Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The notion that there is something so vastly greater than we can ever hope to be is a pretty unsettling one, I understand. God is the scariest kind of alien that ever was. Hence, I can understand people not wanting to even entertain the notion of it existing.
How strange. When I consider complex grandeur of the universe, I am not unsettled but rather struck by an absolute sense of awe. fFar more, in fact, than I have ever been while trying to contemplate even the most fabulous vision of god.
To imagine a god so powerful and so omnipotent that it could create even the small fraction of the universe that we are aware of, yet deems it to be important to remain actively involved in the lives of an insignificant species scurrying around a nondescript planet, circling an equally insignificant star on the edge of a galaxy that sits on the edge of cosmos is incomprehensible.
Let's cut out your rambling for a second. Theonlyreason you see God as the source of existence is because you have faith in it. You have no evidence to even suggest that God created anything other than you want that to be true.Observable things in existence only mean these things exist. None of it points back to God. You're commiting a post hoc fallacy.
You do not know that for sure. In my case, I came to believe by experience when I did NOT want it to be true and did NOT believe it was! I was convinced it was all BS! That sort of thing does NOT constitute "You have no evidence to even suggest . . ."
Quote:
But I'm pretty sure Scarmig has already gone over that twice now. Empiricism provides a universal truth. What one person observe is repeatable and testable by everyone, and they all get the same results. That's pretty much the definition of reality and truth. Everything is the same for everyone.
It should be repeatable for everyone . . . but it cannot be done second hand. It must be achieved personally by each of us.
Quote:
"Personal revelation," doesn't do that. There is no universal truth nor universal experience between the people. If there were, there would be one religion since the outset of mankinds first theistic thoughts. Again, scarmig already went over this.
You continue to conflate and confuse what is BELIEVED about reality and reality itself. They are NOT the same.
Quote:
God isn't a reality because that revelation is inconsistent, and there is no evidence that actually points to him. You just want the evidence to point to God. Your revelation points to God. Since revelations are inconsistent measurements of truth, it is rejected as a measurement of truth. You wouldn't use a scale that gave you a different weight every time you stepped on it, would you?
You have not taken the time or discipline to test it for yourself . . . so you do not personally have any evidence to "suggest" it is true. That is NOT true for others who are less lazy or dismissive.
To imagine a god so powerful and so omnipotent that it could create even the small fraction of the universe that we are aware of, yet deems it to be important to remain actively involved in the lives of an insignificant species scurrying around a nondescript planet, circling an equally insignificant star on the edge of a galaxy that sits on the edge of cosmos is incomprehensible.
To say the least. Thinking about it for too long creates some pretty incoherent thoughts.
I keep myself up at night sometimes imagining just how expansive and fantastically huge the universe is. Just our galaxy is flabbergasting massive. Our solar system is ridiculously large. Pluto is about 40 AU away, with Jupiter being just 5AU. That is so far away. Then to think that the nearest start is some 4.4 light years away, the nearest galaxy is in the millions of light years away. It is just wild.
You do not know that for sure. In my case, I came to believe by experience when I did NOT want it to be true and did NOT believe it was! I was convinced it was all BS! That sort of thing does NOT constitute "You have no evidence to even suggest . . ." It should be repeatable for everyone . . . but it cannot be done second hand. It must be achieved personally by each of us. You continue to conflate and confuse what is BELIEVED about reality and reality itself. They are NOT the same.You have not taken the time or discipline to test it for yourself . . . so you do not personally have any evidence to "suggest" it is true. That is NOT true for others who are less lazy or dismissive.
Personal Revelation is inconsistent, even for people who are less lazy than me. Claiming otherwise is certainly a No-True Scotsman fallacy. If revelation is inconsistent, then it is an inconsistent measure of reality and rightfully should be thrown out.
Observation is repeatable, testable, and everyone gets the same experience, regardless of past belief or current wants. As Scarmig said, we can both drop and apple and watch it fall. Same experience, same reality. This is a good measure of discovering truth.
Your personal anecdotal stories of revelation are inconsistent with other personal anecdotal stories of revelation. Conflicting stories are not evidence for determining reality. You can be as happy as you want with your oxygen starved brain, it doesn't make what your dreaming to be true.
How strange. When I consider complex grandeur of the universe, I am not unsettled but rather struck by an absolute sense of awe. fFar more, in fact, than I have ever been while trying to contemplate even the most fabulous vision of god.
To imagine a god so powerful and so omnipotent that it could create even the small fraction of the universe that we are aware of, yet deems it to be important to remain actively involved in the lives of an insignificant species scurrying around a nondescript planet, circling an equally insignificant star on the edge of a galaxy that sits on the edge of cosmos is incomprehensible.
It would perhaps be more comprehensible to you if you realized that we are no less significant to God than the individual cells of our brain are to us. Surely such infinitesimal components among the vastness of our brain's complexity are of no importance. Right???
To say the least. Thinking about it for too long creates some pretty incoherent thoughts.
I keep myself up at night sometimes imagining just how expansive and fantastically huge the universe is. Just our galaxy is flabbergasting massive. Our solar system is ridiculously large. Pluto is about 40 AU away, with Jupiter being just 5AU. That is so far away. Then to think that the nearest start is some 4.4 light years away, the nearest galaxy is in the millions of light years away. It is just wild.
And yet . . . ALL of it is as "close" as your own thoughts!
Personal Revelation is inconsistent, even for people who are less lazy than me. Claiming otherwise is certainly a No-True Scotsman fallacy. If revelation is inconsistent, then it is an inconsistent measure of reality and rightfully should be thrown out.
Observation is repeatable, testable, and everyone gets the same experience, regardless of past belief or current wants. As Scarmig said, we can both drop and apple and watch it fall. Same experience, same reality. This is a good measure of discovering truth.
Your personal anecdotal stories of revelation are inconsistent with other personal anecdotal stories of revelation. Conflicting stories are not evidence for determining reality. You can be as happy as you want with your oxygen starved brain, it doesn't make what your dreaming to be true.
Personal perceptions of reality always differ in the SPECIFICS . . . but not in the essentials.
To say the least. Thinking about it for too long creates some pretty incoherent thoughts.
I keep myself up at night sometimes imagining just how expansive and fantastically huge the universe is. Just our galaxy is flabbergasting massive. Our solar system is ridiculously large. Pluto is about 40 AU away, with Jupiter being just 5AU. That is so far away. Then to think that the nearest start is some 4.4 light years away, the nearest galaxy is in the millions of light years away. It is just wild.
Yes, it makes realize how trivial theist have made their god. To think that their god's greatest achievement was to create a tiny parasitic organism now that is anthropomorphic arrogance at its best.
http://www.topglobes.com/files/1862727/uploaded/National%20Geo%20Universe%20Map.jpg (broken link)
I don't know if you can make out the bottom map, but it is like one of those nested Russian dolls. Our solar system in in the bottom right corner and fits into the cylinder above, which fits into the cylinder to its left and so and and so on until you get the cylinder representing the universe.
The essentials being human ignorance. I don't understand X, so supernatural (or for you "natural,") entity Z must have done it.
How inerested are you in thinking outside the box? There are many theories out there that substantially coincide with my views on the universal field (if not the source of it). There is also a website that does present a specifically panentheistic view of the universal field in ways that are consistent with my source as God's consciousness. When taken in conjunction with the evidence suggesting that a "perfect fluid" may be the "substance" of the universe (the discarded notion of an ether) . . . it makes for interesting speculation. The wave-particle duality, indeterminacy, and the notion of the Higgs boson (God particle) make far less sense in comparison. Here is the website and the article of the news release from the RHIC at Brookhaven on their findings :
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
