So it is hard to find a job in Toronto (rent, houses)
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The job market is a dynamic place anywhere.. I'm sure there are people in exactly your situation in U.S cities feeling as though they can't find the type of work they want.. My suggestion to you is to get a foot in the door in a company that HAS the type of jobs you (work in any entry level job you name it) want and work your butt off - make an impression and get the job you want!! Don't allow 'general' forces to dictate what will happen in your Career..
I know a guy at my work from Poland who was a P.Eng and worked as a Baggage agent at the airport.. He got a foot in the door, worked his butt off and received relavent upgrades to his educational credentials and is now an Engineer in the company making very good coin.. He probably makes 4-5 times what he was making as a Baggage agent. He could have just given up - said Canada sucks because he didn't get what he wanted instantly because of simply credentials.. Blood, sweat and tears approach paid of well for him..
I look at myself and where I started out in my company in an entry level customer service position and looking what I do now which is directly working in my field of study and making good coin.. I worked my butt off though and had patience, persistence and goals (blood, sweat and tears).. Sometimes if you can't get to your destination in a straight line than take a curvy sideroad that ultimately leads to you destination instead of complaining about the lack of straight roads.. I don't mean to sound brutal here but you have to be in this for the long haul and that is going to take some creativity, persistence and hard work.
You are right fusion too. And the example you gave (baggage agent) is a success story, I've heard some about that too. Are you born here or you came here by yourself as an immigrant? Because it's veeeeery different, trust me. And there are many not-so-successful stories that nobody talks about I've seen families who came here and after some time divorced, because one of them couldn't find work..I mean it's not easy to have been successful in IT in your country and work in Canada at produce in a grocery store for over three years. I know families who divorced because only the wife was successful in her Canadian career and the husband was not, this created a lot of tension in the family and the husband moved back home for good. I've seen people who killed themselves for not being able to provide to their kids and pay their mortgage too. Have you heard of those too? Probably not...
Therefore I rest my case here, because you guys are nice to reply, thank you, but you see things from where you are now and talk like you didn't immigrate yourself or are not in Canada. And I can't ask you differently, for me it's sometimes hard too to be in others people's shoes. In fact, there's nothing I want from anybody, trust me, I had tones of courses and workshops on how to find a job by now, most of them are theory based, not real life based. I am just letting the readers who intend to immigrate that it's much harder than they imagine and if I were to go back, I would never ever come with a PR, but with a work permit first, to see how things are and then, if everything looks ok, I would bring my family. Once you come with your family things get complicated and you might not be able to go back because the kids most of the time love it here (they don't need to work for the money yet) or you might like some things here and might not know what to do...Lots of people went back home and came here...because they didn't know what to do...and they spent a fortune on air tickets back and forth. With the mind I have now...I would not sell my house back there. Just in case...
Of course, there are people who come in Canada for safety reason, for them, it might be Heaven to live in a safe country, no matter which country.... but for people who had a good standard of living in a safe country, it's not always a gain in the career section of one's life. For example, we have a friend from GB who came, stayed for several years (worked in IT), made some debts trying to keep up with his standard of life back home and then he had to go there to find a much better paid job to pay the debts here. He staied with his mom, he paid no rent and in no time he paid the debts here. But while living here, he could not do this because of the high cost of housing in Toronto. And since he went there and had a good job...he thought..why would I go back there now? I don't blame him at all...
Last edited by mg.nitram; 06-23-2015 at 03:34 PM..
The whole 100 resume's sent and no calls sounds pretty normal to me. That's what happened to my brother, my dad, my mom, several friends, and we live in LA.
Having difficulty finding a job is not specific to Toronto..........
Yes, thedonwind, you are right. And it also depends what you're looking for and when, right? Canada used to be much better in terms of jobs, from what people who came long time ago told me. You used to "send 6 resumes and got three calls and one job", they say. For example, I know a lady who is/was a chemist. Her husband was an engineer back home. She was very, very successful in Canada (retired) , but her husband was not successful at all. I admire them because, despite this issue, they were united and happily married. Not all men take this lightly . She used to be away at least 12 hrs/day...not to mention the long commute. And she got to be successful because she came over 30 years ago, right now, chemists are not doing as well in terms of good jobs, with opportunities to grow.
Lots of people came here with a degree, because it was a requirement to be granted a PR. But then their degree was not recognized and some adapted quickly-but not lightly- and are pretty successful (money-wise) in jobs such as carpenters, constructions, building management for rentals and condos (a lot of people I know found jobs in this field) and a few in Real Estate. One opened his own carpentry business and is kind of wealthy For plumbers and electricians, the apprenticeship is lengthy from what I hear, and they had families to support themselves as immigrants, they were not supported by anybody, so they found what they could under the given conditions. Maybe it's good to have two professions nowadays or to be ready (financially) to switch anytime.
Yes, thedonwind, you are right. And it also depends what you're looking for and when, right? Canada used to be much better in terms of jobs, from what people who came long time ago told me. You used to "send 6 resumes and got three calls and one job", they say. For example, I know a lady who is/was a chemist. Her husband was an engineer back home. She was very, very successful in Canada (retired) , but her husband was not successful at all. I admire them because, despite this issue, they were united and happily married. Not all men take this lightly . She used to be away at least 12 hrs/day...not to mention the long commute. And she got to be successful because she came over 30 years ago, right now, chemists are not doing as well in terms of good jobs, with opportunities to grow.
Lots of people came here with a degree, because it was a requirement to be granted a PR. But then their degree was not recognized and some adapted quickly-but not lightly- and are pretty successful (money-wise) in jobs such as carpenters, constructions, building management for rentals and condos (a lot of people I know found jobs in this field) and a few in Real Estate. One opened his own carpentry business and is kind of wealthy For plumbers and electricians, the apprenticeship is lengthy from what I hear, and they had families to support themselves as immigrants, they were not supported by anybody, so they found what they could under the given conditions. Maybe it's good to have two professions nowadays or to be ready (financially) to switch anytime.
Searching for a job is going to be a sucky experience regardless of where you are. And you can't change it. The only thing you can change is:
1. How you deal with it
2. your attitude
As far as Toronto goes, can we simply compare a economy of 35 mil people to a superpower of 330 million people? It's simply not fair. Like said in previous threads, is Canada's economy as strong as America's? Of course not... But is it pretty good for a country it's size? Yes.
Searching for a job is going to be a sucky experience regardless of where you are. And you can't change it. The only thing you can change is:
1. How you deal with it
2. your attitude
As far as Toronto goes, can we simply compare a economy of 35 mil people to a superpower of 330 million people? It's simply not fair. Like said in previous threads, is Canada's economy as strong as America's? Of course not... But is it pretty good for a country it's size? Yes.
points 1 and 2 you are completely on point!
point 3
Its not just a matter of size either.. Sure there are 330 million people in the U.S and it is a larger economy but that means there are 329,999,999 people to compete with as well so its all relative. These are both 1st world countries and there are opportunities that exist in both for their relative populations..
Hey look if I wanted to be successful in a tech start up business i'd put my money on the U.S and in particular the Bay area.. If I wanted to work in a construction related job, well Toronto and Vancouver are strong cities right now and NYC is always building.. The construction industry attracts all sorts of professionals to it. Toronto has a massive creative arts/media industry as well so if you work in that field you'll probably do better in Toronto, L.A or NYC than say Charleston South Carolina or Detroit Mi or even Chicago. In my industry - aviation, Pearson International airport is one of the fastest growing large airports on the continent so there are tons of jobs associated with an airport so its probably going to have more opportunity than a city with an airport with ho hum growth. The GTA is the second largest food industry hub in N.A so there are probably TONS of job linked to that industry with all kinds of professionals supporting it.. Point being is its not just a matter of one place being bigger than the other - its access to opportunity based on relative population. People need to understand the industries that are growth industries in the city they settle in..
Someone once asked which province would best support someone who was a Petroleum Engineer - ummm I mean isn't it obvious that you'd be better off in Alberta than Ontario in that industry - hello.... lol...... If you work in Finance or insurance industries however, in Canada probably Toronto is the way to go as its the financial centre of the country.
Searching for a job is going to be a sucky experience regardless of where you are.
____________
Correct
____________
And you can't change it. The only thing you can change is:
1. How you deal with it
2. your attitude
___________
yes, we are on the same page, like with everything else in life. You can't change what life throws at your feet, but your attitude to it.
___________
As far as Toronto goes, can we simply compare a economy of 35 mil people to a superpower of 330 million people? It's simply not fair. Like said in previous threads, is Canada's economy as strong as America's? Of course not... But is it pretty good for a country it's size? Yes.
____________
No, you can't compare, it's not fair and it's not real... what you are saying if you have in intention the other country of the two (for example, healthcare is for everybody here). This is why I said what I said to Bostonkid 123. We're talking different things. And Canada is definitely a good country to live in, not to mention its amazing beauty and nice people! When you have a job (and I don't mean a lousy job), everything seems better in any civilized and safe country This must be an universal truth by now.
BTW, USA is very beautiful as well, we love it when we travel there! The nature is gorgeous on this continent, breathtaking, and it's soooo wide, green spaces everywhere...Love it! I guess I would need several life times in a row to visit USA and Canada. Haven't visited LA yet, but loved Boston (for Bostonkid 123) with its red line on the pavement, it was so much fun to follow it, especially when some constructions site covered it
You are right fusion too. And the example you gave (baggage agent) is a success story, I've heard some about that too. Are you born here or you came here by yourself as an immigrant? Because it's veeeeery different, trust me. And there are many not-so-successful stories that nobody talks about I've seen families who came here and after some time divorced, because one of them couldn't find work..I mean it's not easy to have been successful in IT in your country and work in Canada at produce in a grocery store for over three years. I know families who divorced because only the wife was successful in her Canadian career and the husband was not, this created a lot of tension in the family and the husband moved back home for good. I've seen people who killed themselves for not being able to provide to their kids and pay their mortgage too. Have you heard of those too? Probably not...
Therefore I rest my case here, because you guys are nice to reply, thank you, but you see things from where you are now and talk like you didn't immigrate yourself or are not in Canada. And I can't ask you differently, for me it's sometimes hard too to be in others people's shoes. In fact, there's nothing I want from anybody, trust me, I had tones of courses and workshops on how to find a job by now, most of them are theory based, not real life based. I am just letting the readers who intend to immigrate that it's much harder than they imagine and if I were to go back, I would never ever come with a PR, but with a work permit first, to see how things are and then, if everything looks ok, I would bring my family. Once you come with your family things get complicated and you might not be able to go back because the kids most of the time love it here (they don't need to work for the money yet) or you might like some things here and might not know what to do...Lots of people went back home and came here...because they didn't know what to do...and they spent a fortune on air tickets back and forth. With the mind I have now...I would not sell my house back there. Just in case...
Of course, there are people who come in Canada for safety reason, for them, it might be Heaven to live in a safe country, no matter which country.... but for people who had a good standard of living in a safe country, it's not always a gain in the career section of one's life. For example, we have a friend from GB who came, stayed for several years (worked in IT), made some debts trying to keep up with his standard of life back home and then he had to go there to find a much better paid job to pay the debts here. He staied with his mom, he paid no rent and in no time he paid the debts here. But while living here, he could not do this because of the high cost of housing in Toronto. And since he went there and had a good job...he thought..why would I go back there now? I don't blame him at all...
My advice still stands regardless if one is an immigrant, refugee or born and bred native.. I think it definitely would be tougher as an immigrant/refugee than a native - much tougher I have no illusions and I think that would be the case in any country.. If I immigrated to Tunisia it would take me awhile to adapt to the local customs and way of doing business in that country but i'd sure as heck never lose sight of my goals and i'd never give up trying to get what I want and need in the world of work....
You are right fusion too. And the example you gave (baggage agent) is a success story, I've heard some about that too. Are you born here or you came here by yourself as an immigrant? Because it's veeeeery different, trust me. And there are many not-so-successful stories that nobody talks about I've seen families who came here and after some time divorced, because one of them couldn't find work..I mean it's not easy to have been successful in IT in your country and work in Canada at produce in a grocery store for over three years. I know families who divorced because only the wife was successful in her Canadian career and the husband was not, this created a lot of tension in the family and the husband moved back home for good. I've seen people who killed themselves for not being able to provide to their kids and pay their mortgage too. Have you heard of those too? Probably not...
Therefore I rest my case here, because you guys are nice to reply, thank you, but you see things from where you are now and talk like you didn't immigrate yourself or are not in Canada. And I can't ask you differently, for me it's sometimes hard too to be in others people's shoes. In fact, there's nothing I want from anybody, trust me, I had tones of courses and workshops on how to find a job by now, most of them are theory based, not real life based. I am just letting the readers who intend to immigrate that it's much harder than they imagine and if I were to go back, I would never ever come with a PR, but with a work permit first, to see how things are and then, if everything looks ok, I would bring my family. Once you come with your family things get complicated and you might not be able to go back because the kids most of the time love it here (they don't need to work for the money yet) or you might like some things here and might not know what to do...Lots of people went back home and came here...because they didn't know what to do...and they spent a fortune on air tickets back and forth. With the mind I have now...I would not sell my house back there. Just in case...
Of course, there are people who come in Canada for safety reason, for them, it might be Heaven to live in a safe country, no matter which country.... but for people who had a good standard of living in a safe country, it's not always a gain in the career section of one's life. For example, we have a friend from GB who came, stayed for several years (worked in IT), made some debts trying to keep up with his standard of life back home and then he had to go there to find a much better paid job to pay the debts here. He staied with his mom, he paid no rent and in no time he paid the debts here. But while living here, he could not do this because of the high cost of housing in Toronto. And since he went there and had a good...he thought..why would I go back there now? I don't blame him at all...
After reading your posts on this thread I have to conclude it's your mindset that's keeping you from getting a good job ... that bagage agent story is a 'success story' as you put, but there are plenty of those, many may not be as big of a leap as that one, but it did happen to a lot of people who tried. I came to Canada 2 years ago with a job offer, and in my field people don't really spend much time sending out resumes, recruiters would check in on a monthly/quarterly basis to see if you are interested in some new positions that just opened up ( I just changed my job recently too and only interviewed 2 places), so I probably have had an easy time in this regard, but I didn't just have it handed to me. I had my first job back in the US many years ago, and got laid off a few months after I started, since the whole industry got into a deep recession, then a few weeks later 9/11 happened - after that it was one of the most difficult times to find a job as a foreign student who needed visa sponsorship and only had a few months of experience after graduation. But I went back to school, and during that time I thought long and hard about whether I wanted to stay in this industry, which was something I spent years to earn BS/MS for, but I ended up switching field and never looked back.
One lady I worked with used to be a teacher before immigrating to Canada with her husband, and of course she didn't get any teaching job here, so she started in Burger King ( or maybe MacDonalds), put herself through school for another degree, and now she works in finance and makes over 100K a year.
Lot of people don't want to let go of a degree they earned years ago, don't let a degree define you for the rest of your life, you can stick to it and complain, or do something different ( and it would make you feel a lot better when you complain about the past)
Its not just a matter of size either.. Sure there are 330 million people in the U.S and it is a larger economy but that means there are 329,999,999 people to compete with as well so its all relative. These are both 1st world countries and there are opportunities that exist in both for their relative populations..
Hey look if I wanted to be successful in a tech start up business i'd put my money on the U.S and in particular the Bay area.. If I wanted to work in a construction related job, well Toronto and Vancouver are strong cities right now and NYC is always building.. The construction industry attracts all sorts of professionals to it. Toronto has a massive creative arts/media industry as well so if you work in that field you'll probably do better in Toronto, L.A or NYC than say Charleston South Carolina or Detroit Mi or even Chicago. In my industry - aviation, Pearson International airport is one of the fastest growing large airports on the continent so there are tons of jobs associated with an airport so its probably going to have more opportunity than a city with an airport with ho hum growth. The GTA is the second largest food industry hub in N.A so there are probably TONS of job linked to that industry with all kinds of professionals supporting it.. Point being is its not just a matter of one place being bigger than the other - its access to opportunity based on relative population. People need to understand the industries that are growth industries in the city they settle in..
Someone once asked which province would best support someone who was a Petroleum Engineer - ummm I mean isn't it obvious that you'd be better off in Alberta than Ontario in that industry - hello.... lol...... If you work in Finance or insurance industries however, in Canada probably Toronto is the way to go as its the financial centre of the country.
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Yes, good point, Fusion2, for people working in construction (and connected fields), Toronto is expanding so much lately (I read that almost half of the 250.000 immigrants/year land in Toronto though, so be aware of this too) . When I came here I was quite disappointed overall about the city because there were not high rise building, the city was very flat with some peaks only in downtown (you can see this from the old postal cards). Where I was coming from, high rise buildings were standard, less houses, because we had less land. And I was surprised that here they were not building high rise building, but here and there, insignificantly to even mention. But waw...now..everywhere they demolish something and build high rise buildings. And a lot of people from Asia invest in real estates in Canada lately, from what I hear...just as an investment and then they rent them.
I love Toronto..the more I live here, the more I discover it and love it. It's a very fun and interesting place to live in. But you need time to discover it...some people living in Toronto for 15 years have never visited ever China Town here or other interesting places.
As about Alberta, I hear that not so much lately... I know people who moved there for this reason and they are thinking to come back to Toronto.
After reading your posts on this thread I have to conclude it's your mindset that's keeping you from getting a good job ... that bagage agent story is a 'success story' as you put, but there are plenty of those, many may not be as big of a leap as that one, but it did happen to a lot of people who tried. I came to Canada 2 years ago with a job offer, and in my field people don't really spend much time sending out resumes, recruiters would check in on a monthly/quarterly basis to see if you are interested in some new positions that just opened up ( I just changed my job recently too and only interviewed 2 places), so I probably have had an easy time in this regard, but I didn't just have it handed to me. I had my first job back in the US many years ago, and got laid off a few months after I started, since the whole industry got into a deep recession, then a few weeks later 9/11 happened - after that it was one of the most difficult times to find a job as a foreign student who needed visa sponsorship and only had a few months of experience after graduation. But I went back to school, and during that time I thought long and hard about whether I wanted to stay in this industry, which was something I spent years to earn BS/MS for, but I ended up switching field and never looked back.
One lady I worked with used to be a teacher before immigrating to Canada with her husband, and of course she didn't get any teaching job here, so she started in Burger King ( or maybe MacDonalds), put herself through school for another degree, and now she works in finance and makes over 100K a year.
Lot of people don't want to let go of a degree they earned years ago, don't let a degree define you for the rest of your life, you can stick to it and complain, or do something different ( and it would make you feel a lot better when you complain about the past)
Good post and essentially moving from one place to another without a fundamental shift in approach and mindset probably won't make much of a difference...
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I've seen families who came here and after some time divorced, because one of them couldn't find work..I mean it's not easy to have been successful in IT in your country and work in Canada at produce in a grocery store for over three years. I know families who divorced because only the wife was successful in her Canadian career and the husband was not, this created a lot of tension in the family and the husband moved back home for good. I've seen people who killed themselves for not being able to provide to their kids and pay their mortgage too. Have you heard of those too? 
