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Old 06-20-2011, 08:50 AM
 
Location: Back in COLORADO!!!
837 posts, read 1,168,413 times
Reputation: 1307

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthStarDelight View Post
Politics aside, I'd like to address the issue of employers vs employees, and the cause of our chronically high unemployment.

It's become quite clear to me that corporations no longer care about their employees on a massive, pervasive scale - shipping jobs overseas and trimming pay and benefits just to save a few pennies to the ever-so-important "shareholders". Do these greedy corporations not understand the meaning of "treason"? For that's exactly what it is - harming the social fabric of this country just to save a buck or two.
Hell yes! I've been saying this for years. Any American company who offshores an American job is guilty of treason. It's a pleasure to encounter someone else who understands just how serious and destructive this practice is to the workers and communities left behind...

Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthStarDelight View Post
People generally do NOT want a hand-out, they want a JOB. Preferably one that pays the bills.
Again, exactly right!


Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthStarDelight View Post
Today, employers have all the chips, and the employees have none. All of us need to band together and take back what's rightfully ours, the right to have a GOOD job, at GOOD pay, with GOOD benefits. Nothing less is acceptable. And I mean that, 100%.
Damn straight!

The only area where I disagree with you is taking away the profit motive. I'm mad as hell about what is happening too, but it isn't the desire to make a profit that's the problem, it's the desire to make a profit regardless of the damage that is the problem.....

Me personally, I couldn't care less how much money some fat cat CEO makes just as long as the regular people are able to benefit as well.
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Old 06-20-2011, 08:53 AM
 
9,856 posts, read 7,915,016 times
Reputation: 5319
Quote:
Originally Posted by maf763 View Post
And who are the shareholders? Everyday people who invest in the market with their 401K's and their mutual funds. Employees are shareholders. Collectively, we have created the system we have demanded.
For a public company, shareholders are those who hold stock, and their interest is determined by annual shareholders meetings in which stockholders vote on leadership of the company.


The goal of a public company is to grow the stock price. If an employee helps in that goal, they have little to worry about. An employee is a tool for a business to use to reach a goal. If you don't like it - start your own business.
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Old 06-20-2011, 08:56 AM
 
21,168 posts, read 16,779,225 times
Reputation: 9890
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenScoutII View Post
Hell yes! I've been saying this for years. Any American company who offshores an American job is guilty of treason. It's a pleasure to encounter someone else who understands just how serious and destructive this practice is to the workers and communities left behind...

Again, exactly right!




Damn straight!

The only area where I disagree with you is taking away the profit motive. I'm mad as hell about what is happening too, but it isn't the desire to make a profit that's the problem, it's the desire to make a profit regardless of the damage that is the problem.....

Me personally, I couldn't care less how much money some fat cat CEO makes just as long as the regular people are able to benefit as well.
I'm glad you agree with the OP. Maybe you can answer the same question I asked him, which he has yet to respond to.

How many jobs have you created? Has your not-for-profit, create high-paying jobs philosophy worked for you?
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Old 06-20-2011, 09:00 AM
 
21,168 posts, read 16,779,225 times
Reputation: 9890
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
For a public company, shareholders are those who hold stock, and their interest is determined by annual shareholders meetings in which stockholders vote on leadership of the company.


The goal of a public company is to grow the stock price. If an employee helps in that goal, they have little to worry about. An employee is a tool for a business to use to reach a goal. If you don't like it - start your own business.
The fact that people think the company is supposed to grow the stock price is concerning... as that's not how it's supposed to work.
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Old 06-20-2011, 09:02 AM
 
21,168 posts, read 16,779,225 times
Reputation: 9890
Quote:
Originally Posted by bande1102 View Post
I dunno--I'm generally a business-minded person who doesn't expect anything more than a fair paycheck from my employer. But corporations don't play fair. If I screw up, I face the consequences. Corporations screw up, they get a handout. So, yeah, that disconnect between corporate behavior in the market place and monetary reward does make all the arguments for employers a bit hollow. At this point, I do often feel that it is employee versus employer.

It would definitely be in the employer's best interest to care about their employees or at least take some type of personal interest. Case in point: My employer is sitting on a gold mine of underutilized skill sets. The bottom line is this: If I didn't have to work so hard to protect my job; I would definitely DO a better job.
If you feel that you are underutilized, why are you wasting your time at this company? You can make more money elsewhere.
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Old 06-20-2011, 09:12 AM
 
Location: Chicago area
4,350 posts, read 4,984,648 times
Reputation: 6606
I am definitely going to agree that employers no longer view their employees as part of the team nor an asset but rather as parasites. They are generating higher profits in the short term, but again their short-sighted scorched earth policies are causing irreparable harm to their ability to recruit and retain talent and tarnishing their brand names.

The large food conglomerate I work for loves to keep everyone as a temp with low pay and no benefits indefinitely. Even in this economy they constantly quit and disrupt operations. It frustrates the heck out of the technical mangers but corporate keeps telling them to get the work done, but don't hire anyone.

It is also apparent to anyone who has been interviewing lately how companies treat candidates like total garbage without any courtesy. In many cases I have driven 100 miles, been grilled all day by hacks that think they are Aron Hochner the psychological profiler, then have them never contact me again or tell me them hired internally.

To all those who complain that regulations are crippling companies, I'd answer the law is a company's only moral compass. I have no doubt that without regulations we'd have companies selling tainted food, poison as medicine, maintain unsafe work environments then throw their employees on the streets when they get hurt, poison the environment etc. Therefore, we need those regulations.

In the meantime, I don't invest in American companies and spend only what I need to to maintain a minimal standard of living (~$20k/year) and save the rest. I have no respect at all for them and say do whatever you need to do to survive lie to them, cheat, quit for a better offer, because there is no way you can stoop any lower than they have.
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Old 06-20-2011, 09:12 AM
 
9,856 posts, read 7,915,016 times
Reputation: 5319
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJBest View Post
The fact that people think the company is supposed to grow the stock price is concerning... as that's not how it's supposed to work.
What are you talking about? A company is not supposed to grow the stock price? That is the ONLY POINT of a public company. If you don't like that, then work for a private firm!

What a bizarre post.
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Old 06-20-2011, 09:15 AM
 
9,856 posts, read 7,915,016 times
Reputation: 5319
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSchemist80 View Post
I have no respect at all for them and say do whatever you need to do to survive lie to them, cheat, quit for a better offer, because there is no way you can stoop any lower than they have.
And dishonest, scumbag employees who lie, cheat and steal their way through life as you described are one of the major reasons employees are treated as resources rather than people.

You take advantage of and screw over your employers whenever you can and you expect them to treat you differently? How can you talk about company's not having a moral compass when you apparently don't have one of your own?
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Old 06-20-2011, 09:17 AM
 
Location: Brooklyn, NY
6,248 posts, read 3,169,839 times
Reputation: 6308
No one has a right to have a GOOD job, at GOOD pay, with GOOD benefits.

And I mean that, 100%.


And, yes, in a corporation the shareholders are indeed all important. Without their investment the entire enterprise comes to a grinding halt.
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Old 06-20-2011, 09:23 AM
 
Location: Chicago area
4,350 posts, read 4,984,648 times
Reputation: 6606
Quote:
Originally Posted by hnsq View Post
And dishonest, scumbag employees who lie, cheat and steal their way through life as you described are one of the major reasons employees are treated as resources rather than people.
Except that people are cheating often out of desperation and a need to survive. Companies are cheating out of greed. We can have a chicken and egg argument over which came first employers mistreating employees or employees mistreating employers, but it is quite clear to me now what the rules of the game are and that is there are none.
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