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Disability fraud is at epidemic levels - I personally know 2 former friends that "found out" how easy it would be to fake it. Neither were this way when we were truly friends but now it is the easy way out. Just be a good actor - go to the doctor for a bit - many of these people are hypochondriacs (sp) so this is nothing new to them. The tracks are already there.
One has MS, but, her meds work for her. She got me to go downtown one night to see her son in a band that was playing - danced her little heart out. A few days later I was over there and she went and pulled her leg brace out "Because I have to go to the DR". Are you having any problems? "Well, no" She never uses that leg brace except for Dr visits.
Anybody that doesn't believe that there is a lot of fraud out there is kidding themselves. No, I have never applied for, been denied or received any type of disability payments.
Been denied Social Security disability benefits? Let our prestigious law firm help you get the benefits you so deserve. There will be no fee to you if we do not get your benefits approved. These ads run constantly, so must be quite lucrative with lots of approvals. Must have found a loophole or two to beat the system.
Haven't filed income taxes for 7+ years and owe the IRS $30,000 dollars or more? Our prestigious law firm will get the IRS off your back and settle the claim for pennies on the dollar. There will be no fee to you, if we do not satisfactorily settle your claim. Must have found a loophole or two to beat the system.
Been in an accident? We will get a hefty settlement for you. We will work our fingers to the bone to get you what you deserve. No need for you to do anything. Our law firm is very compasionate to you the victim. No fee, unless we settle for you. A very lucrative income stream.
I understand that some of the posters are only talking about fraud. They have stated so in their posts. It is common knowlege, that SS, Medicare & Medicaid is riddled with fraud to the tune of billions of dollars.
OldCoder, I believe you placed your mother in a nursing home, at taxpayer expense.
And furthermore, this has absolutely nothing to do with what I was talking about. I didn't try to cheat the taxpayers so I could stay home in bed. My mother is very disabled and needs full time care. There was no fraud involved.
And there definitely must be something wrong with the system. I know someone personally who got disability, and she has a very active social life which includes dancing and long trips. She told me it would be too painful for her to sit in an office all day. But dancing or sitting in a car all day is not a problem, apparently.
Some of the people who find ways not to work think we are stupid suckers for having a job. They just don't see how we can go to the same office every day and get bossed around. Well, they would do the same if they had to work to survive. People will somehow pull themselves together when survival is at stake.
All these examples of disability fraud are anecdotal and not necessarily indicative of the whole. To say that it is "common knowledge" in not evidence of truth; it is not the basic for condemnation of the whole.
If we say that government workers are under worked and overpaid; and it is common knowledge that they are overcompensated with assured pensions--it is true for all? Does it also mean that that the whole system should be condemned?
Reason would say in a large social security system that there is disability fraud. Reason would also say in a large government employment system there is abuse of pay, benefits and work. That is because we reasonably assume there exist no perfect system, in an in-perfect world, the rewards and incentives for fraud and abuse are there; and will be taken advantage by some.
So the question is: Do we need a disability system? and Do we need government employees? Some would argue that we do not need either. With no disability program: let those who can survive, exist; and let those who cannot, perish. That is an efficient and less costly means of social control. Much of the government work has been contracted out because it is believed it can be done, with less cost and more efficiency. Some would argue that less government is the best government, with less government employees to cater and pamper.
I think everyone is glad to contribute to those who are genuinely disabled. We know that their families might not be able to take care of them, or they might not have families. But it's hard to know who really needs help and who is taking advantage. Our government agencies don't seem to be able to tell the difference. I realize it's difficult and complicated. Maybe there are people who are prevented from working because of ADD and PTSD and chronic fatigue, etc.. But when I see people coming in to work right after cancer surgery, then I have to wonder why the person with ADD has to stay in bed all day.
just a quickie here - (and then back to bed ) - obviously a hot topic and i think i'll refrain from saying too much because i've likely argued in favor of both "sides". But i did have to throw in something on behalf of the ADDers and others with somewhat invisible issues................
on second thought, maybe i'll just put this off or avoid the issue altogether ............
but I'd dare say that most people with ADD do not stay in bed all day .....unless they are suffering from serious depression, anxiety or other conditions that can and often do accompany such a diagnosis.
We all endure many things, and we all react to those things differently. A key componant that differentiates between an obstacle/challenge and a disabling condition is the degree of impact on one's work/one's relationships/one's overall life.
Fraud is a reality and the taxpayers pay for it. I have personally known individuals on SS-disability who were physically able to work but mentally unable to sustain the continuity of a job. I don't know why ~ but there seems to be an increase in those conditions..... bipolar, high functioning autistic, etc.
Is mental illness, along with obesity, on the increase ? I wonder why !
Fraud has always been around. I haven't heard of an increase in claims based on mental illness and it appears that few claims are awarded based on mental illness. However, I was absolutely astounded by the number of obese claimants. Very few claimants, if any, mentioned their obesity - but, part of my job was identifying anyone who was obese (via medical records that recorded his or her weight) and making note of it. (Obesity can severely exacerbate other impairments.) I'd say in about 80% of the claims I reviewed, obesity was a factor. OTOH, I only saw a couple of smokers. I don't know if the smokers died off before they were able to collect disability, or if the low numbers merely reflect a reduced number of smokers in the general population. I absolutely believe the obesity "epidemic" is the greatest threat to both Social Security Disability and Medicare. OTOH, the obese are more likely to die at a younger age - and will probably collect little of their retirement benefits.
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Quote:
livecontent: All these examples of disability fraud are anecdotal and not necessarily indicative of the whole.
No, it's not anecdotal -- that's why I get so upset. Why in the world do you think the investigators are coming in for our claims now? Oh, believe me, if I were allowed to tell, I would -- but by law I am not allowed to. There is plenty of evidence to the contrary. It's only recently that California is clamping down.
Quote:
And I agree with SCBaker: SCBaker : Legal fraud? Been denied Social Security disability benefits? Let our prestigious law firm help you get the benefits you so deserve. There will be no fee to you if we do not get your benefits approved. These ads run constantly, so must be quite lucrative with lots of approvals. Must have found a loophole or two to beat the system.
Haven't filed income taxes for 7+ years and owe the IRS $30,000 dollars or more? Our prestigious law firm will get the IRS off your back and settle the claim for pennies on the dollar. There will be no fee to you, if we do not satisfactorily settle your claim. Must have found a loophole or two to beat the system.
Been in an accident? We will get a hefty settlement for you. We will work our fingers to the bone to get you what you deserve. No need for you to do anything. Our law firm is very compasionate to you the victim. No fee, unless we settle for you. A very lucrative income stream.
I understand that some of the posters are only talking about fraud. They have stated so in their posts. It is common knowlege, that SS, Medicare & Medicaid is riddled with fraud to the tune of billions of dollars.
It's no secret. Those who legitimately are receiving benefits, I have absolutely no problem with. I noticed no one mentioned anything about my dad losing EVERYTHING to the government because he had to go into a nursing home! Somehow that was ignored. It's an unfair, and often illegal system. Sorry, but it is. Those who truly need it, deserve it. But to see a man lose every single thing he has to the government to be able to receive benefits, is so upsetting to me, when I see other people receiving benefits and NOT losing every single thing they own! There is obviously a disparity here. A very unfair disparity.
I understand that people want their benefits. I get it. But I do believe the law is very skewed. And the people I've known, like others have mentioned, who fake it, pretend, lie, and do all sorts of things to get out of working, is just appalling.
No, I do not believe that the system is equal and fair. As SCBaker mentioned, there are plenty of attorneys willing to "fight for" the SSD "rights." Now, knowing attorneys, I'd guess there was definitely something in it for them.
In fact, I had a very close friend (who, unfortunately died a year ago) who was an appellate attorney. He literally made things up on his briefs. Oh, I kid you not. In fact, I often helped him with some of his paralegal work. I'd say, "Why do you say that so and so did this, when obviously that did not happen?" And he'd answer, "Because it could have happened." When I took the LSAT for Law School, I was torn. My attorney friend told me I should be a defender -- I said I did not have the morals for it -- I could not twist the truth just for the bucks. A prosecutor, now that I could do. So, I know from close association how all this manipulation of the facts occur. I just don't agree with it.
Obviously, those who do defraud the government, feel okay about it. They are not like me (which I wish I wasn't like this) who would fret and worry about lying or exaggerating. I just don't have the moral fiber for it. Sometimes I wish I did -- but I just don't.
I think we should drop this subject and let it go. No one ever responded to my father losing everything -- that is significant to me -- no one cares about people like that! People often feel very entitled -- I see it over and over and over again.
Believe me, I have had my heart and soul trampled many times because of my ability to empathize and have great compassion....however, I am learning that I cannot trust everyone, and I do now cut off those whom I learn are getting away with skirting the law. It is just who I am. Granted, I realize I am in the minority.....
Fraud has always been around. I haven't heard of an increase in claims based on mental illness and it appears that few claims are awarded based on mental illness. However, I was absolutely astounded by the number of obese claimants. Very few claimants, if any, mentioned their obesity - but, part of my job was identifying anyone who was obese (via medical records that recorded his or her weight) and making note of it. (Obesity can severely exacerbate other impairments.) I'd say in about 80% of the claims I reviewed, obesity was a factor. OTOH, I only saw a couple of smokers. I don't know if the smokers died off before they were able to collect disability, or if the low numbers merely reflect a reduced number of smokers in the general population. I absolutely believe the obesity "epidemic" is the greatest threat to both Social Security Disability and Medicare. OTOH, the obese are more likely to die at a younger age - and will probably collect little of their retirement benefits.
I have read and learned from many of your post. I have agreed and I have disagreed. I do value your experience.
However, when I saw your statement "...it appears that few claims are awarded based on mental illness..." I knew that your statement is incorrect. Most awards are in the category of mental illness.
I will refer to the link from the most recent, released statistical information table, from Social Security, table 6, titled: Distribution, by sex and diagnostic group, December 2009
Please note that the data reflect composite information to the date. Mental Disorders as shown:
Mental disorders Total % men, % woman
Retardation 9.9, 7.9
Other 26.3, 28.9
The next highest level is:
Musculoskeletal system and connective tissue:
Total % men, % woman
23.3, 26.6
These are the only disorders that are in double digit by percent, the rest of the diagnosis are much smaller
Note that there is no epidemiological statistical data for obesity because that listing was removed and it would be determined as effecting other disorders. I suspect the high number of musculoskeletal system disorder can be attributed to large part by obesity and the prevalence of disabling disorders of arthritis, which are also effected by obesity, especially osteoarthritis.
So, other mental disorders are the largest reward for Social Security Disability. If you add Mental Retardation, total Mental Disorders are much higher.
I would also like to say that this data does not give the whole story. Many awards are made as a result of multiple impairments, which in total cause a disability. Severe physical disorders do effect your mental health, and could skew the mental health indexes higher but the award can based primarily on a physical disorder. I have no idea how the data is assembled but the data does not exceed 100% totally, so each individual must be assigned only one disabled rating.
Livecontent
Last edited by livecontent; 08-22-2010 at 09:15 PM..
No, it's not anecdotal -- that's why I get so upset. Why in the world do you think the investigators are coming in for our claims now? Oh, believe me, if I were allowed to tell, I would -- but by law I am not allowed to. There is plenty of evidence to the contrary. It's only recently that California is clamping down.
It's no secret. Those who legitimately are receiving benefits, I have absolutely no problem with. I noticed no one mentioned anything about my dad losing EVERYTHING to the government because he had to go into a nursing home! Somehow that was ignored. It's an unfair, and often illegal system. Sorry, but it is. Those who truly need it, deserve it. But to see a man lose every single thing he has to the government to be able to receive benefits, is so upsetting to me, when I see other people receiving benefits and NOT losing every single thing they own! There is obviously a disparity here. A very unfair disparity.
I understand that people want their benefits. I get it. But I do believe the law is very skewed. And the people I've known, like others have mentioned, who fake it, pretend, lie, and do all sorts of things to get out of working, is just appalling.
No, I do not believe that the system is equal and fair. As SCBaker mentioned, there are plenty of attorneys willing to "fight for" the SSD "rights." Now, knowing attorneys, I'd guess there was definitely something in it for them.
In fact, I had a very close friend (who, unfortunately died a year ago) who was an appellate attorney. He literally made things up on his briefs. Oh, I kid you not. In fact, I often helped him with some of his paralegal work. I'd say, "Why do you say that so and so did this, when obviously that did not happen?" And he'd answer, "Because it could have happened." When I took the LSAT for Law School, I was torn. My attorney friend told me I should be a defender -- I said I did not have the morals for it -- I could not twist the truth just for the bucks. A prosecutor, now that I could do. So, I know from close association how all this manipulation of the facts occur. I just don't agree with it.
Obviously, those who do defraud the government, feel okay about it. They are not like me (which I wish I wasn't like this) who would fret and worry about lying or exaggerating. I just don't have the moral fiber for it. Sometimes I wish I did -- but I just don't.
I think we should drop this subject and let it go. No one ever responded to my father losing everything -- that is significant to me -- no one cares about people like that! People often feel very entitled -- I see it over and over and over again.
Believe me, I have had my heart and soul trampled many times because of my ability to empathize and have great compassion....however, I am learning that I cannot trust everyone, and I do now cut off those whom I learn are getting away with skirting the law. It is just who I am. Granted, I realize I am in the minority.....
So, I will leave it there....
Again, all this disparate ranting is not indicative of the whole system and contains much hearsay and anecdotes. I am not questioning the truth of your statements. I am just saying, you cannot make an overall assumption from that information. Yes, there are inequities and inefficiencies but that does not mean the system as a whole should be discarded as fatally flawed.
Why should we address, now, your father's problem. Medicare, Medicaid, Nursing Home care are a big issue. Most of us face the same issue. Your father is not alone but may deserve sympathy.
I believe the Federal Government does good work with good people, regardless of some of the problems. The Legal Profession is not the cause of these problems; It serves a necessary and helpful function and sometimes it is misused; but that does mean it is evil.
Livecontent
Last edited by livecontent; 08-22-2010 at 09:03 PM..
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Legal fraud?
) - obviously a hot topic and i think i'll refrain from saying too much because i've likely argued in favor of both "sides". But i did have to throw in something on behalf of the ADDers and others with somewhat invisible issues................
I wonder why !
Somehow that was ignored. It's an unfair, and often illegal system. Sorry, but it is. Those who truly need it, deserve it. But to see a man lose every single thing he has to the government to be able to receive benefits, is so upsetting to me, when I see other people receiving benefits and NOT losing every single thing they own! There is obviously a disparity here. A very unfair disparity.
