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Romans were uncouth and ignorant, they very good at negotiating and very stubborn.
Most of the technicians, engineers, accountants, a large part of all the merchantmen, shipchandlers, insurers, etc, were "Hellenistic Greeks".
So you are going to find them everywhere where the Roman presence was important. Of course, Phoenicians from Gades and Carthagineans were also Middle Easteners.
There were also present in modern day Wales, a very important place for them because of tin.
Whatever Romans were, it had nothing to do with genetics, today the Greek are rather bad at engineering, even the Italians are way better at it.
Plus, you contradict yourself in your ridiculously generalizing statements. Someone who is very stubborn can't be very good at negotiating, quite to the contrary.
And the Greeks themselves got much of their sophistication from Egypt. In my view the Greeks are one of the most overestimated people in history.
Apart from that, I was not discussing all that, I was just referring to your prior statement that "the presence of Middle Easteners markers in scarce in the Iberian peninsula". That is not the case at all.
Present day Italians, Greeks and Egyptians have little or nothing in common with the Romans, Ancient Greeks or classical Egyptians. The same as the present Turks are not Trojans. It may sound nice, for example, when we refer to ourselves as the "sons of the Romans" but it is just mythical feel-good language.
Present day Italians, Greeks and Egyptians have little or nothing in common with the Romans, Ancient Greeks or classical Egyptians. The same as the present Turks are not Trojans. It may sound nice, for example, when we refer to ourselves as the "sons of the Romans" but it is just mythical feel-good language.
They didn't vanish into thin air. Of course modern Italians are still the ones closest to the Romans, albeit of course far from identical and less so towards the extreme north and south of the country.
Just like the ancient Egyptians live on in modern Egypt. They simply got absorbed in the general gene pool that of course got broader and broader with every invasion and migration.
They didn't vanish into thin air. Of course modern Italians are still the ones closest to the Romans, albeit of course far from identical and less so towards the extreme north and south of the country.
Just like the ancient Egyptians live on in modern Egypt. They simply got absorbed in the general gene pool that of course got broader and broader with every invasion and migration.
Obviously true. However i didn't say they completely vanished I said that we have little or nothing to do with them. But just looking at them you can see that, especially the Greeks (though they may not like it) are more Balkan than ancient Greek and today's Egyptians look more Arab than they look like the Pharaohs. The Romans of old and the Etruscans really no longer exist as a people. Of course like one experiment in Turkey found Phoenician DNA slightly present in a modern Turk who claimed to be a Phoenician, some DNA of these older groups can be found but not certainly, in any industrial quantities.
It is said that the two peoples who most closely resemble their ancestors of 2000 years ago are the two most contiguous cultures; Han China and strange as it may seem Iran.
I don't even think they have little to do with Romans. We don't have photos of Romans, nor of ancient Greeks, so it is hard to tell from looks.
Egyptians are still quite varied in terms of looks. I read time and again that they are still more or less the same people they used to be in the past.
White isn't a race....it's a skin colour. I consider people from the Middle East the same as I do with everyone else...either they're Iranian, Saudi Arabian or Syrian, just like I consider you (the OP) American.
I don't even think they have little to do with Romans. We don't have photos of Romans, nor of ancient Greeks, so it is hard to tell from looks.
Egyptians are still quite varied in terms of looks. I read time and again that they are still more or less the same people they used to be in the past.
I have heard that about those people in Portugal and also about the people of the Costa del Sur and the Huelva in Spain. It is of course entirely possible.
As to the looks of the ancient Greeks and Romans and to a lesser degree the Egyptians, we may not have photos but there is enough statuary to convince scholars of their size and facial features. There are also some written descriptions of historic figures in classical literature. Maybe not enough to be convincing on their own but add to that the statuary and I think we have a very good picture as to what both the Greeks and the Romans looked like.
Since you mentioned Egyptians not looking like pharaohs, the problem about that statement is that pharaohs did not look like regular Egyptians, there was serious inbreeding and they considered themselves a separate caste so to speak. That is similar to royals in Europe and probably other parts of the world, too.
Statues were usually made of only relatively few people, often of the same important characters such as kings over and over again.
Present day Italians, Greeks and Egyptians have little or nothing in common with the Romans, Ancient Greeks or classical Egyptians. The same as the present Turks are not Trojans. It may sound nice, for example, when we refer to ourselves as the "sons of the Romans" but it is just mythical feel-good language.
Well, Cleopatra was a descendant of macedonians, for exemple, belonged to the dynasty of the Ptolemies. So i guess she wasn´t 100% ethnically egyptian. But i don´t agree with your observations, even we aren´t "romans", "gauls", "phoenicians" etc., populations retain its genetic heritage, and if we talk about culture... the cultural basis of wetern countries is greco-roman, i could put thousands of examples, not just the language: since the system of law, military organization, the basis of any discipline scientific, even the current scientific method, the religion, and all kinds of cultural events etc etc so i don´t see incorrect to say that we are "sons of rome" because it´s mostly true.
A white/black baby in 98% of cases will clearly show the black features, even if the color of skin will be much lighter than usual. Black genes are more dominant - as simple as that.
Dark hair/dark eyes are more dominant in Europeans as well, comparably to blond hair/blue eyes by the way too.)
I still don't understand how/why ancestry "doesn't have anything to do with it," because you carry the genes of your ancestors.
What's there is to fight about?
Not true. You probably feel this way because most mixed race children in the USA that look White identify as such while those that look Black identify as Mixed. There are advantages to being the majority and disadvantages to being Black.
Becuase of the misinformation about the concept of race in the United States it is not usually worth the time or effort these topics but I have nothing better to do. The people of the Arab world come from a variety of backgrounds, similar to Latin America. That is all that is worth mentioning. Even many Europeans have a mixture of genetic influences.
What is White though, does it really exist? So many variations. Most native born Scandinavians do not look native born Greek and so on.
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