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I currently live in Ohio (originally from MO) and have been working for a CPA firm for the last 3.5 years...I want to move, and I'm torn between St. Louis and Chicago. I love St. Louis, have family in Olivette, and am a die-hard Cards fan, so moving here wouldn't be too huge of a transition. However, I love the energy of Chicago and the whole quality of life there.
As a single young professional (27 years old), I would like to hear a sales pitch of why I should choose St. Louis over Chicago. Please include things to do, nightlife, places to live/hang, quality of life, etc.
I moved to St. Louis when I was 22 (from Australia but I'd also lived in London) and after a few years in the Carolinas I'm moving back to the Lou Here are some of the top reasons to LOVE St. Louis- and what helped convince my husband that moving to St. Louis was the best thing to do!
-AFFORDABLE Cost of Living. In St. Louis you get a lot more bang for your buck than in comparable cities- definitely more than Chicago!
-St. Louis is officially the Best City for Cheapskates, and actually has more Museums and Libraries per capita than New York City or DC! (The more money you save in living, the more you'll have to travel, spend and enjoy life!)
-Two of the best streets in America are in St. Louis! Both Delmar Blvd (The Loop) and Washington Ave have recently received accolades placing them in the top 10 U.S. streets! They're constantly improving- a lot of bars, great dining, shops and nightlife are along both. I was hugely impressed at how far Washington Ave has come in just a few years
-The Natural Bridge Rd Project. UMSL recently received funding to turn a stretch of Natural Bridge Rd into a 'Great Street' and is apparently using The Loop as it's inspiration! It will include mixed use facilities with housing, bars, cafes and stores- once it's completed, it will undoubtedly be yet another spot to experience some nightlife!
-St. Louis has some of the most awesome original food choices. Aside from the typical St. Louis 'originals' like Ted Drewes, Imos and Toasted Ravioli, almost every cuisine you could possibly think of is to be found somewhere in St. Louis.
-The Casinos are awesome fun for a night out- whether it be to the bars or to the Black Jack or Roulette tables. You'll save so much money with St. Louis low cost of living that you can afford to go to the Casino guilt-free!
-St. Louis has a lot of amazing neighborhood choices within the city and metro. The Loop in U. City, Soulard (2nd Biggest Mardi Gras in the U.S.!), South Grand, Skinker DeBaliviere, Benton Park, Lafayette Square, Cherokee Lemp, Central West End, Midtown, the list goes on and on!
-St. Louis is getting a high speed rail link to Chicago- so if you do feel the need to go to Chicago for a weekend, it will feel even 'closer' within a couple of years. Speaking of which, St. Louis is ideally located for Road Trips. Whether you want the best of the Midwest or the best of the South- so many awesome cities are within a 5 hour drive! Hitting up the bars in Chicago or Nashville for a weekend is definitely a good time!
-If you're a Cardinals Fan... Cubs fans in Chicago will hate you
I hope that helps! I could go on and on about how St. Louis is fabulous- but I hope that helps in the meantime!
Thanks for the very informative response! St. Louis is a great place to get bang for your buck. That Chicago high-speed rail will be a great asset once that's in place. What's the estimated completion date for that?
I know St. Louis has all the amenities I would need. Obviously it's not Chicago, but no Midwest city comes close to what Chicago brings to the table. It's so fun, but so expensive. I was there last weekend, and it was ridiculous how much more things cost there than in Ohio. That's why St. Louis appeals to me because it's so affordable. And as far as I'm concerned, has more to offer than any city in Ohio.
I guess my main concern is the singles scene. How do you rank it with other Midwest cities? I've heard mixed reviews of it over the years, but have heard it's getting better.
I lived in Chicago for two years between 2007 and 2009 before moving to Kansas City for the SO's career and we loved it there, but after 3 years we're ready to move away from Kansas City and I think we've officially decided not to go back to Chicago as we once might have thought we would -- we're planning to move to St. Louis instead, and I feel really confident that it's not only the "right" decision for us, but it's also the one that will make us happiest. Let me tell you why:
St. Louis and Chicago actually have a lot in common when it comes to the general "feel" of the towns -- both are full of just the kind of urban grit that appeals to me with striking architecture, and both towns are big on their beer and sports cultures but with enough old money to still be home to some fabulous cultural institutions. And both, of course, are cities of neighborhoods -- that's where both really shine in my opinion.
There's not a shadow of a doubt that with Chicago's bigger size comes more to do and more gentrified neighborhoods to choose from, but I've found myself perfectly happy when I live in a great, walkable neighborhood with everything I could need in it. A friend of mine who recently moved to New York joked to me that she hadn't left a 10-block radius in almost 6 weeks because there was just no need to, so it's not as though most people are constantly enjoying everything the huge city has to offer. When we lived in Chicago we were just the same way -- we didn't really leave Wicker Park all that often simply because we loved it there.
But with its smaller size comes some serious disadvantages: cost and traffic being chief among them. And while Chicago has some of the prettiest 3-week summers around, winter will take its toll on you -- it certainly makes commuting more tedious and cumbersome.
Let me go back to cost for a moment -- it's a significant consideration for us. For what a condo would run us in Chicago's desirable neighborhoods we can have a historic single family home with a little back yard in a walkable neighborhood. For us, that makes St. Louis so much more viable in the long term. And access to the metrolink means you can head to downtown on Cardinals game days with no traffic and no need to draw straws to nominate the sober chauffeur. After the game you can be among the many who head to places near the stadium -- Broadway Oyster Bar is a classic. And when Kim Massie is playing at Beale on Broadway across the street you'd do well to go hear her. She has a big, bold incredible voice.
The Central West End is, without a doubt, one of the most walkable neighborhoods in the midwest, and although it's smaller than some of Chicago's top-tier 'hoods it's a great place to call home. And they even have Coffee Cartel, a 24-hour coffee shop for the night owls (and bonus, they have a liqor license for when you're craving coffee of the Irish persuasion)
Forest Park is truly one of the most lovely places I've ever been, and it's actually quite a bit larger than even New York's Central Park -- you can see a summertime show at the Muny, the largest and oldest outdoor ampitheatre in the U.S., spend some time at the St. Louis Art Museum, which is currently constructing a 200,000 sq/ft addition, enjoy an afternoon at the incredible St. Louis Zoo and on and on and on. Best thing about Forest Park -- everything is free. Even the Muny sets aside 1,500 free seats for every show. You could bike and walk its trails for a long time with no need for repeating. It's an incredible jewel.
The Loop, which was always technically a part of University City, has now started to spread east into the St. Louis city limits, and it's is a great place to catch a live show at the Pageant, Cicero's or Blueberry Hill (and Cicero's beer selction is epic), and the resurgence of downtown as exemplified by the Washington Avenue Loft District is fantastic -- if you're looking for the soft loft experience, there's an abundance of great choices in the vicinity. Soulard is probably known most for two major things: Its Farmer's Market and Mardi Gras, but it's also a neighborhood full of great bars and is an awesome way to spend an evening. Live music is ubiquitous.
The aforementioned Farmer's Market is one of the largest and oldest west of the Mississippi, but while the produce is solid, my favorite thing might be the abundance of people, music and even booze. There's this stand that sells bloody mary's (with a pickled green bean!) that makes my heart happy on a beautiful day.
Mardi Gras in Soulard is a force to be reckoned with -- it's actually the second largest in the U.S., second only to, of course, New Orleans -- believe me it gets pretty crazy and certainly somewhat sloppy and debauched as the day wears on. Also don't forget about St. Louis' epic St. Patrick's Day festivities in Dogtown every year (when it falls in the middle of the week you'd be stunned by how many people request the day off from work).
And then there's Fair St. Louis, a multi-day event celebrating the 4th of July. St. Louis really pulls out all the stops, and, again, it's free! I couldn't believe it the day I found out that Kansas City charges admission to its festivities -- and it's not even as good! They might be a touch past their prime, but St. Louis always seems to pull in some solid well-known bands. I know Third Eye Blind was among the entertainers this year.
This is quickly turning into a novel, so suffice to say St. Louis is a great person to be young -- plenty to do at prices you can actually afford -- honestly it just doesn't get much better than that!
As far as HSR, it's a long-term project, but this fall they're expecting to complete the upgrades between Dwight and Pontiac and start running the trains at 110 mph. The entire line could be completed as early as three years from now. Lots more on the project can be found here: Official IDOT Illinois High Speed Rail - Chicago to St. Louis: About the Project
I was single for the majority of the time I lived in St. Louis and never had trouble meeting people or getting dates. If anything, it was easier than the UK and Australia.
The majority of the 20-somethings I worked with were single, but hitting up Soulard never failed me either
I definitely wouldn't worry about the singles scene in St. Louis- it's decent, or at least in my experience it was!
EDIT: My advantage was my Australian/British accent- but regardless of that I still think the 'singles scene' was perfectly acceptable!
I chose St. Louis over Chicago when deciding where to go to law school. What I love about St. Louis is that it feels like a big city but it's still very manageable, not to mention affordable! I live in the Central West End, which a lot of people regard as the premier neighborhood of the city, for a fraction of the price it would cost to live in the premier neighborhood of Chicago. I have a metro station, a yoga studio, a handful of coffee shops, two grocery stores, two movie theaters, Forest Park, and dozens of restaurants not more than a 10-15 minute walk away.
Of course, there's not as much hustle and bustle as Chicago but I think there's just the right amount. It's enough to feel the energy but not overwhelming. The people are very nice as well, which is always a plus. It's really easy to break into the scene and make your mark. I can also really dig the amount of civic pride here--most people who choose St. Louis love it.
Thanks for all the insightful info everyone. Yeah I think if I chose here, I would either choose Clayton, U-City, or CWE. They all seem to have enough vibrancy to them, as well as a pretty good night-life. My company actually has a branch in downtown if I decided to transfer, but I think I would prefer living away from downtown. Is Clayton or CWE more expensive to rent in?
Just a little side note, when I was in Wrigleyville last weekend, I was at a bar with my Cards stuff on, and this Cubs chick came up to me and started heckling me a lil bit. Then she's like "I actually love the Cardinals. I've had a closet love for them ever since I went down to STL last season and went to a Cubs-Cards game and had the best time ever." She said that we were the nicest fans ever and had a wonderful time. She said, "I hate the Brewers. I went up to Milwaukee recently and their fans were the biggest red-neck *******s ever!" haha. Goes to show you people in STL are very nice to opposing visitors. Even if we give you a little crap, it's usually all in good fun. People think we're an arrogant fan base, but we have a right to be a little arrogant considering the success of the franchise. We still respect opposing teams' fans as long as they don't come in with the attitude of being hostile.
Hopefully Ball Park Village gets completed in the next few years. That will be a huge boost to downtown hopefully..I'd honestly rather have a bunch of smaller bars though like Wrigleyville than just a couple giant chain type bars/restaurants.
Rich, when we lived in Chicago we were fine as Cardinals fans. My dad always called it a friendly rivalry, and I found most Chicagoans to agree with me.
In fact we went to a Cards/Cubs game at Wrigley and everyone was decent and polite (of course they won which likely helped their mood). The only issue was walking home through Lake View and some drunk chick at a bar's sidewalk table slurs "Youuu neeed to get out of this citty" to which I replied "Sorry, I live here" and she goes "Ohhh, then you neeeed to taaake of your shirrt." I just smiled and laughed at her -- if I'd been rude to her I'm sure she would have told the story of how terrible Cardinals fans are for the rest of her life so I was trying to be a good steward for my team and my city.
As far as which is more expensive, Clayton or Central West End it depends on how centrally you want to be located, but as a whole I think apartments in the heart of the CWE are going to run a bit higher. That said, choosing one over the other would be a no brainer to me: CWE. And hey you're only a few metro stops away when you want to go into Clayton.
The rents are probably about the same in the CWE and Clayton. That said, I would still pick the CWE. Not to plug my own neighborhood or anything, but it just seems generally more "happening" than Clayton, and also more centrally located. I've been here a year and only had the occasion to go to downtown Clayton once for about an hour. Maybe somebody who lives in Clayton could give you a better idea of how it really is, but I think the CWE is definitely more urban and vibrant, and certainly more similar to something you'd find in Chicago.
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Here are some of the top reasons to LOVE St. Louis- and what helped convince my husband that moving to St. Louis was the best thing to do!
