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Her menopause and personal problems do not give her license to be volatile or nasty to coworkers.
^ That, plus menopause shouldn't really cause her any problems other than perhaps hot flashes or fatigue from not sleeping right. I think most of the "menopause brain" and other fabled problems that get pinned on mp is really just aging plus the accumulated detrimental effects of poor nutrition and general failure to try to preserve one's health.
Don't rule out the possibility that she is huffing solvents.
Also, since this a female, we females have a lower tolerance for alcohol than men do. One beer consumed fast on an empty stomach can give a real intense buzz to some people.
Regarding the long-term employee, he actually has no problem with her personally; they get along fine and he's confirmed this with me. Apart from the fact he thinks she is a bit slow as far as speed of work, he's fine with her. And she is a bit slow but actually I would rather slow + careful and neat than faster + sloppy and needs to be cleaned up after.
But he has also noted some of the oddities I have (independently, I didn't bring it up to him) and came to me asking if I thought she might have a problem when he was sure he saw her chugging a can of Natural Lite.
However we have had two good productive days and our jobs are on schedule and clients are happy. So for now I am in a holding pattern.
LOL_Whut, I actually agree with you on your PS. I have to say that in almost 35 years in construction the only person I ever knew to have a (as in ONE) beer at lunch openly was a middle-aged German electrician. His wife packed it with his lunch. I don't recall anyone getting weird about that.
Also without going off-track on the menopause thing - I do believe it is real, but that's a whole different conversation. Also, there is a difference between reasons and excuses. I most certainly do not think hormones or mental health should be an excuse for poor behaviour in any context. But it can be a valid reason, and then dealt with.
LOL_Whut, I actually agree with you on your PS. I have to say that in almost 35 years in construction the only person I ever knew to have a (as in ONE) beer at lunch openly was a middle-aged German electrician. His wife packed it with his lunch. I don't recall anyone getting weird about that.
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That is cultural... many people have a beer with lunch in Germany. I lived there, I saw it and was shocked at first. However, I would be he would not have indulged if you told him not too.
Seems like this one employee is taking sooooo much of your time and energy worrying about what/how/when etc. I would ask her, flat out. Tell her straight out that someone mentioned that they thought she had a beer in her hand one day during working hours... and you are not accusing her, but you wanted to reiterate that you do not permit alcohol consumption during work or at lunch... in a very kind but firm manner. Lay it on the table. Why pussyfoot with this?!?
She might say NO WAY I would ever do that and then you can say, "OH of course, I thought that person was mistaken!" , or she will look confused, or she might quit and then you will know the answer.
However, menopause is HER very personal problem, and frankly, you should not be speculating about why her work has not been good. Either she is doing the job or she isn't. Period. Her personal life and health & hormones are her business! Did she come to you and say "Hey, Mr. Boss, I'm having hot flashes & having a problem when cutting in the straight edges at the corners?" I think not. If she had opened that door, then you could comment. Otherwise, you would be hugely out of line.
Are you afraid she will quit? Why the trepidation here? Do you have your people sign an employee manual or a list of policies when they accept employment with you? If you do not, this would be a perfect time to go over all the policies for your people with them in a brief meeting, and get each person to sign off, which acknowledges that they have read it and understand your work policies.
You can cover it all - being sick, late, lunch, overtime and ahem..... drinking and drugs.
Well, there you go. If I thought that someone was doing something ILLEGAL I would fire them immediately and turn their arse into the police. Different strokes I guess.
That is cultural... many people have a beer with lunch in Germany. I lived there, I saw it and was shocked at first. However, I would be he would not have indulged if you told him not too.
I agree on both counts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaving4Ca
Seems like this one employee is taking sooooo much of your time and energy worrying about what/how/when etc.
Well, it's not really taking THAT much energy or time, not at all. It's not like this is a paramount problem in my life. I just posted here because a: it's not an issue I've ever had to deal with, specifically and b: there are many people on this forum with lots of valuable experience and input and I figured I could mine that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaving4Ca
I would ask her, flat out. Tell her straight out that someone mentioned that they thought she had a beer in her hand one day during working hours... and you are not accusing her, but you wanted to reiterate that you do not permit alcohol consumption during work or at lunch... in a very kind but firm manner. Lay it on the table. Why pussyfoot with this?!?
She might say NO WAY I would ever do that and then you can say, "OH of course, I thought that person was mistaken!" , or she will look confused, or she might quit and then you will know the answer.
Because I am not a "large, faceless corporate entity", I am a hands-on owner of a very small business where we all work closely together, and I wanted primarily to be fair to the employee. Since there are only four of us I'm not about to lay the accusation on one of her co-workers and create bad feelings. If I'm the boss, I must be 100 percent responsible for any accusations, in the end.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaving4Ca
However, menopause is HER very personal problem, and frankly, you should not be speculating about why her work has not been good. Either she is doing the job or she isn't. Period. Her personal life and health & hormones are her business! Did she come to you and say "Hey, Mr. Boss, I'm having hot flashes & having a problem when cutting in the straight edges at the corners?" I think not. If she had opened that door, then you could comment. Otherwise, you would be hugely out of line.
Actually I am Ms Boss and post-menopausal. Been there and done that! So, yeah, I think that changes the texture of that particular conversation just a bit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leaving4Ca
Are you afraid she will quit? Why the trepidation here? Do you have your people sign an employee manual or a list of policies when they accept employment with you? If you do not, this would be a perfect time to go over all the policies for your people with them in a brief meeting, and get each person to sign off, which acknowledges that they have read it and understand your work policies.
You can cover it all - being sick, late, lunch, overtime and ahem..... drinking and drugs.
No, covered above, no, I agree and also addressed in a previous post.
The intermittent weird and inappropriate behaviour I alluded to in previous posts in this thread suddenly escalated and the employee in question became bizarre and combative today, seriously for no good reason. (After being openly rude to someone else on the job today, also for no good reason, and then walking off the job.) We are talking major attitude and paranoia about perceived but not-real slights, anger, and well jeez I just don't know what-all. Her behaviour got even stranger. For the second time in three months she walked off the job in the middle of the day over something I swear was imaginary and . In 34 years of hiring people, I have never had a person bail in the middle of the day with no good reason, let alone the same person twice in three months.
The first time it happened I was quite worried about her mental/physical health and called her a bunch of times before she got back to me and she had a weird excuse but after a long talk I thought we'd worked it out. Today she started accusing me and one of the clients of some fairly weird **** and when I was trying to understand what she was talking about, she went nuclear on me, then hung up. I was actually sort of shaken, not to mention quite confused!
I don't know if it's paranoia (that's definitely an issue she has), some flavor of mental or emotional illness, or management problems, drinking, or what. I really don't know. She has problems, that's for sure. She goes from competent and alert and friendly to angry and muttering within minutes, it's disorienting. She gets her final check from me tomorrow morning for the hours she's worked since last Wednesday. I will wish her well and feel sort of sad for her but I am not making this my problem.
That's very unnerving. Too bad - but business comes first and foremost. I hope by the time she comes in tomorrow for her cheque she'll be a little more stable but if you fear that might not be the case you may want to bring in some backup just in case ...
The intermittent weird and inappropriate behaviour I alluded to in previous posts in this thread suddenly escalated and the employee in question became bizarre and combative today, seriously for no good reason. (After being openly rude to someone else on the job today, also for no good reason, and then walking off the job.) We are talking major attitude and paranoia about perceived but not-real slights, anger, and well jeez I just don't know what-all. Her behaviour got even stranger. For the second time in three months she walked off the job in the middle of the day over something I swear was imaginary and . In 34 years of hiring people, I have never had a person bail in the middle of the day with no good reason, let alone the same person twice in three months.
The first time it happened I was quite worried about her mental/physical health and called her a bunch of times before she got back to me and she had a weird excuse but after a long talk I thought we'd worked it out. Today she started accusing me and one of the clients of some fairly weird **** and when I was trying to understand what she was talking about, she went nuclear on me, then hung up. I was actually sort of shaken, not to mention quite confused!
I don't know if it's paranoia (that's definitely an issue she has), some flavor of mental or emotional illness, or management problems, drinking, or what. I really don't know. She has problems, that's for sure. She goes from competent and alert and friendly to angry and muttering within minutes, it's disorienting. She gets her final check from me tomorrow morning for the hours she's worked since last Wednesday. I will wish her well and feel sort of sad for her but I am not making this my problem.
That's very unnerving. Too bad - but business comes first and foremost. I hope by the time she comes in tomorrow for her cheque she'll be a little more stable but if you fear that might not be the case you may want to bring in some backup just in case ...
I agree & sorry to hear. Be careful next time. You're very kind & understanding, but as STT says, business is business. Walking off in the middle of a job after disruptive behavior isn't professional. Don't let it get to time 3... once & it's time to find another place to show up to everyday.
Good luck & be safe. I also agree in having backup & maybe even not allowing her onto the job site... someone can run her last paycheck out to her with a 'Best wishes' & a firm parting that she not return. She's subjected others to enough of her display. It's your company & your reputation on the line.
Best of luck & I'll send good thoughts your way. Let us know how it works out.
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I have to say that in almost 35 years in construction the only person I ever knew to have a (as in ONE) beer at lunch openly was a middle-aged German electrician. His wife packed it with his lunch. I don't recall anyone getting weird about that.
, or she will look confused, or she might quit and then you will know the answer.
So, yeah, I think that changes the texture of that particular conversation just a bit.
. In 34 years of hiring people, I have never had a person bail in the middle of the day with no good reason, let alone the same person twice in three months.
be safe
