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My company has not only frozen salary increases for everyone, it has cut out the match to the 401(k) and significantly raised our contribution to insurance. All of these changes were clearly commincated to everyone on a series of conference calls and communications.
No Christmas parties and gifts here. Be grateful for what you do have. I work for a large non profit. I trust they are doing what is right these days to stay solvent as I see other attempts at reining in the budget.
Before I expand on this topic, let me give you a little background info about me. In July of 2008, I started working my first post-college, entry-level job. Initially, as part of a probationary period, I was hired as a contractor. A few months later, I received a job offer from the city government, but my employer hired me directly and gave me a $4000/yr pay increase to match it. The President/HR Manager of the company told me some very promising things about my future with the company. She also emphasized how happy they were with my work. Needless to say, I was very excited.
City government jobs typically have a "sky's the limit" atmosphere. There are networking opportunities there that don't exist anywhere else. There are both upward and lateral moves available in addition to some of the best benefits ever. Why on earth did you pass on that opportunity?
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I have busted my hump trying to prove that I do excellent work and am fully capable of more than entry-level work. I've come in early, stayed late, worked plenty of overtime, volunteered for projects, etc. They even told me they're pleased with my work. Now all I'm left thinking is what is the point of this?!?!
Of course they are happy with your work. They are paying an entry level salary and taking full advantage of your eagerness to do more and more for free.
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Fortunately, I have a promising job interview next week with another company, so I'm not without some hope of a better opportunity. But is this considered the norm these days? The president of the company bragged about how well we're doing as a company despite the state of the economy, so I don't think they're buckling down.
Many workers will probably tell you that they are doing the work of 2-3 people. Businesses let people go due to the economy and don't replace them and whoever is left must pick up the slack. The company may be doing just fine financially but if they believe they can use "the economy" as an excuse to save money on employees, in this climate they will. That is just reality. If I recall correctly when you posted your starting salary in another thread, that $4k you got equates to well above a 10 percent increase. not bad for being there a year and a half.
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To the folks that have been around the block a few times, what do you suggest I do? Do you think it's time to start looking for work elsewhere? Should I ask again for a performance review? Does this sound like a bad company or just poor management?
Anyone working an entry level job should have their finger on the pulse of the current job market and interview as often as they can. You were told that performance reviews would be done early in the year. We are 10 days into the new year. Asking now would be ill advised IMO. When I hear the phrase "early in the year" I think of January through March. If nothing is said by March, then perhaps I would inquire.
It doesn't sound like a bad company; it sounds like a very typical scenario that is playing out across most companies these days.
I spoke to the president of the company there, and she was bragging "how nice it is that we're doing so well that we can pick and choose which business we want to do". To me, it seems like they're doing pretty darn well. I don't know, maybe I'm missing something though.
I don't think it matters much that your company is doing well financially - the reality is that salaries across the whole country are sort of frozen right now. It makes no sense for a company to pay more than the going rate for any employee - and guess what? The going rate is either frozen or has gone down recently.
But remember it's temporary - things are starting to turn around in some areas, and as the economy gets better, and the unemployment rate goes down, salaries will start to go up again. It's inevitable!
City government jobs typically have a "sky's the limit" atmosphere. There are networking opportunities there that don't exist anywhere else. There are both upward and lateral moves available in addition to some of the best benefits ever. Why on earth did you pass on that opportunity?
After comparing/contrasting public sector jobs with private sector job, the impression I got was that public sector jobs were typically more secure, but upward mobility and higher pay was less common. On the other hand, the private sector is more dynamic and pay is usually much higher. I don't know where you got your information in regards to your quote above, but I honestly would have never guessed that.
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Originally Posted by cleasach
Of course they are happy with your work. They are paying an entry level salary and taking full advantage of your eagerness to do more and more for free.
I think you hit the nail on the head. I mean, let's look at the facts. I started with this company in July 2008. I received my offer from the city government in September 2008. All of a sudden, within a matter of two months, I was worth $4,000/yr more to them, not to mention the cost of benefits. Fast forward to today. It's been a year a half since I received the initial matching offer. After getting all this additional experience and truly proving my skills/worth, I'm not worth a dime more?
In reference to another user's post, I'm not trying to sound like a whiner. If I were an NFL player making millions of dollars and telling you that wasn't enough, then I'd probably agree with you. But let's be completely honest with each other for a moment. The fact is, you have expectations after getting out of college.
First, you expect a decent starting salary. Another user posted a list of median starting salaries by major. Well, even after my "raise" a year and half ago, I'm making almost $10k less than what the median starting salary is for my degree (and even my position, according to Salary.com). Of course, when I've mentioned this on forums such as city-data, I get people telling me that I sound like a whiny college grad. Um, okay. That's just about the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Ironically, many people who tell me this are baby boomers who paid a fraction for their college education compared to what I had to pay for mine. Nonetheless, I've accepted my low salary as the status quo for this economy.
Second, after accepting a low entry-level salary, you'd expect that it would go up after proving your so-called worth to the company. Well, here I am, a year and a half in, with about 5 years of solid full-time work experience, and I'm still working for peanuts. Apparently, as other people have mentioned, you get your biggest raises when you move to another company. That is what I shall do.
Third, you expect some form of performance review. I want to see how I performed over the past year. I also want to see if there are areas where I can improve. I'd like to find out if I can take some classes at the local community college in order to better establish myself in the field. I'd like to see if there might be some room in another area of the company that I'm interested in. These kinds of discussions aren't easy to facilitate when your managers work in Minnesota and Chicago respectively, while you're over 1000 miles away in Denver.
Bottom line, please don't tell me I sound whiny. You all know very well that if you invested your time and hard earned money into something, you'd expect to see some dividends. And if you didn't, you'd probably be on here venting, too.
After comparing/contrasting public sector jobs with private sector job, the impression I got was that public sector jobs were typically more secure, but upward mobility and higher pay was less common. On the other hand, the private sector is more dynamic and pay is usually much higher. I don't know where you got your information in regards to your quote above, but I honestly would have never guessed that.
I think you hit the nail on the head. I mean, let's look at the facts. I started with this company in July 2008. I received my offer from the city government in September 2008. All of a sudden, within a matter of two months, I was worth $4,000/yr more to them, not to mention the cost of benefits. Fast forward to today. It's been a year a half since I received the initial matching offer. After getting all this additional experience and truly proving my skills/worth, I'm not worth a dime more?
In reference to another user's post, I'm not trying to sound like a whiner. If I were an NFL player making millions of dollars and telling you that wasn't enough, then I'd probably agree with you. But let's be completely honest with each other for a moment. The fact is, you have expectations after getting out of college.
First, you expect a decent starting salary. Another user posted a list of median starting salaries by major. Well, even after my "raise" a year and half ago, I'm making almost $10k less than what the median starting salary is for my degree (and even my position, according to Salary.com). Of course, when I've mentioned this on forums such as city-data, I get people telling me that I sound like a whiny college grad. Um, okay. That's just about the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Ironically, many people who tell me this are baby boomers who paid a fraction for their college education compared to what I had to pay for mine. Nonetheless, I've accepted my low salary as the status quo for this economy.
Second, after accepting a low entry-level salary, you'd expect that it would go up after proving your so-called worth to the company. Well, here I am, a year and a half in, with about 5 years of solid full-time work experience, and I'm still working for peanuts. Apparently, as other people have mentioned, you get your biggest raises when you move to another company. That is what I shall do.
Third, you expect some form of performance review. I want to see how I performed over the past year. I also want to see if there are areas where I can improve. I'd like to find out if I can take some classes at the local community college in order to better establish myself in the field. I'd like to see if there might be some room in another area of the company that I'm interested in. These kinds of discussions aren't easy to facilitate when your managers work in Minnesota and Chicago respectively, while you're over 1000 miles away in Denver.
Bottom line, please don't tell me I sound whiny. You all know very well that if you invested your time and hard earned money into something, you'd expect to see some dividends. And if you didn't, you'd probably be on here venting, too.
mcb1025,
Everything you are saying is reasonable -- you are an articulate person. I tend to agree with many of the other posters here though -- in an economy where tens of thousands of college graduates and experienced professionals with advanced degrees are unemployed or underemployed, many of whom can't even get considered for part-time retail or restaurant jobs in order to survive--you lack a sense of proportion.
I am not saying "Shut up, suck it up, and be grateful for what you have." What I AM saying is that if you expect the working world to behave rationally and reasonably and fairly toward YOU--in a climate where it is utterly scr*wing tens of thousands of others with even MORE credentials and experience--you lack a sense of proportion.
My own view is that you should work on bettering yourself through further education and by looking for a better position, just as you are doing. I do however think that just as importantly, you need to shift your "attitude" to one of gratitude for what you have been able to achieve instead of one of feeling "hard done by." Check out my threads here called "Voices of the Unemployed" or the stories at studentloanjustice-- if reading these doesn't give you some perspective, I don't know what else will.
Everything you are saying is reasonable -- you are an articulate person. I tend to agree with many of the other posters here though -- in an economy where tens of thousands of college graduates and experienced professionals with advanced degrees are unemployed or underemployed, many of whom can't even get considered for part-time retail or restaurant jobs in order to survive--you lack a sense of proportion.
I am not saying "Shut up, suck it up, and be grateful for what you have." What I AM saying is that if you expect the working world to behave rationally and reasonably and fairly toward YOU--in a climate where it is utterly scr*wing tens of thousands of others with even MORE credentials and experience--you lack a sense of proportion.
My own view is that you should work on bettering yourself through further education and by looking for a better position, just as you are doing. I do however think that just as importantly, you need to shift your "attitude" to one of gratitude for what you have been able to achieve instead of one of feeling "hard done by." Check out my threads here called "Voices of the Unemployed" or the stories at studentloanjustice-- if reading these doesn't give you some perspective, I don't know what else will.
I agree. Thanks for the post. I've seen the threads you've posted and they're very enlightening. As a rational individual, and someone who has studied economics extensively, I understand all too well what's occurring in this economy. On the other hand, as a frustrated worker, I sometimes let my emotions run wild on these forums. I apologize for the venting session. I just needed to get it off my chest and get some other points of view.
I agree. Thanks for the post. I've seen the threads you've posted and they're very enlightening. As a rational individual, and someone who has studied economics extensively, I understand all too well what's occurring in this economy. On the other hand, as a frustrated worker, I sometimes let my emotions run wild on these forums. I apologize for the venting session. I just needed to get it off my chest and get some other points of view.
Venting can be very healthy. Nothing wrong with letting your emotions get the best of you, so long as you know you need to rein them in with your brain.
You are ahead of the game in your willingness to learn from others by carefully considering their points of view on these types of issues. You have gotten a lot of good, practical advice here from people with a lot of working experience--if you continue to listen carefully, you will "wise up" about the "unwritten rules of business" much earlier than a lot of your peers. Hearing various perspectives is worth its weight in gold.
No one likes to put themselves out there only to be called "whiney"--but it's a small price to pay for getting a first-class education. Take it from one who had to learn these things "pre internet" first-hand via the school of hard knocks!
After comparing/contrasting public sector jobs with private sector job, the impression I got was that public sector jobs were typically more secure, but upward mobility and higher pay was less common. On the other hand, the private sector is more dynamic and pay is usually much higher. I don't know where you got your information in regards to your quote above, but I honestly would have never guessed that.
I can only speak to where I live. I know a lot of people who took civil service jobs that started with low pay and either through exams or requests to transfer to different State offices are pretty well for themselves, have job security and tremendous benefits/pensions. The salary is definitely not as high as a private sector job but I think in today's climate and going forward, job security may play a larger role at least until the private sector makes a comeback.
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Bottom line, please don't tell me I sound whiny. You all know very well that if you invested your time and hard earned money into something, you'd expect to see some dividends. And if you didn't, you'd probably be on here venting, too.
I will say that yes, you sound like you are whining, BUT, and I repeat, BUT, that is not meant in a deragatory way. You just don't have the years of experience in the working world to understand that this is how it is and you're so disgusted with the situation that you are complaining about it. It's like taking your kid to Disneyworld and they whine because the lines are long. The only thing you can say to that is "Get used to it, kid. that's the way it is." Does it suck? Absolutely. But saying that does not change the situation at all.
I think in an earlier post that you made a while back you mentioned older workers in your office being lazy or something to that effect. The reason for that is that they have become jaded and realize that whether they expend tremendous effort on the job or just do the minimum to get by, everyone is pretty much treated the same way so there's no incentive to be eager and volunteer and work late and come in early and everything else....
Then you have new grads who come in and are aghast at these mediocre performing people and think "Wow, I can run rings around these people..." and proceed to work their asses off only expecting to skyrocket to the top of the chain. Eventually, you see that there's no real benefit to doing so and you become jaded as well. Then a crop of new grads come in and the cycle starts all over again.
I think in an earlier post that you made a while back you mentioned older workers in your office being lazy or something to that effect. The reason for that is that they have become jaded and realize that whether they expend tremendous effort on the job or just do the minimum to get by, everyone is pretty much treated the same way so there's no incentive to be eager and volunteer and work late and come in early and everything else....
Actually, I was under the impression that they have absolutely no ambition and are content with what they have. A lot of the folks I was referring to are individuals who never pursued a college education. Instead, they seem rather content with their unchallenging, menial jobs just so long as they're collecting a paycheck. In fact, a woman I work with told me that she was content with her job because she thinks she makes good money for a woman. I estimate she makes between $12-$14/hr. Relatively speaking, she probably has a good point due to the state of the economy. My father is the same way. He's been a truck driver for 30+ years. Just last year, he was forced to take a 10% pay cut. Though disappointed, he seems perfectly content with this, because he realizes that he's extremely limited with his options.
At any rate, if you're correct, then there'd be absolutely no reason whatsoever to show loyalty to a company.
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Nothing wrong with letting your emotions get the best of you, so long as you know you need to rein them in with your brain.
