Quote:
Originally Posted by raison_d'etre
I was in the book store and I saw this magazine for skeptics. Its a magazine claiming to be for science and reason.
It took things out of context and used it to fit their agenda.
Are all skeptics magazines like this? Is this the garbage Atheists and people who claim to be skeptics read?
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"...the garbage Atheists and people who claim to be skeptics read", all in the same phrase? How quaintly narrow-headed, but also instructive to us about you.
How's about if I were to say, categorically, "Everyone who even reads the bible is an arrogant idiot?"
Some great come-back commentary from
chielgirl...
Quote:
Originally Posted by chielgirl
√ Why not do some research since you seem hellbent on assuming this is what atheists even know exists or support.
√ If it took things out of context and used it to fit their agenda, you're probably talking about religion.
√√What is the atheist agenda?
I simply don't believe in a god, or any gods.
That's it. Period. Past that issue, no two atheists are alike.
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So true, and yet by comparison it's actually not too much of a logical stretch to make a reasonable claim that many Christians ARE somewhat more alike in their common beliefs, the fact they have all learned to sing off pretty much the same song-sheet, with the dame tired responses to our evidence for Evolution, etc.
They certainly do not apparently know how to be skeptical at all. Water ("Poofff!!!") into wine, a flat earth, co-existing dinosaurs, the Universe, full and completed, in just 6 days, and so on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by raison_d'etre
The best part is that most of their "studies" produced inconclusive results. Therefore, they say that their studies proved this and that. An inconclusive study or test cannot produce results other than that the means in which you tested the subject was not accurate or would not work. That is like me using a scale to measure the wind and claiming that it produced inconclusive results, therefore the wind does not exist.
To study something and to disprove it, you must exhaust all possible studies and tests. Since that is not possible, you cannot prove something false if all of your tests are inconclusive.
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But perhaps what the intent of your magazine was is simply to show that previously so-called conclusive studies or conclusions had not been subjected to even a cursory skeptical review. And therefore your magazine's purpose is to show up those types of inconsistencies that skeptical thought does cast some light on.
If we take that approach, with an open mind, we come to entirely different conclusions on much so-called reliable work ,especially by the non-technical;, those who only wishfully hope, dreamily looking skywards for divine intervention or answers.
Because, OP, the more salient point here may be this one:
†A naturally skeptical person, one who tends to doubt the improbable, or the wildly-claimed or more outrageous claims, will often apply some known standards to their thinking.
†A naturally
non-skeptical person, typified by the devoutly fundamentalist literalist religious types (who after all, just plain
believe their bible
"purely on faith alone!"), is not prone to ever want to question the story of their wondrous beginnings in a 6-day Genesis (
), how they got to "be", their position of hominid superiority in this world of "lesser beasties", and of their glorious and eternal afterlife.
†Us
garbage-reading atheists, on the other hand, have pretty much learned by now to question
much of what the bible-faithful, and other wildly mis-directed evangelicals (The Westboro Baptists for instance... Hey... they're
your brothers in Christ, not mine!).
So, being a natural skeptic, even if your quoted magazine's not a good example of the best of the breed, is
hardly a bad thing to aspire to, now is it? Assuming, of course, that one wants at least a glimpse of the truth and the reality. By my experiences here on C-D though, the last thing any ardent Christian believers here want to see is that!
We've recently proven right here, by asking a few simple questions of some of the more vigorous hostile and combative Christian "debaters" here [and I use that term very loosely now..], that they have absolutely
no intention of ever allowing themselves to be logically cornered! Which of course is
so easily done if we get down to brass tacks in a discussion of any one of their fervent fairy-tales.
Ohh.. some late-add apologetics....
Quote:
Originally Posted by raison_d'etre
I am not hellbent on assuming anything about atheists. I am merely curious to know more about why people don't believe in things spiritual. I have had many spiritual experiences and I just don't see how people can give up on something so great after only trying a few things or because some religious nut left a bad taste in their mouth. Not saying this is the case with all atheists and skeptics, just many that I have talked to.
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Well,
simply and
politely put,
r'e'd; it's because we atheists, many of us being past Christians, have resolved those spiritual experiences, those unique and wondrous moments, the ones that seem to reach into our very souls to provide an answer or two that seem to resonate with whatever you might have been feeling or even better" struggling with.
But until then these might be feelings that you could perhaps not easily put into simple, logical order or words. And so, it's easier and more productive to claim it was/is an outside force of vast intellectual ability, a Father-Figure entity taking your spiritual hand, or some
mutuality with others while in prayer, for example, that best addresses your innermost feelings.
Unfortunately, the more skeptical (dare I possibly say
scientifically educated?) amongst us then look to see, define or quantify those feelings which, of course, no-one can easily do. But then, when we
are also successful in quantifying them., or of explaining some phenomenon through some recently-evolved new-age physics equation or particle or exposé (likje DNA genome mapping for instance...), then that one is no longer an "inexplicable".
Put together enough of those, and you may have no further need for an
Inexplicable File (you know, like TV's
The X Files! aka:
"he Truth Is Out There!")
Good explanation so far? I also have also personally had, and still do, those sorts of deep feelings, emotions and enjoyment, but I am happy to accept that, for now at least, the inner detailed explanations will come later, and will become part of some greater universal truth-and-law set.
I am, just so you know, more than capable of enjoying a huge spritual moment watching a glorious sunset, with my elderly cat tucked onto my lap, without thanking some antique Wooden God for it all.
Why.... it can even bring a heartfelt tear to my otherwise heathen, garbage-reading and soul-less atheistic eyes....
Peace and Love! Oh yeah, and here's to being forever skeptical.