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I'm not sure what I believe about alkaline vs acid. But I'm not that interested in in anyway.
I'm somewhat into supplements IF you know what you're doing/IF you need them. I wish more doctors were up to speed with diet and supplements. I just read something that said that prescription drugs are the 4th leading cause of death, tied with stroke, according to the Harvard Center of Ethics. I don't have the original source--that would take some more looking into--but in general, I think I would tend to agree. So many side effects of drugs and they deplete vitamins and minerals. Proper diet is very important but not everyone (especially older people and the chronically ill) can absorb all they need from foods. Not to mention the diets that some people eat!
Back to alkaline vs acid, if anyone else has anything to say!
Two articles here I thought had a good perspective and good information (and simply written for the average reader) on the topics of 1) "acid vs. alkaline" foods, and 2) the use of supplements.
The take home message for this article, as I see it, is that "alkaline" foods tend to be those that are better for you, ie, may help to prevent cardiovascular disease, obesity, type 2 diabetes, and all those other evils of our life styles here, so eating more of those and less of the "acidic" foods, such as meat, sugar and other carbohydrates may be a good thing. But they don't have any role in changing the body's pH to any great degree. As the article mentions the pH of the body's circulation is maintained in a narrow range of 7.35-7.45, and this is controlled via buffer systems to maintain that pH, as well as the functions of the respiratory and renal systems. The urine pH will vary according to a number of physiological factors (can have a pH of 5 to 9 or so) and diet to some extent-but it's main purpose is to maintain that central pH. The pH of digestive juices in the stomach are extremely acidic, around 1 or so (although this may be changed to some degree through ingestion of antacids or proton pump inhibitors), it's this low for the purposes of digestion.
The article on supplements (it's from 2012, so a few yrs old) is, IMO, a good summary on the good, bad and ugly of supplements.
Two articles here I thought had a good perspective and good information (and simply written for the average reader) on the topics of 1) "acid vs. alkaline" foods, and 2) the use of supplements.
The take home message for this article, as I see it, is that "alkaline" foods tend to be those that are better for you, ie, may help to prevent cardiovascular disease, obesity, type 2 diabetes, and all those other evils of our life styles here, so eating more of those and less of the "acidic" foods, such as meat, sugar and other carbohydrates may be a good thing. But they don't have any role in changing the body's pH to any great degree. As the article mentions the pH of the body's circulation is maintained in a narrow range of 7.35-7.45, and this is controlled via buffer systems to maintain that pH, as well as the functions of the respiratory and renal systems. The urine pH will vary according to a number of physiological factors (can have a pH of 5 to 9 or so) and diet to some extent-but it's main purpose is to maintain that central pH. The pH of digestive juices in the stomach are extremely acidic, around 1 or so (although this may be changed to some degree through ingestion of antacids or proton pump inhibitors), it's this low for the purposes of digestion.
The article on supplements (it's from 2012, so a few yrs old) is, IMO, a good summary on the good, bad and ugly of supplements.
Interesting. I think the issue is that, of course, the body will always work to maintain the proper ph. But the theory is that things like sugar and meat or soda make it that much harder. They put extra stress on the body to maintain the right ph.
Gout is caused by one of four different crystals and the only way it can be properly diagnosed is via synovial fluid analysis, and that is rarely part of the diagnosis.
Most doctors just assume it is arthritic (as the source of your article indicates).
Many of the low purine foods are also more alkaline than acidic.
If you are not interested in how diet affects your health (including how to reduce inflammation through food), then the question of more alkaline foods will not interest you.
Gout is associated with high blood uric acid levels, which in association with red inflamed joints (usually involving the big toe or sometimes finger joints, although it may involve other joints as well, will generally alert a physician to the possibility of gout in a patient. Gout is caused by the production of urate crystals (from those high uric acid levels) that accumulate in the joints, there are other types of crystals that may also accumulate in the joint and cause similar findings, but this is not gout, it may be referred to as "pseudogout".
I never claimed that the linked article was the sole go-to place for information on gout, but it did provide a simple explanation, and you will note that there is no mention of pH as a cause of gout. You are correct in that physicians recommend diets that avoid the excessive consumption of purine-containing foods, but the reason for that is that purines (building blocks of proteins) are broken down by the body
to uric acid, which in a patient unable to excrete excess uric acids in the kidneys may lead to accumulation of uric acid and formation of uric acid crystals (urates).
I posted this article simply as information to counter your posted misconceptions and misinformation about gout.
Disparaging remarks about my interest (or lack of same) in the links between diet and health are irrelevant and change none of the above.
Last edited by Travelassie; 11-13-2017 at 11:19 AM..
Interesting. I think the issue is that, of course, the body will always work to maintain the proper ph. But the theory is that things like sugar and meat or soda make it that much harder. They put extra stress on the body to maintain the right ph.
Yes, I think it was Gypsy Chic who mentioned it was the in particular the bones that could be adversely effected to in those efforts to maintain the pH. IIRC my college physiology and biochemistry courses, calcium, phosphorus, magnesium and other ions play roles in "buffering" (through the bicarbonate systems) the blood pH in its normal range. These ions also play roles in maintaining bone health (as well as other tissues). Generally the adverse effects of bone loss are seen in patients with other diseases or conditions in which the body's regulatory systems are compromised, but there is no telling where that derangement can start, and it's a good argument for a healthy diet (and exercise, and so on).
The macrobiotic diet explains it as acid FORMING, not actually being acidic. Meaning it would make the body a little bit more acidic and would make the body work harder to retain the correct balance. Probably calling it "acidic" is shorthand for being acid forming.
The topic is Alkaline vs Acid Food Lists, not who is right or wrong. This is Alternative Medicine. If you don't want to discuss Alternative Medicine except to say you don't believe in it, then this is the wrong forum for you. Infractions will be issued.
I may have posted a post on this before, and since there is some discussion going on about alkaline vs acidic body environment, this is a pretty straight forward list of foods. There are many others so one can check others too.
Don't get confused! That tape is to test your saliva and urine. The urine, especially in the AM is supposed to be acidic because it should contain acid wastes from your cells!
Fruits that are acidic are ALKALINE inside your body. Berries are one of the most healthful thing you can put in your mouth. Even mainstream "experts" are coming around to this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nU_RkeA88DY
So don't use that link as a grocery shopping list.
The topic is Alkaline vs Acid Food Lists, not who is right or wrong. This is Alternative Medicine. If you don't want to discuss Alternative Medicine except to say you don't believe in it, then this is the wrong forum for you. Infractions will be issued.
I know and I'm just pointing out something about the reference used in the post. Sorry for the way it came across. I'm not criticizing the topic or the post. There is just a lot of confusion about the topic. What might be acidic when digested can have an alkaline effect on the body. So it is important to find foods that are alkaline FORMING not ACID FORMING inside the body.
I know and I'm just pointing out something about the reference used in the post. Sorry for the way it came across. I'm not criticizing the topic or the post. There is just a lot of confusion about the topic. What might be acidic when digested can have an alkaline effect on the body. So it is important to find foods that are alkaline FORMING not ACID FORMING inside the body.
This is what I've read about lemons and limes, being acidic but alkaline once in the body. I've used lemons a lot but have backed off for some reason...hard to keep up with everything I do, sometimes. Thanks
I know and I'm just pointing out something about the reference used in the post. Sorry for the way it came across. I'm not criticizing the topic or the post. There is just a lot of confusion about the topic. What might be acidic when digested can have an alkaline effect on the body. So it is important to find foods that are alkaline FORMING not ACID FORMING inside the body.
Fruit acids absolutely do not alkalinize the body. Its impossible to add an acid to a system and make it more alkaline.
What happens in the body is that, in some cases, like in the much confused lemon juice (citric acid) example, the body's homeostatic systems buffer the citric acid to make a citrate salt of a base, such as potassium citrate. This product is "alkaline" but it does not alkalinize the body (i.e. reduce the net H+ concentration) since all that happened was you consumed acid and then the body had to buffer that acid you consumed. ie the body did what it evolved to do - buffer any pH changes (acid or alkaline). It didn't make your body more alkaline - it just stopped your body becoming more acidic.
This confusion has been going on for years now - but its simple acid-base biochemistry. No, you don't get alkaline by eating an acid. Even if you don't understand acid-base chemistry then common sense might hint at that.
As for the idea that the body is somehow "stressed" by having a high acid diet in that it has to buffer it - your body will have to do the same in response to a highly alkaline diet. The body has set pH values for different compartments - if you eat acids - it has to buffer that. If you eat excess alkali - it has to buffer that.
So what's the take away? If you think your diet is excessively acid (it could be) then you can balance your dietary intake with alkaline foods if you so desire. However, it would be a mistake to make you diet excessively alkaline as some sort of fix - that brings its own problems. (Look up alkalosis to see the pathological effects of too much alkalinity).
There are lists of actual acid and alkaline foods - but they are not the confused lists most in circulation.
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