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Id be real surprised if the Gaithersburg stuff isnt being coordinated with the Montgomery County Planning people.
Core DC has little or no biotech employment, which is what this is supposed to attract - and core DC has high comm RE rents, high housing prices, gentrification/densification fast and strong enough to arouse backlash, etc. I can't imagine ANYONE in the region wanting to prevent suburban smart growth in order to focus MORE growth in DC. I could imagine some folks want more of MoCos growth to be focused in areas closer in to the metro center - in Silver Spring or Rockville, or inner PG county (the economically weakest of the inner suburbs) rather than all the way out in Gaithersburg. Not that Ive heard those arguments. Perhaps MDallstar could provide a link?
Okay, in other words, what you're talking about is an "edge city" if the jobs:resident balance is any indication. Is this being done in conjunction with a regional planning agency? Is there a regional plan? What are the projected effects of the project on the DC core? is it expected to steal existing jobs from DC proper? If so, I can see why they might be worried about it.
60,000 in 10.2 square miles is a touch less than 6000 people per square mile...I wouldn't call that particularly dense, nor 8000.
Who are these "some urban planners" and "many urban planners" you keep talking about? Or are they a secret shadow cabal of Urban Planners Who Shall Not Be Named?
Everything goes through the Metropolitan Council of Governments which is made up of members from DC, MD, and VA. Various Urban planners who write articles and such are still mad at the placement of the "Science City". I don't have links but they have been saying it for about 8 years so you could google some articles if your interested. They fail to realize John Hopkins in Gaithersburg is anchoring the Life Science City. There is no other place it could be since the Gaithersburg area is considered a life science capitol for the region. 8,000 sq. feet is not dense? DC is 9,000+ and Baltimore is 8,000+. What do you think is dense? I have never heard someone say DC and Baltimore are not dense.
Last edited by MDAllstar; 07-12-2011 at 09:03 PM..
Id be real surprised if the Gaithersburg stuff isnt being coordinated with the Montgomery County Planning people.
Core DC has little or no biotech employment, which is what this is supposed to attract - and core DC has high comm RE rents, high housing prices, gentrification/densification fast and strong enough to arouse backlash, etc. I can't imagine ANYONE in the region wanting to prevent suburban smart growth in order to focus MORE growth in DC. I could imagine some folks want more of MoCos growth to be focused in areas closer in to the metro center - in Silver Spring or Rockville, or inner PG county (the economically weakest of the inner suburbs) rather than all the way out in Gaithersburg. Not that Ive heard those arguments. Perhaps MDallstar could provide a link?
That is exactly what many people have wrote articles about. They think it should be closer into DC yet Gaithersburg is the life Science Capitol for the region. John's Hopkins Research campus is in Gaithersburg and now the National Cancer Research Center is in Gaithersburg. Science City is predicted to be the silicon valley of the east and the research triangle of the north. Only time will tell.
Generally speaking I'd call 10,000+ people per square mile the beginning threshold for "dense." But note that "dense" does not automatically equal walkable, transit-oriented or well-planned.
I'm not familiar enough with the DC metro area (I'm on the other side of the country) to render an opinion, other than one based on very broad generalities, which is a sucker's game.
Generally speaking I'd call 10,000+ people per square mile the beginning threshold for "dense." But note that "dense" does not automatically equal walkable, transit-oriented or well-planned.
I'm not familiar enough with the DC metro area (I'm on the other side of the country) to render an opinion, other than one based on very broad generalities, which is a sucker's game.
How many cities have 10,000+ density to being with? DC has probably already broken 10,000 people per sq. mile by now July 2011, but even before it did, DC has always been a very dense city. What city and metro area do you live in? What is the density?
What city and metro area do you live in? What is the density?
Sacramento, about 5000 people per square mile. But I certainly don't hold up my region as an ideal example of smart growth--we're more of a poster child for sprawl. I live in the densest part of the region, a touch less than 10,000 people per square mile, but personally I think my neighborhood's population density should probably be about double what it is right now--we've got plenty of vacant lots and infill potential.
Sacramento, about 5000 people per square mile. But I certainly don't hold up my region as an ideal example of smart growth--we're more of a poster child for sprawl. I live in the densest part of the region, a touch less than 10,000 people per square mile, but personally I think my neighborhood's population density should probably be about double what it is right now--we've got plenty of vacant lots and infill potential.
Lol.....Im talking about real cities. You just showed me a list of .5 mile to 1 mile size areas. I could show you olde town Gaithersburg which is over 15,000 people per square mile but that doesn't mean anything. I could also show you Friendship Village in DC which is the densest census designated place in the US at over 80,000 people per square mile but that also doesn't mean anything. Unless we are talking about a real city with miles and miles of land with park land and water etc. that can't be developed, its not a real comparison. Olde Town Gaithersburg has about 8,000 people living there. That's not showing us anything.
Lol.....Im talking about real cities. You just showed me a list of .5 mile to 1 mile size areas. I could show you olde town Gaithersburg which is over 15,000 people per square mile but that doesn't mean anything. I could also show you Friendship Village in DC which is the densest census designated place in the US at over 80,000 people per square mile but that also doesn't mean anything. Unless we are talking about a real city with miles and miles of land with park land and water etc. that can't be developed, its not a real comparison. Olde Town Gaithersburg has about 8,000 people living there. That's not showing us anything.
If you re-sort by land area it may make more sense. There are about 10-15 places with greater than 10sq miles and 10K plus density. At over 5sq miles places like Trenton etc come into the mix and the number is closer to 30-40 places/cities
New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Boston, San Francisco, Philadelphia and Miami don't count as real cities? Plenty of medium-sized cities too--Cambridge, West Hollywood, Norwalk, Paterson, Hempstead, Huntington Park, Daly City etcetera. The fact that many of these places aren't thought of as "big cities" is pretty strong evidence that density doesn't have to mean uncomfortable, tightly-packed places, but rather a more livable urbanism. The fact that a lot of these places are "old towns" also illustrates the potential of historic neighborhoods as models for cities that are dense, compact and walkable, but also livable, comfortable, and built at a human scale.
That is exactly what many people have wrote articles about. They think it should be closer into DC yet Gaithersburg is the life Science Capitol for the region. John's Hopkins Research campus is in Gaithersburg and now the National Cancer Research Center is in Gaithersburg. Science City is predicted to be the silicon valley of the east and the research triangle of the north. Only time will tell.
but NIH is still between Bethesda and Rockville. OTOH USAAMRID, etc are all the way out in Frederick. Im not sure it would be an open and shut case either way.
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