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Fom another thread claiming the Word says everyone will eventually be saved.
1Tim 2:4-God will have all to be saved
1Tim 2:4-God desires all to come to the knowledge of truth
1Tim 2:6-Salvation of all is testified in due time
1Jn 4:42-Jesus is Savior of the world
Jn 12:32-Jesus will draw all mankind unto Himself
Col 1:16-By Him all were created
Rm 5:15-21-In Adam all condemned, in Christ all live
1Cor 15:22-In Adam all die, in Christ all live
Rm 11:26-All Israel will be saved
Eph 2:7-His grace shown in the ages to come
Titus 2:11-Grace has appeared to all
1Cor 4:5-All will have praise of God
Jms 5:11-End of the Lord is full of mercy
Rm 11:32-All subject to unbelief, mercy on all
Jn 5:25-All dead who hear will live
Jn 5:28-All in the grave will hear & come forth-
Ps 46:10-God will do all His pleasure-
Gen 18:18-All families of the earth will be blessed
Dan 4:35-God's will done in heaven and earth
Ps 33:15-God fashions all hearts-
Prv 16:9-Man devises, God directs his steps-
La 3:31,32-God will not cast off forever
Ps 72:18-God only does wondrous things
Jer 32:17-Nothing is too difficult for Him
Ps 145:9-He is good to all-
Ps 145:9-His mercies are over all his works
Ps 145:14-He raises all who fall-
Jn 6:44-No one can come to Him unless He draws them.
Jn 12:32-I will draw all mankind unto Myself
Now let us take those verses in context and see what is actually said. If you do not claim a belief in Christ this really does not apply to you.
1 Timothy 2:
4Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
5For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
6Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.
He indeed wants us all to be saved...but what does the bible say about rejecting this ransom?
John 3:
35The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.
36He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
John 4:
41And many more believed because of his own word;
42And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world.
Yes, He came to save the World....but not all in the World will accept His saving Grace. Hence the whole of the World will not be saved.
John 12: 26If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.
27Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour.
28Father, glorify thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again.
29The people therefore, that stood by, and heard it, said that it thundered: others said, An angel spake to him.
30Jesus answered and said, This voice came not because of me, but for your sakes.
31Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.
33This he said, signifying what death he should die.
34The people answered him, We have heard out of the law that Christ abideth for ever: and how sayest thou, The Son of man must be lifted up? who is this Son of man?
35Then Jesus said unto them, Yet a little while is the light with you. Walk while ye have the light, lest darkness come upon you: for he that walketh in darkness knoweth not whither he goeth.
36While ye have light, believe in the light, that ye may be the children of light. These things spake Jesus, and departed, and did hide himself from them.
37But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him:
38That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?
39Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,
40He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.
41These things said Esaias, when he saw his glory, and spake of him.
42Nevertheless among the chief rulers also many believed on him; but because of the Pharisees they did not confess him, lest they should be put out of the synagogue:
43For they loved the praise of men more than the praise of God.
44Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me.
45And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me.
46I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness.
47And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
48He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
49For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.
50And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.
As for Colossians 1:16 we as Christians have no doubt who the Creator is... but that has nothing to do with whether or not all will be saved.
Let us though continue in the chapter:
17And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
18And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
19For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
20And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
Here again nothing is said of the entire earth being saved, but we can be reconciled to Him through His blood.
Romans 5: 1Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
2By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.
3And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;
4And patience, experience; and experience, hope:
5And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
6For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
7For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.
8But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
9Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
10For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
11And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.
12Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
13(For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
14Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
15But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.
16And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.
17For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)
18Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
19For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
20Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound:
21That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
Not all but many...and only through Christ.
1 Corinthians 15:
1Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain....
15Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.
16For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:
17And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.
18Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.
19If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.
20But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
21For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
It again does not say here all will be saved, but that He died for all. But His gift must be accepted.
Romans 11: 20Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
21For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
22Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.
24For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert grafted contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?
25For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
26And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
27For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
28As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.
29For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
30For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
31Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
32For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
33O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
34For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?
35Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again?
36For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.
Does not speak to the whole of the Word being saved.
Ephesians 2
4But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
5Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved
6And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
7That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
8For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Titus 2: 11For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
12Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
13Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
14Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
1 Corinthians 4:
4For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord.
5Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.
And every man shall praise Him, that does not mean every man will be saved.
James 5:
1Go to now, ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you.
2Your riches are corrupted, and your garments are motheaten.
3Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. Ye have heaped treasure together for the last days.
4Behold, the hire of the labourers who have reaped down your fields, which is of you kept back by fraud, crieth: and the cries of them which have reaped are entered into the ears of the Lord of sabaoth.
5Ye have lived in pleasure on the earth, and been wanton; ye have nourished your hearts, as in a day of slaughter.
6Ye have condemned and killed the just; and he doth not resist you.
7Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the husbandman waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receive the early and latter rain.
8Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh.
9Grudge not one against another, brethren, lest ye be condemned: behold, the judge standeth before the door.
10Take, my brethren, the prophets, who have spoken in the name of the Lord, for an example of suffering affliction, and of patience.
11Behold, we count them happy which endure. Ye have heard of the patience of Job, and have seen the end of the Lord; that the Lord is very pitiful, and of tender mercy. ...
19Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
20Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.
Nothing again about all being saved, just that God is a god of mercy.. hence He sent His Son....
John 5:
21For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will.
22For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
23That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
24Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
25Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
26For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;
27And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
28Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. Those are the verses from the NT, and how nothing states we will all be saved, even those who reject the Son. It says quite the opposite.
MBG
Wow midnightbirdgirl you did a lot of work on that post and I applaud you. No I do not believe everyone will be saved. Yes God wants everyone to be saved, but not everyone will accept Him as savior. Thank you for taking to the time to go through all those verses.
So basically, you knew the answer before you posted the question, or you felt you did.
Wouldn't it have been braver to title this "The Word does NOT teach that all will be saved"?
Just curious. What's being accomplished here? As you said, it was already being addressed.
If you had started the thread because you honestly wanted people's opinions, then it would make a lot more sense. Rather, you posted a long list which only actually has a key point every eighth, ninth, tenth-ish line.
Hint: It doesn't look more impressive just because it's filled up.
Now. Are you actually curious? Do you actually want to see where people have located scripture that all people will be saved? Or is this another universal condemnation of all non-messianic Jews? Let me know and I'll see what I can dig up.
I agree with you MNBG: not all will be saved. There are those who simply will not repent, will not believe, and will not come to Jesus and ask for forgiveness and eternal life through Him. There are even those who willingly serve the enemy...needless to say, they will not be saved unless they likewise repent. I really cannot understand why people would not want God in their life...
So basically, you knew the answer before you posted the question, or you felt you did.
Wouldn't it have been braver to title this "The Word does NOT teach that all will be saved"?
Just curious. What's being accomplished here? As you said, it was already being addressed.
If you had started the thread because you honestly wanted people's opinions, then it would make a lot more sense. Rather, you posted a long list which only actually has a key point every eighth, ninth, tenth-ish line.
Hint: It doesn't look more impressive just because it's filled up.
Now. Are you actually curious? Do you actually want to see where people have located scripture that all people will be saved? Or is this another universal condemnation of all non-messianic Jews? Let me know and I'll see what I can dig up.
JerZ - do I detect a chip on your shoulder? No need. The post is not directed at "non-messianic Jews", nor is it "another universal condemnation.
You really need to do a little more study of Judaism (which I think you said you don't believe anyway). Scripture tells us that "all Israel will be saved".
Now, I don't know exactly how God will do this, but I believe His word.
The topic will surely deteriorate if people start out by picking at the wording of the title.
This is an excellent topic about a subject much misunderstood by non-believers and debated among members of different denominations.
Why can't people follow instructions anymore? I read all of the OP I just wanted your answer in a simple form YES or NO why was that diffacult??
But since you don't want to "play" I happen to agree with you And what you posted was only a sampling of the many Scriptures to this issue.
I think her reply was a long-winded Yes.
midnightbirdgirl - excellent! Thank you.
Last edited by swbtoo; 06-14-2007 at 07:19 AM..
Reason: line
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Why can't people follow instructions anymore? I read all of the OP I just wanted your answer in a simple form YES or NO why was that diffacult??
