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Well yeah people just love the mountains and desert country. People love to move of West and don't like Winter. . Its still a desert. Got flooding over here.
I have long found it humorous how the Western end of the Mohave Desert [specifically Victor Valley], went from a population of less than 100 [because there was not enough water to support any more] to a population of nearly 400,000 people today. There is still no water.
[Victorville, Hesperia, Apple Valley, Adelanto, Barstow, Daggett, El Mirage, Helendale, Hinkley, Hodge, Lenwood, Lucerne Valley, Newberry Springs, Oak Hills, Oro Grande, Phelan, Pinon Hills, Spring Valley Lake, and Yermo.]
Without any regard for the lack of water.
A great deal of the USA is drought-prone. Not all, but most.
Most of the self-sufficiency crowd of homesteaders on a dozen forums flock to drought-prone regions. Maybe this year will not be a drought, maybe.
I have long found it humorous how the Western end of the Mohave Desert [specifically Victor Valley], went from a population of less than 100 [because there was not enough water to support any more] to a population of nearly 400,000 people today. There is still no water.
[Victorville, Hesperia, Apple Valley, Adelanto, Barstow, Daggett, El Mirage, Helendale, Hinkley, Hodge, Lenwood, Lucerne Valley, Newberry Springs, Oak Hills, Oro Grande, Phelan, Pinon Hills, Spring Valley Lake, and Yermo.]
Without any regard for the lack of water.
A great deal of the USA is drought-prone. Not all, but most.
Most of the self-sufficiency crowd of homesteaders on a dozen forums flock to drought-prone regions. Maybe this year will not be a drought, maybe.
The basic premise of the theory was that human habitation and agriculture through homesteading effected a permanent change in the climate of arid and semi-arid regions, making these regions more humid. The theory was widely promoted in the 1870s as a justification for the settlement of the Great Plains, a region previously known as the "Great American Desert". It was also used to justify the expansion of wheat growing on marginal land in South Australia during the same period.
According to the theory, increased human settlement in the region and cultivation of soil would result in an increased rainfall over time, rendering the land more fertile and lush as the population increased. As later historical records of rainfall indicated, the theory was based on faulty evidence arising from brief climatological fluctuations. The theory was later refuted by climatologists and is now definitively regarded as pure superstition.
Thus the 'Great American Desert' became the 'Great Plains' filled with farmers hoping to change the climate from being drought-prone toward being sustainable.
....and from the Great American Desert, to the Great Plains to the Dust Bowl which brought about changes in farming practices and the introduction of irrigation to make the current phase, Bread Basket of America.
Problem is, unless some way is found to bring water to urbanized areas like Southern California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas as well as Utah and Nevada from water rich places like western Washington state or even Alaska, the amount of water currently available from sources like the Colorado river won't be enough to maintain and grow populations in these areas. It may be feasible to set up desalinization plants along the coast, but you still have to transport to the inland areas.
One reason the self sufficency and survivor types head to arid areas is the isolation, seperation from population centers, and the fact the land is a lot cheaper than in more arible regions.
In my state, most of the annual precip comes in the form of snow, and the eastern 2/3rds of the state are high plains with limited rainfall during the summer.
We have water, but the climate is such that very few folks want to try and make an agricultural living here on a small scale.
Plus we have the handicap of being pretty, so land prices are stupid high.
Most of the self-sufficiency crowd of homesteaders on a dozen forums flock to drought-prone regions. Maybe this year will not be a drought, maybe.
Climate isn't the most important quality for most people on this forum. The most cursory perusal of posts on this and similar fora leaves no doubt that what's most important to almost everyone is living in an area as free of government intrusion as possible. The second most important consideration is security, that is, an area with little or no crime. Northern states in the well-watered east are full of people who just love government and all of the benefits they believe that it provides. The results of the last two prsidential elections provide ample proof of this. Sure, you can find many rural areas that are right wing; but the little right wing counties must obey the laws imposed by the leftist population centers. Where there are liberals running the show finding a place any real distance from urban cesspools with their inevitable slopover of crime is impossible in most states. Some rural rest areas have been closed because of physical danger. Southern states have crime rates often as high as the north simply because of demographics.
There are climate considerations for most of us but they have little or nothing to do with growing seasons or rainfall; they are rather about weather disasters. In Florida residents know that hurricanes are a constant threat; survivalists know that as well but they know too that a narrow peninsula jammed with people is not an easy place to escape. Virtually all of the disastrous weather in this country occurs in the east.
It is a fact that heat kills more people every year than all other weather disasters combined. But people who die from heat almost always die because they have acted foolishly or not made preparations. When over 400 people died in Chicago in the summer of 1995 there was a singular lack of rational behavior. They refused to use air-conditioning because of the cost; they refused to open windows because they were afraid that their fellow Chicagoans would climb in.
People can find enough water for all their needs in the desert. Wells and rainwater are obvious but there are other ways as well. Complete recycling systems are workable and probably the best but few use them; people don't like to think of drinking their own sewage even though the water is crystal clear. Greenhouses, essentially large terraria, can provide humid environments anyplace. A vegetarian would do very well. People who wish can raise a few chickens for eggs and have a complete diet. Few families would be large enough or wasteful enough to require a pig or cow. Deserts have rivers and lakes which can provide large amounts of protein. Meat eaters can purchase what they wish just as they do today. Trade in luxury goods like meat is at least 15k years old.
But most important, the arid west has the people who are least friendly towards government. Their politics generates their culture. The best citizens are not slavishly law abiding; they generally despise the government and its minions.
You can grow lemons and asparagus in the desert but you can't grow freedom on the coasts.
....One reason the self sufficency and survivor types head to arid areas is the isolation, seperation from population centers, and the fact the land is a lot cheaper than in more arible regions.
There are arable regions that are rural with cheap land, low taxes, a lack of regulation and good gun-rights.
Quote:
... We have water, but the climate is such that very few folks want to try and make an agricultural living here on a small scale.
Plus we have the handicap of being pretty, so land prices are stupid high.
Climate is easy to learn to put up with, so long at the climate is consistent.
There are arable regions that are rural with cheap land, low taxes, a lack of regulation and good gun-rights.
I understand that which is why I said "One of the reasons". I know Maine and some other far more hospitable areas than Montana have good arable places, low taxes, lack of regulation and good gun rights, and folks move there too.
It is just the individual's decison that sends them to the forests of Maine or the deserts of Nevada.
Climate is easy to learn to put up with, so long at the climate is consistent.
I agree, but Montana does not have a consistant climate except it is usually bad. I usually count on a minimum of 6-7 months I will have to heat my home, growing season is less than 100 days, killing frosts can hit anytime of the summer.
Add to that winds that can be over 100 mph, and high winds can last for days. We can get heat waves and drought one month, and torrential rains and floods the next.
One summer you may be cutting hay in mid-June to save what you can because it is burning into the ground, the next year the hay is molding because the rains won't stop so the hay can cure before being baled.
Good weather conditions here are the exception, not the norm.
It's a tough place and I don't advocate for anybody except those with a thourough knowledge of living in this climate to even attempt it.
Problem is, unless some way is found to bring water to urbanized areas like ... as well as Utah and Nevada from water rich places like western Washington state or even Alaska, the amount of water currently available from sources like the Colorado river won't be enough to maintain and grow populations in these areas.
I've worried about this for years. Our little "island" of alpine mountains can only provide so much water to the surrounding desert. And this area is growing in population like a malignant tumor. To top it off, none of the planning people seem to care as long as the revenue is flowing freely into the government. Once in a while you might hear some bureaucrat on the news get "spooked" when water supplies get low. But, as soon as the next little thunderstorm comes by and dumps a few drops of rain, all is well again. I see it as a disaster-in-making. It's just a matter of time. This is the second driest state in the union and it's just a matter of time until a severe drought hits. It's a common thing around here, but the throngs of people flowing in here has been lucky because we haven't had a really severe drought since the boom started.
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