with no means to marry. Their situation has actually improved, since now they can compensate with social skills for their various other disadvantages. No, the real "losers" of the modern transformation are the well-healed but the socially inept.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth
If all the guys decrying the lack of quality women could get in the same room as all the women decrying the lack of quality men, some happy couples might result.
They would indeed! In fact....
Quote:
Originally Posted by weezerfan84
I don't think men are disgruntled with the women they meet. Overall they are disgruntled with the process of dating and feeling as it's not going anywhere.
Exactly! Our great calamity isn't that all men are rakes, or all women teasers; or that "standards" are insurmountable. Or even that "all of the good ones are taken". Rather, our problem is the process. It's the process that's broken.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Djuna
Dating is all about getting to know someone. If it's tiresome and tedious and fraught with problems then you aren't dating a compatible person.
Once a good prospect is identified, dating becomes an invigorating adventure and a delight. But until then, it's a chore to sift through various prospects. And it's very debilitating to appear to find a good prospect, only to have one's hopes dashed - either because the other person doesn't reciprocate, or upon further examination evinces some unacceptable flaw.
Interesting. This hasn't been my experience at all. I can't tell you how many men I've met the past 4 years who've had wives or girlfriends who they neglected to mention as they pursued me. I've met more dirtbags than I could possibly tell you about. That's why I'm perpetually single.
Most women do the exact same thing.
Personally some neglect saying anything about the guy they are with and then within a week or so they say they are free to date. This means they dumped their man for a new, better catch.
Kinda like swinging on the ropes. They are on one reaching out for the next only to let go of the first one when the second is on hold.
This is why when a woman gets dumped she asks the guy, "Who is she? Do I know her?" This is because that is what They do.
Is anyone else finding that the percentage of disgruntled, jaded men is extremely high these days? In dating, I come across so many guys who have been so burned by women that they come to view them so negatively and with such distrust that it really affects their dating life.
I went out with this guy last week who started the date acting like a jerk. I was very close to walking out until he saw that his behavior had affected me, and he apologized. He said that he had spent his life dealing with "phony" women and that he thought I was just another one of the "phony" ones.
What's scary to me is (1) that he jumped to the conclusion that I was "phony" so quickly, and (2) that he felt because I was "phony" that he had the right to act like an ass? Is this a male ego thing, to burn before you get burned?
Plenty of women with the same atitude. Must burn them before they burn you. Sort of a preemptive nuclear strike. I was just talking about this subject with my wife. I would hate to be in the dating world today. We hear our friends and they all say the same thing. Men or women makes no difference. They cant find a good guy or a good woman everyone is mean and self centered etc.
Here is how I see it. Lets suppose your SO divorces and just drags you through the divorce cleaners on a bed of broken glass mixed with hot coals tar and chicken feathers. And say after that beating you go in the dating pool. You would be doing yourself a disservice if you automatically classified every woman or man you meet in the same category as take me to the divorce cleaners SO. Anybody lumping every man or woman in the same category as their last relationship is sure to doom their next one.
What if the person youre treating like crap is the one thats right for you. But youre a douche and they walk away.
If I had fun and want to hang out again, I'll ask them to hang out again. If they don't want to, they don't. No anguish there.
I really don't know what you mean by a drawing board.
And I'm going out anyway to bars/shows/events, so there is nothing really different to "afford".
And when to contact them? Uh, again, not sure what you mean? If I want to talk to them I will reach out, if I don't I won't. That's fairly simple.
I just don't know where you're coming from.
The drawing board may be the place where he carefully maps out his hopes for a better dating life than the difficult one he's had so far. I imagine it's humbling to amend that space, again.
Dating may never be much fun for him, like it is for you. Not dating is a pretty tough choice to live with, however logical it seems to you who can choose either option. He may unwisely invest too much of his sense of self in the process, lacking your Zen like tranquility when essentially asking a person if she thinks she might like him.
He probably feels like a rejection means he's missed out on a dwindling class of opportunity, that his pending "unworthy" certificate is moving through the mail. Starting again is arduous for him, and he can't really mimic the ease with which you move from date to date and woman to woman, something that may blind you to the possibility that not everyone can do that. And while you're going out anyway, perhaps he doesn't so much, except to date, and then he's paying her way, and so that's an additional cost. Could also be that his sense of a date needs to be something expensive and special because he fears he's not.
Eh, I make an average to below average salary in Boston (previously in SF), which I guess are both high cost of living areas.
I'm still going to be going out, even if single, so that's pretty much a wash. If I'm going out more and spending a bit more because I have a new activity partner, well, that's not that bad a deal. I make money in order to be able to live and going out is part of living. The only downside I've experienced (which is apparently unusual since so many here claim women dont date those that make less) and which is an anomaly is that I generally date women that make a lot more than me, generally 50%+ more, sometimes double what I make, and if I get it in my head early on that I need to "keep up" then it can become financially stressful, but that's really always (when looking back) my issue, and mine alone.
To me it's always about lifestyle. Say you make 40k and your gf makes 80k. Most of the time she will have a more expensive lifestyle than yours. She will probably eat at 'fancier' restaurants, go to more expensive vacations than you, sit in the lower bowl for concerts/plays, etc etc etc.
And this doesn't just involve relationships. It's about friendships as well. Best example I can give is the 'Friends' episode where half are broke and the other half are doing well financially. The well-to-do half wants to go to a fancy restaurant and split the bill evenly, even though the broke half barely orders anything. And then afterwards the wealthier half goes to see a concert while the broke half stays at home.
Eventually a lot of couples break up due to financial resentment. It happens to friendships too. Some people have a hard time hanging around others when it comes doing activities. Not everyone can afford or is willing to fun stuff.
To me it's always about lifestyle. Say you make 40k and your gf makes 80k. Most of the time she will have a more expensive lifestyle than yours. She will probably eat at 'fancier' restaurants, go to more expensive vacations than you, sit in the lower bowl for concerts/plays, etc etc etc.
And this doesn't just involve relationships. It's about friendships as well. Best example I can give is the 'Friends' episode where half are broke and the other half are doing well financially. The well-to-do half wants to go to a fancy restaurant and split the bill evenly, even though the broke half barely orders anything. And then afterwards the wealthier half goes to see a concert while the broke half stays at home.
Eventually a lot of couples break up due to financial resentment. It happens to friendships too. Some people have a hard time hanging around others when it comes doing activities. Not everyone can afford or is willing to fun stuff.
I just don't see this in MY own life experiences. I am friends with people from all walks of life and have dated men who make a lot of money and those who can barely scrape by. It's just not a huge factor in who I enjoy spending time with.
As far as disgruntled men, sure I have ran into them but I have also ran into women who weren't happy with the whole dating thing either. It just is what it is and if there is a man who is generally negative about women in general, all of the time, then I will choose to not date him.
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