Rivertowns versus Scarsdale versus Harrison/Larchmont... (New Rochelle, Rye: fit in, house prices, neighborhoods)

[ca2ny]

Hello Folks,

We are moving from Northern California to NY.

I am providing detailed demographic information about our family, to get advice from folks on this board. This post is a bit long, but I figure I would get more pertinent and valuable advice, if I provided as much details as possible.

--- Family of five, husband and wife in 40s; 2 children in grades 4 and 6; 1 grandparent, 70 years old, but in excellent health. Grandparent will live 80% of the time with family; other 20% overseas.

--- Husband: Asian, PhD from top-tier university on west coast, engineer, will work near Wall St Metro station, annual salary plus bonus 250-350K. Expect to stay at least 5 to 10 years in the area.

--- Wife: White, rural mid-western, needs lots of personal space, college graduate, techie, worked for ~ 10 years, but will be a stay-at-home mom for next 4 to 8 years. Wife will suffocate in the city, or on the subway!!

--- Very strong preference for public schools. Want good schools, but doesn't have to be the best in county. To us, rating of 8, 9 and 10 are acceptable.

--- Don't want neighbors who will bug us to go to church! I don't mind folks who are religious, but they should leave us alone. No overt or covert pressure, or looks. Areas mixed with professional, and non-professional workers are OK.

--- We are liberal in views, but conservative in managing personal finances. We would like to buy about 25% below what banks would quality us based on income, rather than buy the max we can afford. We bought our last home in mid-90s in California, in a similar way, spending only 80% of what the banks qualified us for, and we completely paid it off in 13 years (We plan not to sell it.)

--- Hence we are thinking of a home in the 600K to 900K range, in southern Westchester county, putting about 25% cash down, rest a 15 year mortgage.

--- We visit Target, Costco and Walmart 90% of the time, and Macy's/Gap, maybe 2 times a year. We drive cars that cost 18-20K, not BMW or Mercedes or Lexus. So we will be out of place, if the cheapest car on our block is 40K! Our home is full of books and magazines, but we don't have any flat screen TV, or satellite/cable; so we would like a neighborhood, where we do not get pitch-forked for NOT having two satellite dishes sticking on to the roof! But we are perfectly fine having a BBQ and beer with a neighbor who works at an auto-repair shop.

--- Commute plan is: car to Metro North Railroad station + MNR to Grand Central + subway #4 or #5 to Wall St station + Walk (and reverse in the evening). Last 20 years, commute was 8 minutes to 25 minutes by car, so want to limit commute to no more than 90 minutes door-to-door, preferably 75 minutes or less.

--- House search filter is: bedroom >=4, baths >=2 (preferably, >=2.5), area >=1800 sq ft, lot >=5000, price in the range of 600 to 900 (but will go up to 1.1M for an extraordinary case, pool, etc.). Grandparent and husband both like gardening, so it would be great if the lot is level/some room for gardening.

We are considering below towns:

Hudson line: Hastings-on-Hudson, Dobbs Ferry, Irvington and Ardsley
Harlem line: Scarsdale
New Haven line: Harrison, Rye, Larchmont

Questions:
Q1: In many threads, Hastings-on-hudson, Irvington and Ardsley are recommended, but Dobbs Ferry does not seem to be recommended. Is Dobbs Ferry a good place to raise family?

Q2: We looked at some of the homes in Dobbs Ferry, but school district is listed as Ardsley. Why is that? What happens if Ardsley school is full with Ardsley children?

Q3: We found a home in Dobbs Ferry, near Juhring nature preserve. The home price here is about 200K less than comparable home in Scarsdale. So what's the catch? One is that it;s rocky ground, and hilly, so no lawn. But what else? Are there mountain lions coming out of the nature preserver? ;-)

A3b: There's rocky area behind this home in Dobbs Ferry, near the Juhring nature preserve. Are these stable, or should I worry about a landslide causing the whole house to be buried? Would all the snow melt from hills flood this home? Was this area mined, and is it full of sinkholes?

Q4: Areas along Harlem line seems flatter, but would the cold weather allow for any gardening? In California, we have 1 or more of all of below in our garden: orange, fig, pomegranate, nectarine, plum, peach. I know we can't have most of these in NY, but should I prefer Scarsdale over Dobs Ferry in the hope of being able to plant some fruit trees? Which fruits?

Q5: In case of hurricanes and nor'easters, are areas along Harlem and Hudson lines less vulnerabile than areas along the New haven line (wind speed already attenuated?). Did Sandy, for example, push water upstream in Hudson, and did it cause flooding in river towns?

Q6: There is always some degree of covert racism in most areas. Is it quite prevalent in these towns? Is it better along Hudson / river towns, compared to Scarsdale, or Rye/Larchmont/Harrison?

Q7: Wife is completely car-dependent type of person, but husband, grandparent and children enjoy active walking, and bicycling. Many of the towns in southern Westchester do not seem to have sidewalks, or bike lanes... are some of the towns listed above more friendly compared to others in this regard?

[AliciaN]

Oh my word.

As a fellow Californian transplant, I must first ask you to chill.

Here goes: the good news - no one here is going to encourage you to go to church, "pitchfork" you for not having two televisions or bat an eye at a mixed race marriage. On the other hand, they may roll their eyes if you are freaking out over landslides, mountain lions, sinkholes and fruit trees! With your income, despite how you choose to spend it, you should have no real problems fitting in to any town.

Any of towns you are looking at should more than fulfill your needs. Lots of gardening and hiking? Not going to happen so much around here. Its cold, half the year. Really cold. You are right to consider floodzones in your home search - look carefully at flood maps - but landslides, I think, are a Californian phenomenon more than a NY one. I'm pretty sure *nothing* happens if your Dobbs Ferry child attends an Ardsley school. These towns are tiny and I'm barely aware when I pass from Dobbs into Ardsley. Dobbs Ferry is a very nice place to raise a family, from all accounts, but its schools are rated less highly than, say Ardsley and Scarsdale. That accounts for your price differential in your Dobbs and Scarsdale houses. If you're looking for low key, you'll probably be happier there than Scarsdale. Not a lot of big box shopping in these towns, but you can find it if you're willing to drive.

[ponytrekker]

Originally Posted by ca2ny

H
Hudson line: Hastings-on-Hudson, Dobbs Ferry, Irvington and Ardsley

Yes, Yes, maybe and yes.

Harlem line: Scarsdale

No. If you don't drive at least a Lexus (or a Prius) your kids won't get invited to the cool kid parties.

New Haven line: Harrison, Rye, Larchmont

Yes, no, I am not sure.

River towns are walkable.

[john70]

For the money you are looking to spend, Dobbs Ferry will get you the most bang for your buck. The town is a little less stuffy than the other towns you are interested in. Schools are still very good but not as "good" as the others you have mentioned. Scarsdale and Rye are the top schools with regard to the towns you are considering, but the rest are excellent too. Many of these towns you will be hard pressed to find a home in the lower end of your range. Property taxes in all these areas are high and the river towns (hastings, ardsley, irvington) are often tight on inventory as they are so small.

I think you will find a largest Asian population and Scarsdale/Edgemont - if that is a consideration...

I love larchmont and Rye on the sound shore others prefer the River towns of Ardsley and Irvington. You have picked some very nice areas. The commute is most picturesque on the Hudson line if that matters..
We lived in Bronxville (couple stops south of Scarsdale) and it took me about 45-50 mins to get door to door near wall street. Add 5 mins to this if you are coming from Scarsdale.

You may want to consider Chappaqua as well. Its about 45 mins into CGT but you will find more on the market and prices are little lower as its a bit farther from NYC

[kletter1mann]

Others can comment more on river towns.

Originally Posted by ca2ny

Q3: We found a home in Dobbs Ferry, near Juhring nature preserve. The home price here is about 200K less than comparable home in Scarsdale. So what's the catch? One is that it;s rocky ground, and hilly, so no lawn. But what else? Are there mountain lions coming out of the nature preserver? ;-)

Of course. A house in Scarsdale is NOT comparable. It's in Scarsdale. Do some homework on Scarsdale to see why, there are many reasons.

Originally Posted by ca2ny

A3b: There's rocky area behind this home in Dobbs Ferry, near the Juhring nature preserve. Are these stable, or should I worry about a landslide causing the whole house to be buried? Would all the snow melt from hills flood this home? Was this area mined, and is it full of sinkholes?

Your concerns are so extreme that it's hard to know where to start. There are no meaningful geological instabilities here to concern yourself with.

Originally Posted by ca2ny

Q4: Areas along Harlem line seems flatter, but would the cold weather allow for any gardening? In California, we have 1 or more of all of below in our garden: orange, fig, pomegranate, nectarine, plum, peach. I know we can't have most of these in NY, but should I prefer Scarsdale over Dobs Ferry in the hope of being able to plant some fruit trees? Which fruits?

Yes, flatter than river towns. Gardening is possible if the lot gets sun. Search garden sites for what grows here. Your dreams of fruit trees is likely to remain a dream.

Originally Posted by ca2ny

Q5: In case of hurricanes and nor'easters, are areas along Harlem and Hudson lines less vulnerabile than areas along the New haven line (wind speed already attenuated?). Did Sandy, for example, push water upstream in Hudson, and did it cause flooding in river towns?

Yes. However, this shouldn't really be much of consideration unless you're living right on the water. do check flood zones and proximity to creeks that can flood.

Originally Posted by ca2ny

Q6: There is always some degree of covert racism in most areas. Is it quite prevalent in these towns? Is it better along Hudson / river towns, compared to Scarsdale, or Rye/Larchmont/Harrison?

Not an issue in your case.

Originally Posted by ca2ny

Q7: Wife is completely car-dependent type of person, but husband, grandparent and children enjoy active walking, and bicycling. Many of the towns in southern Westchester do not seem to have sidewalks, or bike lanes... are some of the towns listed above more friendly compared to others in this regard?

Forget bike lanes. Many towns - most probably - DO have sidewalks. Look around in the town in question, can't generalize.

[Forest_Hills_Daddy]

Rocky formations - You only need to worry if your house is at the bottom of s steep hill or mountain (there are some listings in Westchester that are). Avalanches are rare, if not unheard of, but you can get an inordinate amount of flooding in your property.

You sound like a household that will fit in Hastings. Since schools are out, try attending some community events to get a feel of the population.

[streetsmart]

Wow. I think of the places you mentioned you should look in Dobbs Ferry. Very nice place, fine schools, and you will get more bang for your buck because people have "determined" that the schools there aren't the very top tier cream of the crop elite and so just won't do for some.

A few other thoughts...

Westchester is not flat - in general it is very hilly and rocky. Pay close attention to where any potential house is on a hill or near a hill and always look at flood maps. It's not the coast you should be concerned about it is the smaller rivers around here that cause major flooding headaches. Also on this note, walking and biking might be more difficult in the River Towns. Sound Shore is better for this (ie. flatter). I don't know the Dobbs Ferry terrain, could be a problem, or not.

I can't imagine anyone here bugging you to go to church. I can't imagine anyone here caring.

You are going to need to look in the top of your price range for a half-way decent house. Be prepared to pay a lot more for a lot less than you could get anywhere else in the country. Things here are OLD. House, roads, infrastructure...OLD. Oh, and don't forget the taxes!!!

You cannot compare house prices from one town/village to another. It doesn't work that way. Put the same house in Scarsdale, Larchmont, Rye, Dobbs Ferry, Ardsley, etc, and it would be a different price in each. Schools, commute, town amenities, perception of desirability, all play a factor.

School districts are not co-terminous with village/town boundaries. It is very bizarre and confusing, so be very careful about finding out which school district a house is zoned for. For example, you could have a Scarsdale 10583 address and be zoned for Scarsdale schools, Edgemont schools, Eastchester schools, or New Rochelle schools. If a house price seems too good to be true it could be zoned for a "lesser" school district. And no, Ardsley schools won't "fill up" and bump your kid out if you are in Dobbs Ferry and zoned for that district.

I would say there is less racism here but more "class-ism". If you have the money to fit in nobody cares what you look like.

Nobody will care if you have satellite TV. ???

Fruit trees??? Ha! Maybe cherry trees. This ain't California. It's different. Chill out and go with it.

[jjinla]

Lol. We came from SoCal 3 years ago and are headed back west in 10 days for good. As others have stated, your fruit trees aren't happening. Another thing to consider is that you very likely need a bigger home here than in CA because you will be in it so much more. If its not freezing cold it is sweltering hot.

Others have covered the basics but I'd throw north Jersey into the mix too. Just from Larchmont it was about an hour door to door when my husband worked near GCT. Once he started working downtown it regularly took over 90 minutes getting home because a 2 minute delay on the subway would make you miss your connecting trip and you'd have to wait for the next train, which isn't aywhere near as frequent as subway.

You're more likely to be asked what country club you belong to out here than church. Good luck.

[VA Yankee]

Originally Posted by jjinla

Lol. We came from SoCal 3 years ago and are headed back west in 10 days for good. As others have stated, your fruit trees aren't happening. Another thing to consider is that you very likely need a bigger home here than in CA because you will be in it so much more. If its not freezing cold it is sweltering hot.

Others have covered the basics but I'd throw north Jersey into the mix too. Just from Larchmont it was about an hour door to door when my husband worked near GCT. Once he started working downtown it regularly took over 90 minutes getting home because a 2 minute delay on the subway would make you miss your connecting trip and you'd have to wait for the next train, which isn't aywhere near as frequent as subway.

You're more likely to be asked what country club you belong to out here than church. Good luck.

I have to agree with the above, plenty of great towns/schools in Bergen county. Good transport links and the ability to take the tubes into downtown makes for an easier commute. Many of the towns have walkable centers but most shopping will require a car and there is every big box store you could want, Paramus is a shopping mecca with no tax on clothes.

[Forest_Hills_Daddy]

Just a caveat on NJ - generally speaking you are still looking at an hour-long commute to financial district from good neighborhoods with good schools.