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Also, it is impossible to be a true believer on this. The only thing we know (ignoring extremists on both sides) is that we have insufficient data, and THAT I think requires an abundance of caution.
To be very honest, I am more concerned about my family's health (and specifically long term cancer risk) than any environmental effects of fracking at large. Since we moved here, to be on the prudent side, we decided to only use bottled spring water for drinking - bottled in an area far away from any oil and gas drilling. In the environmentalist hierarchy of evil, bottled water is up there with fracking, but in the overall scheme of things, our assessment was that that was the healthier option for us.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDS_
So when did you true believers turn in your cars keys and disconnect your home's HVAC systems?
Also, it is impossible to be a true believer on this. The only thing we know (ignoring extremists on both sides) is that we have insufficient data, and THAT I think requires an abundance of caution.
To be very honest, I am more concerned about my family's health (and specifically long term cancer risk) than any environmental effects of fracking at large. Since we moved here, to be on the prudent side, we decided to only use bottled spring water for drinking - bottled in an area far away from any oil and gas drilling. In the environmentalist hierarchy of evil, bottled water is up there with fracking, but in the overall scheme of things, our assessment was that that was the healthier option for us.
Also, it is impossible to be a true believer on this. The only thing we know (ignoring extremists on both sides) is that we have insufficient data, and THAT I think requires an abundance of caution.
To be very honest, I am more concerned about my family's health (and specifically long term cancer risk) than any environmental effects of fracking at large. Since we moved here, to be on the prudent side, we decided to only use bottled spring water for drinking - bottled in an area far away from any oil and gas drilling. In the environmentalist hierarchy of evil, bottled water is up there with fracking, but in the overall scheme of things, our assessment was that that was the healthier option for us.
this post is just silly
there is a MASSIVE amount of data out there starting with the data from the water wells and test wells that are drilled all around areas of oil and gas production including areas that do not have fracking.....and the test samples from those wells can be tested down to the parts per billion for various chemicals and when those wells come back negative for those chemicals well the answer is there....no chemicals = no ill effects from fracking because you can't suffer ill effects from nonexistent toxins unless you are the type of headless chicken that believes someone is faking those test or that worries themselves into illness even when the repeated testing of wells comes back negative for any signs of the chemicals you are concerned with
also the VAST majority of water for the DFW metromess (if not all of it) comes from surface water and the VAST amount of that surface water does not flow from springs that MIGHT be contaminated from fracking IF some fracking operation did not follow standard procedures and IF the testing of those springs and surrounding test wells was not performed (which it is) and instead that surface water comes from rain....and rain has to flow down streets where YOUR car and everyone elses car has driven leaving traces of many chemicals that you want to ignore because it would make your life inconvenient and your hysteria incapacitating to actually give a thought to how YOUR actions contribute to issues
and then that surface water is pulled from the lakes and rivers and it is treated and TESTED by the various water authorities probably thousands of times per year at locations all over their delivery area to see if there are contaminants
so instead of realizing that your tap water in the DFW metro area does not come from water wells it comes from surface lakes, instead of realizing that your daily life contributes as much or more to the pollution of your sources of tap water than fracking EVER will IF there is some incident with a fracked well and instead of trusting that the test are being done on wells and on the tap water delivered to your home you instead further harm the environment by buying bottled "spring" water that comes in a plastic bottle that requires hydrocarbons for it's production and land fill space for its disposal and also requires it to be trucked hundreds if not thousands of miles in diesel burning trucks on synthetic rubber tires and then the waste you generate with your hysteria has to also be trucked away in diesel burning trucks on synthetic rubber tires and put in a land fill
not to mention that the spring that is being pulled from to produce your water probably has a group of whackos protesting the production of water from that spring and what it is doing to the spring flows AND you have to rely on the good will and honesty of the producer of that water and their testing regiment to know whether or not the product in that bottle is actually as clean and contaminant free as they say it is.....and strangely you seem to trust them even though they are in the business of making a profit off of paranoid people such as yourself and a bad test would kill their business, but you don't trust the massive amount of state and local regulators that pull test from testing wells and from municipal water supplies even though their job security comes from the possibility of finding something VS from selling a product that needs to be thought of as pure
not to mention that I would imagine the water you are actually getting in the bottle is not "spring water" it is filtered municipal water that comes from the tap of the place where the bottling company is located and that tap water there may or may not come from a spring
so yea you are really looking out for what is best and using your intelligence to make a proper assessment of "fracking" and the "dangers" it represents to everyone
Like I said, I have no other stake other than my family's health and the principle I operate by is an 'abundance of caution'. I have some familiarity with the cancer epidemiology literature and many of our experiences from the past lead me to this principle.
I will ignore some of the adjectives you have used, but I have previously mentioned the principle I use to judge anything - what is good for my family.
You do make a valid point reg. if one can trust a bottled water company and indeed there is objective testing data out there that many 'spring water' companies just sell filtered municipal water!
Which is why, to cut through the marketing hype I rely on organizations that have gained my trust over the years to do the research for me. Two of them that have tested bottled water include the Environmental Working Group and Consumer Reports, and I buy many products based on their testing and recommendations.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasVines
this post is just silly
there is a MASSIVE amount of data out there starting with the data from the water wells and test wells that are drilled all around areas of oil and gas production including areas that do not have fracking.....and the test samples from those wells can be tested down to the parts per billion for various chemicals and when those wells come back negative for those chemicals well the answer is there....no chemicals = no ill effects from fracking because you can't suffer ill effects from nonexistent toxins unless you are the type of headless chicken that believes someone is faking those test or that worries themselves into illness even when the repeated testing of wells comes back negative for any signs of the chemicals you are concerned with
also the VAST majority of water for the DFW metromess (if not all of it) comes from surface water and the VAST amount of that surface water does not flow from springs that MIGHT be contaminated from fracking IF some fracking operation did not follow standard procedures and IF the testing of those springs and surrounding test wells was not performed (which it is) and instead that surface water comes from rain....and rain has to flow down streets where YOUR car and everyone elses car has driven leaving traces of many chemicals that you want to ignore because it would make your life inconvenient and your hysteria incapacitating to actually give a thought to how YOUR actions contribute to issues
and then that surface water is pulled from the lakes and rivers and it is treated and TESTED by the various water authorities probably thousands of times per year at locations all over their delivery area to see if there are contaminants
so instead of realizing that your tap water in the DFW metro area does not come from water wells it comes from surface lakes, instead of realizing that your daily life contributes as much or more to the pollution of your sources of tap water than fracking EVER will IF there is some incident with a fracked well and instead of trusting that the test are being done on wells and on the tap water delivered to your home you instead further harm the environment by buying bottled "spring" water that comes in a plastic bottle that requires hydrocarbons for it's production and land fill space for its disposal and also requires it to be trucked hundreds if not thousands of miles in diesel burning trucks on synthetic rubber tires and then the waste you generate with your hysteria has to also be trucked away in diesel burning trucks on synthetic rubber tires and put in a land fill
not to mention that the spring that is being pulled from to produce your water probably has a group of whackos protesting the production of water from that spring and what it is doing to the spring flows AND you have to rely on the good will and honesty of the producer of that water and their testing regiment to know whether or not the product in that bottle is actually as clean and contaminant free as they say it is.....and strangely you seem to trust them even though they are in the business of making a profit off of paranoid people such as yourself and a bad test would kill their business, but you don't trust the massive amount of state and local regulators that pull test from testing wells and from municipal water supplies even though their job security comes from the possibility of finding something VS from selling a product that needs to be thought of as pure
not to mention that I would imagine the water you are actually getting in the bottle is not "spring water" it is filtered municipal water that comes from the tap of the place where the bottling company is located and that tap water there may or may not come from a spring
so yea you are really looking out for what is best and using your intelligence to make a proper assessment of "fracking" and the "dangers" it represents to everyone
Like I said, I have no other stake other than my family's health and the principle I operate by is an 'abundance of caution'. I have some familiarity with the cancer epidemiology literature and many of our experiences from the past lead me to this principle.
I'm not trying to be jerk but are simply not serious. For an example one of the links you foisted up uses movies as sources.
I'm not trying to be jerk but are simply not serious. For an example one of the links you foisted up uses movies as sources.
No, they are serious. One is an academic paper, the other expert testimony. The one you mentioned references a movie about fracking, besides other sources.
If the involved issues were not serious, I doubt fracking companies would be paying $750,000 to settle with a family living near one of its drilling sites. Of course, no one would have known about this settlement - like many others before it - if a court ruling had not unsealed it!
No, they are serious. One is an academic paper, the other expert testimony. The one you mentioned references a movie about fracking, besides other sources.
If the involved issues were not serious, I doubt fracking companies would be paying $750,000 to settle with a family living near one of its drilling sites. Of course, no one would have known about this settlement - like many others before it - if a court ruling had not unsealed it!
Like I said, to my reasonably intelligent eyes there is sufficient evidence to indulge in an abundance of caution : )
The video link does not simply reference a movie about fracking it lists two movies as sources.
Oil and gas companies are shaken down in court all the time it's a fact of the business. And you might note that fracking per se isn't even alleged to have contaminated the water in question.
Look nothing as difficult as oil/gas extraction is easy or 100% safe. Neither is any kind of travel or getting out of bed.
Quite frankly excepting the national security issues and extreme financial penalties faced from buying much of our BTU load from overseas it's likely good for Texas and a few other states that other parts of the country are trying to shut down fracking.
BTW - I just texted a friend of mine who is a fairly significant independent natural gas guy about some of the items mentioned in your movie as common chems used in fracking - formaldehyde, uranium, mercury and lead. He's never heard of any of those items used in fracking fluids.
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