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I grew up in WV, living in Beckley, Charleston, and Martinsburg. I graduated high school in WV. I've lived in California, Texas, Ohio, Maryland, Virginia, and Florida.
Let me tell you, when I go back to WV to visit family, it's very friendly but there are times I get this distinct feeling that I'm being gawked at. In some of the more rural areas, I've quite literally seen slack jawed yokels staring at me (mouth open and all). It's pretty rude of them and I can see why there are steriotypes or why people in WV feel like others are laughing at them. What are you supposed to do when some doofus is watching your every move? It makes people feel uncomfortable.
As far as the stereotypes and jokes that are so pervasive, I'd encourage people to take a trip out west. WV is a huge joke on the East coast, especially in Ohio and NY. Further West, especially once you cross the Mississippi River, those jokes disappear completely. People in Texas make jokes about Arkansas and Oklahoma (mostly Arkansas though). Forget the jokes, I can't even tell you the number of people I spoke to in CA that didn't even know that West Virginia was even a state!
You couldn't pay me to live in WV and I was probably 7th or 8th generation native. I can think back 5 without even consulting the family tree.
I grew up in WV, living in Beckley, Charleston, and Martinsburg. I graduated high school in WV. I've lived in California, Texas, Ohio, Maryland, Virginia, and Florida.
Let me tell you, when I go back to WV to visit family, it's very friendly but there are times I get this distinct feeling that I'm being gawked at. In some of the more rural areas, I've quite literally seen slack jawed yokels staring at me (mouth open and all). It's pretty rude of them and I can see why there are steriotypes or why people in WV feel like others are laughing at them. What are you supposed to do when some doofus is watching your every move? It makes people feel uncomfortable.
As far as the stereotypes and jokes that are so pervasive, I'd encourage people to take a trip out west. WV is a huge joke on the East coast, especially in Ohio and NY. Further West, especially once you cross the Mississippi River, those jokes disappear completely. People in Texas make jokes about Arkansas and Oklahoma (mostly Arkansas though). Forget the jokes, I can't even tell you the number of people I spoke to in CA that didn't even know that West Virginia was even a state!
You couldn't pay me to live in WV and I was probably 7th or 8th generation native. I can think back 5 without even consulting the family tree.
Reading your post, it looks like you've found a home out there. Makes one wonder why you are blessing us with your presence here on this board since I don't think we miss you much?
I was born and raised in northern Ohio. I've never had anyone in WV ever say a word to me about it outside of on a rare occasion note that they detected a slight northern accent.
I suspect that your comment about rural people is true. I still hear people refer to Jay Rockefeller as a carpetbagger even though he moved to WV in 1964 and has done nothing but work tirelessly for the poor people ever since. Sometimes, I think that being in a place for only one or two generations may not be enough to be considered a native.
On the surface of it, in 1964, anybody named Rockefeller coming into the South, could very well been seen as a carpetbagger was seen in the south after the Civil War. It was Rich people who came in from the North with piles of money in their carpetbags to take advantage of the poor people in their target areas. However, Rockefeller wasn't like that, but people in isolated communities have LONG memories.
Earl Ray Tomlin is from Logan County. People in Southern West Virginia liked the idea of having a Governor from Southern West Virginia. They never paid any attention to what he stood for or what votes he had cast while he was in the state Senate, or what agenda he promoted while he was Senate President. He was just a Southern WV boy, like them, so they voted for him.
You've got to spend a lifetime to understand this attitude. I think this same thing exists deep in the Ozarks as well as the Smokey Mountain area. I understand it, and that has made it easy to understand the way of life in Maine, where there is a poor, isolated population in small scattered communities who like life the way it is and are suspicious of people "from away," as they call them. They also call outsiders "flatlanders," which is a derogatory term for somebody "from away." They also talk funny, but instead of admitting it, they think I talk funny. Hmmm.
These small communities also develop their own speech idioms and unique food variations. For example, there is a fairly small geographic area where slaw is a common topping for hot dogs.
I don't disagree with this except for the Rockefeller part. His family is an energy family... always has been. You don't honestly believe he came to West Virginia in 1964 just to be altruistic, do you? At that time, when his family sent him to West Virginia with a war chest of political funding to take over the state, they already controlled New York State and Arkansas (via Uncle Winthrup). They owned major coal stakes, especially in the northern part of the state with the Valley Camp Coal Company (owned indirectly via Standard Oil). There is no way he just decided to come here to look after the poor folks in McDowell County. If he had... after 50 years of political influence wouldn't there be something there worth having by now? As far as I can tell, they have already extracted the most valuable stuff and now are picking up the scraps by taking off mountaintops.
Something happened over the course of centuries of isolation in the southernmost tier of our state that has caused a mass political stupidity. It is now a part of the culture there to vote in a such way so as to shoot oneself in the foot, as a way of life. They simply don't know anything better. They see Boss Hogg types as normal. When the last person leaves McDowell and turns out the lights, he will still be seeing things that way.
I don't disagree with this except for the Rockefeller part. His family is an energy family... always has been. You don't honestly believe he came to West Virginia in 1964 just to be altruistic, do you? At that time, when his family sent him to West Virginia with a war chest of political funding to take over the state, they already controlled New York State and Arkansas (via Uncle Winthrup). They owned major coal stakes, especially in the northern part of the state with the Valley Camp Coal Company (owned indirectly via Standard Oil). There is no way he just decided to come here to look after the poor folks in McDowell County. If he had... after 50 years of political influence wouldn't there be something there worth having by now? As far as I can tell, they have already extracted the most valuable stuff and now are picking up the scraps by taking off mountaintops.
Something happened over the course of centuries of isolation in the southernmost tier of our state that has caused a mass political stupidity. It is now a part of the culture there to vote in a such way so as to shoot oneself in the foot, as a way of life. They simply don't know anything better. They see Boss Hogg types as normal. When the last person leaves McDowell and turns out the lights, he will still be seeing things that way.
My comments weren't about the Rockefeller family, or Exxon/Mobil Corporation. Jay Rockefeller came to Amma, WV. Had he been here on business for his family, he certainly would not have stopped in Amma. Jay has never worked in the family business. If you have proof that he came here will bags of money to buy up the politics of the state, post your links to the proof. Otherwise, you're just posting opinions again. It's OK to post opinions as long as they are labeled as opinions and not as facts. BTW, Amma is in Roane County. Your comments have pushed this way too close to being a political thread for my comfort. Those should be in the P&OC forum, IMHO.
My comments weren't about the Rockefeller family, or Exxon/Mobil Corporation. Jay Rockefeller came to Amma, WV. Had he been here on business for his family, he certainly would not have stopped in Amma. Jay has never worked in the family business.
That was the entire reason to get him into politics.
My comments weren't about the Rockefeller family, or Exxon/Mobil Corporation. Jay Rockefeller came to Amma, WV. Had he been here on business for his family, he certainly would not have stopped in Amma. Jay has never worked in the family business. If you have proof that he came here will bags of money to buy up the politics of the state, post your links to the proof. Otherwise, you're just posting opinions again. It's OK to post opinions as long as they are labeled as opinions and not as facts. BTW, Amma is in Roane County. Your comments have pushed this way too close to being a political thread for my comfort. Those should be in the P&OC forum, IMHO.
You're the one who brought Jay up, so I guess you should have posted it on that forum then since it wasn't germane to the conversation to begin with. Winthrup and Nelson didn't work for the "family business" either. They were politically involved to advance the interests of the family business, just as (in my opinion as you pointed out) was nephew Jay. Amma was his way to work his way into the system, but if you want to believe (your opinion) that he simply picked West Virginia out of a hat and came here to be nice, and that it is just a coincidence that this is an energy rich state and his family is energy intensive in investments, that is your business. I don't believe political party had a thing to do with this. He would have been (in my opinion) a socialist or a Tea Party person if it would have bought him a governorship or a 2% stake in control of national politics in a state where his family had huge energy interests.
In any event, back to the topic at hand. Jay, Miley, and now Mooney are examples of people coming here from outside of our state who were able to attain prominence in spite of their place of origin and they provide evidence that it really isn't a significant issue here. The reference group society issue is restricted to a particular small community level, and has little effect once one moves outside those circles. Our state is divided into 5 very different regions in any event, and someone from one of them considers somebody from another to be just as much an outsider as someone from New York or Mississippi. If you live in Bluefield, and you are going to be voting for somebody who is out of that region anyway, it isn't going to matter to you whether they are from Chester, Martinsburg, or from Maryland.
Last edited by CTMountaineer; 05-15-2014 at 01:33 PM..
The only time a outside politician or business moves to or shows interest into WV, is that 95% of the time they are trying to exploit or gain financially from it. People think they can move in and slick talk there way into office by just saying "Pro-Coal, Pro-Gas, Pro-Gun, and Pro-Business" and be welcomed with open arms like they have liberated us and will change everything wrong and cure the ills of our state. The state has always had some outside business interest to trying to control our state government.
The only reason Mooney is here because he seen a opportunity and is taking advantage of it. IMO, he is here for his own personal gain.
You don't see many people from out of state move here because they love it, although WV has the best people and is one of the most beautiful places in the world.
"From Away" is the term used in parts of Maine to describe anyone who wasn't born there. In some extreme cases people who move into town from a nearby town are still "from away", although it usually implies from out of state. If you are "from away" that designation is life long. After 50 years of continuous living in the area....you are still "from away!"
Another aspect to this way of thinking has to do with place names. When I moved to small town in NH....locals said, I bought the Wolfe House. Twenty years later people still said on meeting me.....Oh you live in the Wolfe house. After I sold and moved away.....I went back and wondered if now it would be referred to my name...Nope.....it now was the Bryant house....the family that built the house a good 50 years before the Wolfe family bought it. It was never going to be called by the name of that family "from away'.
In New Hampshire "flat lander" has similar connotation as "from away" or "not from around here". The implication in all cases...is that they are not like us.....so somewhat suspect. It is possible to build up trust....but not to shed the designation. A 20 year old up start can refer to someone who has lived in town for 50 years .... as "from away".
I think the power of the designation is weakening as people move about, and new folks in town are not so unusual....but in rural areas with a fairly homogenous indigenous population...it still has vitality...one will hear it and it has a negative connotation. "They aren't like us....they don't understand our ways."
"From Away" is the term used in parts of Maine to describe anyone who wasn't born there. In some extreme cases people who move into town from a nearby town are still "from away", although it usually implies from out of state. If you are "from away" that designation is life long. After 50 years of continuous living in the area....you are still "from away!"
Another aspect to this way of thinking has to do with place names. When I moved to small town in NH....locals said, I bought the Wolfe House. Twenty years later people still said on meeting me.....Oh you live in the Wolfe house. After I sold and moved away.....I went back and wondered if now it would be referred to my name...Nope.....it now was the Bryant house....the family that built the house a good 50 years before the Wolfe family bought it. It was never going to be called by the name of that family "from away'.
In New Hampshire "flat lander" has similar connotation as "from away" or "not from around here". The implication in all cases...is that they are not like us.....so somewhat suspect. It is possible to build up trust....but not to shed the designation. A 20 year old up start can refer to someone who has lived in town for 50 years .... as "from away".
I think the power of the designation is weakening as people move about, and new folks in town are not so unusual....but in rural areas with a fairly homogenous indigenous population...it still has vitality...one will hear it and it has a negative connotation. "They aren't like us....they don't understand our ways."
Having lived in Connecticut for years, and having immediate family in Connecticut and Massachusetts, I can say there is no part of our country more provincial, and in many ways more backward, than New England. People still live in the 1930s there in many ways, and public services are archaic and inefficient too due to an overburdened, tiered political system where every little hamlet is its own feifdom with an expensive and inefficient school system and superintendent to support too. They have layer of government on layer and nobody really wants to do anything. It isn't as corrupt as ours is here in WV, but it is even more inefficient due to the configuration which hasn't changed in 450 years.
In some ways, the attitudes of the natives match up with their government. Parochial in the extreme, they are slow to adapt and change, and expect everyone moving there to adopt the same stance, or you are quickly an outcast.
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