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I got it used. Same price as a comparable used Corolla. Actually, probably less. What's the price of a 2 yr old used Corolla S with 30k miles?
Nobody in their right mind is paying $30k + for a Volt. With the tax credit and massive GM incentives, many people are paying in the low twenties for a new Volt. If you have a GM credit card, they're paying even less.
And you're only counting fuel costs. How about reduced maintenance? How about the convenience factor? My point stands.
Buying a new EV means the depreciation alone will dwarf any maintenance and fuel cost savings. Not to mention any out of warranty work on the drivetrain.
EV fans have a habit of overstating the maintenance cost of modern cars. Oil change intervals have been stretched to almost 10k miles. That works out to less than 2 $30 oil changes per year. Belts, transmission fluids, coolant flushes, and spark plugs are typically every 100k miles. Amortized, that works out to less than $100 a year.
Tesla’s ranges have always included charging to 100% which of course Tesla doesn’t recommend frequently doing as it degrades battery life. I can’t imagine trucking operators only charging to 80%. They’re going to need to top off the range to 100% every charge and still expect the battery pack to last 1 million miles. All EVs’ ranges degrade over time (approx 23 miles per 100k miles) https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.tes...0-driven%3famp
So that works out to 230 miles of range degrade over the life of the semi. Now that 500 mile range is actually 270 on a good day. Add in freezing weather and mountains and cut that back to 135 mile range for a fully loaded semi.
I got it used. Same price as a comparable used Corolla. Actually, probably less. What's the price of a 2 yr old used Corolla S with 30k miles?
Nobody in their right mind is paying $30k + for a Volt. With the tax credit and massive GM incentives, many people are paying in the low twenties for a new Volt. If you have a GM credit card, they're paying even less.
And you're only counting fuel costs. How about reduced maintenance? How about the convenience factor? My point stands.
Your point doesn't stand unless GM only sells used Volts which it doesn't.
Someone has to buy these EVs new and take the hit. Right now it's the US government and manufacturers who lease/sell them at unprofitable rates just to sell compliance cars.
It's not sustainable to sell a new Leaf for $13,500 which is what the 2017s are going for in my area with tax credits.
A new i3 REx is $50k roughly, I test drove one at a BMW dealer with 9800 miles on it for $22,500.
I'd say it's pretty stupid on Teslas part. They apparently have no clue about the trucking industry. A commercial over the road driver can drive 11 hours of a 14 hour day with 10 hours off. With a range of only 500 miles, he's going to have a lot of wasted time on his hands. Time is money when on the road, this is a major fail on Teslas part. Now if they had put this together in a 2 ton type truck for local or no overnight route deliveries, it could have been a home run with the truck charging overnight at the warehouse. But like all "corporations" they went for the big money trucks, not the most used trucks. Considering there aren't a lot of short trips for the large trucks like this one in the vid and that most buyers are not going to be the test dummy for Tesla, my money says they won't sell many, if at all. Nothing as intelligent as fishing in a fish tank with no fish.
I'd say it's pretty stupid on Teslas part. They apparently have no clue about the trucking industry. A commercial over the road driver can drive 11 hours of a 14 hour day with 10 hours off. With a range of only 500 miles, he's going to have a lot of wasted time on his hands. Time is money when on the road, this is a major fail on Teslas part. Now if they had put this together in a 2 ton type truck for local or no overnight route deliveries, it could have been a home run with the truck charging overnight at the warehouse. But like all "corporations" they went for the big money trucks, not the most used trucks. Considering there aren't a lot of short trips for the large trucks like this one in the vid and that most buyers are not going to be the test dummy for Tesla, my money says they won't sell many, if at all. Nothing as intelligent as fishing in a fish tank with no fish.
Commercial truck drivers also have to take a break every eight hours. So the 500 mile limit, might be nothing more than a minor inconvenience. Maybe having to take an extra 30 minutes on their break to allow the truck to finish charging, or they could leave on time with just enough charge to finish their shift .
I don't see mileage limitations being a deal killer for electric vehicles. There are very few situations that require a vehicle to drive more then 500 miles without stopping. In the future people will pull into a travel center, plug in their vehicle, and go eat lunch. When they finish their meal and come back, the vehicle will be charged and ready to go.
You are also assuming that the range of each charge will not continue to increase. The first generation is not the final product.
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
34,726 posts, read 58,067,115 times
Reputation: 46195
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudy Dayz
Commercial truck drivers also have to take a break every eight hours. So the 500 mile limit, might be nothing more than a minor inconvenience. Maybe having to take an extra 30 minutes on their break to allow the truck to finish charging, or they could leave on time with just enough charge to finish their shift .
I don't see mileage limitations being a deal killer for electric vehicles. There are very few situations that require a vehicle to drive more then 500 miles without stopping. In the future people will pull into a travel center, plug in their vehicle, and go eat lunch. When they finish their meal and come back, the vehicle will be charged and ready to go.
You are also assuming that the range of each charge will not continue to increase. The first generation is not the final product.
Trust us (CDL drivers) OTR will kill them. (EVs)
remember... TEAM driving is the norm (22 hrs / day!) NO / FEW stops! rolling brings in the dough (to companies AND drivers). They could do 'swap-packs', but there is no way that OTR rig can SIT and wait for a charge. TIME is money... demanding customers (bosses) who are TRACKING YOUR EVERY movement.../ perishable goods / air freight competition / drones! / distributed teams ...
Trash trucks / school bus / delivery / taxis... this is where the EV industry should have cut it's teeth and developed low cost / robust EV solutions. To think they went 'consumer' / 20 min commute 2x / day in a $20k plus technocar...
very telling (silently)
Very VERY slow way to innovate / prove new transportation technology sitting in a parking space 23 hrs / day.
I guess you guys haven't figured out that they are starting out by tackling the 500 miles and below portion of the market. There's enough business there that Tesla will be busy producing trucks for 10 years before having to worry about the long range stuff.
THe question isn't whether there's a market, it's whether Tesla can produce as promised. In terms of specs, timeline and price.
Location: San Ramon, Seattle, Anchorage, Reykjavik
2,254 posts, read 2,739,837 times
Reputation: 3203
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapperL
I'd say it's pretty stupid on Teslas part. They apparently have no clue about the trucking industry. A commercial over the road driver can drive 11 hours of a 14 hour day with 10 hours off. With a range of only 500 miles, he's going to have a lot of wasted time on his hands. Time is money when on the road, this is a major fail on Teslas part. Now if they had put this together in a 2 ton type truck for local or no overnight route deliveries, it could have been a home run with the truck charging overnight at the warehouse. But like all "corporations" they went for the big money trucks, not the most used trucks. Considering there aren't a lot of short trips for the large trucks like this one in the vid and that most buyers are not going to be the test dummy for Tesla, my money says they won't sell many, if at all. Nothing as intelligent as fishing in a fish tank with no fish.
Actually I bet they sell as many as they can build. Scania, Daimler, and Volvo are right on their heels with similar Class 8 product. Short range with almost zero maintenance intervals? Very little mechanical load with no transmission to damage? Long life brakes? It's all about cost per mile and, for their intended use, these trucks are going to kill of the diesels.
Lighter duty class 5- trucks, especially delivery vehicles, will be all electric within 10 years. Class 5-7 maybe 10 (or less) years although all of the heavy garbage trucks in my country are already full electric.
We have a new leader in the clubhouse. Pepsi has just ordered 100. Will use/test on deliveries within 500 miles of their distribution centers.
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