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Old 12-05-2009, 02:52 PM
 
Location: Lower Eastside
402 posts, read 978,205 times
Reputation: 370

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Quote:
Originally Posted by tilli View Post
This isn't an eviction. This is a landlord choosing not to renew the month-to-month lease, and either party is able to do that (with proper notice) for any reason or no reason. It's kind of the entire point of a month to month lease. So long as the landlord serves the notice as legally required and allows the tenant to live out the remaining lease term (i.e. 30 days), I don't see that she has any choice but to move.

If she wants a little more security, next time she should sign a new lease when the first one runs out, and maybe she should consider something like a TV armoire with doors where she can hide the altar from judgmental eyes. Not that she should have to do that, but that's reality as a member of a minority religion that people have a lot of misconceptions about.
Exactly! On a month to month neither party needs to do more than give notice that they are terminating. You don't need a reason.
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Old 12-06-2009, 12:15 PM
 
Location: Florida
335 posts, read 1,312,440 times
Reputation: 311
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lacerta View Post
Where did the OP say there was a witness? The friend is the one who is the tenant, so it is their word against the landlords.
My bad, guess I mis-understood the post when I first read it.
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Old 12-10-2009, 04:54 AM
 
Location: Chapel Hill, N.C.
36,499 posts, read 54,180,309 times
Reputation: 47920
Ok now I am thinking I should put a no candles clause in my leases. Is that legal? How do you enforce that kind of lifestyle issue?
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Old 12-10-2009, 05:16 AM
 
Location: Lower Eastside
402 posts, read 978,205 times
Reputation: 370
A no candles or other open flame clause could probably be part of the lease as a safety reason.
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Old 12-10-2009, 05:44 PM
 
15 posts, read 57,999 times
Reputation: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by just1paul View Post
A no candles or other open flame clause could probably be part of the lease as a safety reason.
I'll assume the landlords who have this in the lease aren't leasing properties with gas stoves or fireplaces?

Seriously, there is no way I'd sign a lease with a clause like this. That is moving into lifestyle territory. I take a lot of pride in the way my home looks, and in my entertaining. I'm not going to live somewhere where I can't light candles on the dinner table or during a romantic occasion. I'd feel the same if told I couldn't hang artwork or draperies.

There are tons of things that could cause damage if you behave irresponsibly. For example, overflowing a bathtub could cause a ton of damage, but does anyone have shower only clauses?

You can have whatever legal restrictions you want since it's your property, but I'd think it would limit your pool of good tenant prospects. For those who have the candle clause, has anyone ever refused to sign because of it?

Last edited by lfrench; 12-10-2009 at 06:26 PM.. Reason: trying to be more concise
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Old 12-10-2009, 06:45 PM
 
Location: Lower Eastside
402 posts, read 978,205 times
Reputation: 370
Quote:
Originally Posted by lfrench View Post
I'll assume the landlords who have this in the lease aren't leasing properties with gas stoves or fireplaces?

Seriously, there is no way I'd sign a lease with a clause like this. That is moving into lifestyle territory. I take a lot of pride in the way my home looks, and in my entertaining. I'm not going to live somewhere where I can't light candles on the dinner table or during a romantic occasion. I'd feel the same if told I couldn't hang artwork or draperies.

There are tons of things that could cause damage if you behave irresponsibly. For example, overflowing a bathtub could cause a ton of damage, but does anyone have shower only clauses?

You can have whatever legal restrictions you want since it's your property, but I'd think it would limit your pool of good tenant prospects. For those who have the candle clause, has anyone ever refused to sign because of it?
Can I say whoops?
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Old 12-10-2009, 08:30 PM
JS1
 
1,896 posts, read 6,774,110 times
Reputation: 1622
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady View Post
Fair Housing laws are federal, not state.

From the HUD website section on the Fair Housing Act:

In the Sale and Rental of Housing: No one may take any of the following actions based on race, color, national origin, religion, sex, familial status or handicap:

  • REFUSE TO RENT or sell housing
  • Refuse to negotiate for housing
  • Make housing unavailable
  • Deny a dwelling
  • Set different terms, conditions or privileges for sale or rental of a dwelling
  • Provide different housing services or facilities
  • Falsely deny that housing is available for inspection, sale, or rental
  • For profit, persuade owners to sell or rent (blockbusting) or
  • Deny anyone access to or membership in a facility or service (such as a multiple listing service) related to the sale or rental of housing.
Also,

What Housing Is Covered?
The Fair Housing Act covers most housing. In some circumstances, the Act exempts owner-occupied buildings with no more than four units, single-family housing sold or rented without the use of a broker, and housing operated by organizations and private clubs that limit occupancy to members.




It sounds to me like the landlord is in violation, but your friend needs to contact either an attorney or, if one is available in her area, a Tenant's Council for advice.

The section I capitalized is exactly what the landlord is doing -- refusing to rent to this person on the basis of religion (assuming the landlord has at least 5 units).

This is housing discrimination. It isn't an eviction issue.

Please file a lawsuit for housing discrimination on the basis of religion. Teach the bigoted landlord a lesson!
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Old 12-10-2009, 08:40 PM
JS1
 
1,896 posts, read 6,774,110 times
Reputation: 1622
Quote:
Originally Posted by kodaka View Post
That would be a fire hazard. But I agree with the sentiment. She shouldn't have to, but it might just be easier to go that route than deal with the judgement and fallout.

I agree this isn't really an eviction, so the landlord doesn't have to provide any reason. Even if she tried to fight it, and had proof in the form of witnesses or written evidence, all the landlord has to do is say that her religion isn't the reason for the eviction; he wants to renovate and market the apartment as a luxury unit. Or rent it to his mother in law. And he doesn't need any proof that he plans to do those things. The burden of proof would be on the tenant.

Discrimination is a lot easier to see than it is to prove in court.
I suppose he could lie under oath (pretty dumb), but that certainly shouldn't stop her from filing a lawsuit.

Why do you say that a witness or written evidence would be disregarded because the landlord says "no, that's not it"? That's silly. We may as well not have any laws because they could never be enforced.
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Old 12-11-2009, 12:13 AM
 
6,066 posts, read 15,065,742 times
Reputation: 7188
If I felt my landlord was being a turd to me because of a religious or spiritual difference between he and I, I would be thrilled to NOT be in a lease with him, and 30 days couldn't go by fast enough so I wouldn't have to deal with him and his insecurities and misconceptions any longer. I think your friend is lucky that she never signed another lease with this ignoramus. Sad that she has to/had to move, but hopefully she'll find an even better place to call home.
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Old 12-11-2009, 01:15 AM
 
2,638 posts, read 6,027,944 times
Reputation: 2378
Quote:
Originally Posted by lfrench View Post
I'll assume the landlords who have this in the lease aren't leasing properties with gas stoves or fireplaces?

Seriously, there is no way I'd sign a lease with a clause like this. That is moving into lifestyle territory. I take a lot of pride in the way my home looks, and in my entertaining. I'm not going to live somewhere where I can't light candles on the dinner table or during a romantic occasion. I'd feel the same if told I couldn't hang artwork or draperies.

There are tons of things that could cause damage if you behave irresponsibly. For example, overflowing a bathtub could cause a ton of damage, but does anyone have shower only clauses?

You can have whatever legal restrictions you want since it's your property, but I'd think it would limit your pool of good tenant prospects. For those who have the candle clause, has anyone ever refused to sign because of it?
Pray that you never end up in a complex owned by me.

I mean I'm reading all of these responses from people complaining about not having candles. Let me tell you something - there are tasteful candles, and then there are inappropriate candles. Tasteful candles - one or maybe two slim candles on a dinner table - no problem. Having candles all along the fireplace and all along the windowsills and all over the tables - nuh uh.

The city had hope I don't end up managing an apartment. The contract would be clear.

  • No dogs. Period. Any other pet is fine, but must be kept in the house, on a leash, or in a cage at all times.
  • No musical instruments played after 7pm. Rent the clubhouse if you want to practice all night, with the volume low enough that the building next door can't hear anything.
  • Dedicated trash pickup - so we can track who's not putting the trash out properly and fine them.
  • MUST park your vehicle in your garage; every day you don't is a fine. Second vehicles must be tagged clearly, visitors must get a visitor's pass with the apartment they're going to.
  • Speeders get a speeding ticket like any other region.
  • Occupancy limits to every apartment. 1 bedroom is 3 people at ANY time. If you have any more than that, friends or otherwise, you need to go to the 2+ bedrooms and pay for that privilege.
  • Religion can be practiced as long as there is no impact to others. In the case of the OP, the landlord can argue that such religion might have proved distracting or offensive to neighbors and as such, they chose not to renew the contract which is their right. That's the reason the month-to-month lease is worded the way it is - either party can terminate anytime. If the person did not want to have the issue they should have been in a lease - then if the lease was terminated due to this, there would be a clear case for FHA violation.
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