Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
It does. I started the topic, so I know what it's about.
You are clearly not familiar with what a straw man argument is.
I was pointing out the hypocrisy of Dominicans in the United States, of questionable legal status, who protest for "immigrant rights" here in the states, but support the recent decision made in their home country.
What hypocrasy? Do you hear any Dominican complaining about the thousands of Dominicans that get deported every year from the USA? Are you going to denounce that too?
The hypocrite here is you.
It is a strawman argument because you are changing the topic from the DR and illegal Haitians to the USA deporting Dominicans. The USA has and will continue to deport Dominicans, defending their borders, which is their right, and the DR will continue to defend their borders and deport illegals, which is their right.
Also, do you know that in your precious Haiti, if you are born in the country to non-Haitian parents, you are illegal and risk deportation. Where is the outrage? Also, Australia and numerous other countries follow the same law.
The only people that we currently deport, are ex-convicts after they serve their sentences (read the article). Deporting 5000 criminals is nothing, considering the total amount of illegals there are, who we tolerate.
We are very kind to illegal immigrants. You only get deported if you commit some other crime.
Quote:
Do you hear any Dominican complaining about the thousands of Dominicans that get deported every year from the USA?
Yes, all the time. Dominicans have always been part of the "immigration reform" crowd here in the U.S.
Quote:
It is a strawman argument because you are changing the topic from the DR and illegal Haitians to the USA deporting Dominicans.
Read the first post of this thread. The topic has not changed.
Also, do you know that in your precious Haiti, if you are born in the country to non-Haitian parents, you are illegal and risk deportation. Where is the outrage? Also, Australia and numerous other countries follow the same law.
Haiti has VERY right to enforce that kind of law. Besides; that country has lots of its own problems, def doesn't "need" more "imports".
I don't think you can always tell Dominicans from Haitians based on appearance. I know several lighter skinned Haitians and many darker skinned Dominicans with more African features. But generally, they are different in appearance.
I think the other points you make are important.
1. Haiti is the poorest country in the Western Hemisphere so it only makes senses that many Haitians will cross into the Dominican Republic. However, the DR isn't that well off either and can't support the massive migration, especially after the devastating Haitian earthquake. The U.S. and Europe (i.e. France) should make it easier for Haitians to seek refugee status and ease the burden on the DR. The economic statutes and subsequent tense race relations, in my opinion, are the fault of European colonizers anyway...but I won't get into all of that.
2. There have been a lot of calls to boycott the Dominican Republic, which really annoys me because the DR is a place where people go vacation...drink cheap beer/alcohol, party, take advantage of favorable exchange rates, and for many even find cheap thrills. But now people want to have a social conscious.
The Dominican Republic has every right to uphold fair immigration policies just like any other sovereign nation. And let's not pretend they're the only country with race issues. I don't agree with all aspects of the law, but the issue is much more complicated and people aren't fairly looking at both sides.
Just wanted to say that I agree with the above in that you cannot tell a Dominican from a Hatian in all cases IMO.
SuperMario, the pictures you showed of people that you state are Dominican don't look like Dominicans to me. They look Puerto Rican. To me this is what a Dominican looks like:
[MOD CUT/copyright violation]
They look like brown skinned black people IMO. And some Hatians are also dark skinned but many are brownskinned as well and one cannot tell for certainty just by looking at people.
On the bold above, I will state that I am boycotting the DR over this issue and I am encouraging others to do just that. It is a vile thing they are doing and it makes no sense for them to go back and kick out people who were born in the DR in the 1950s, 1960s, or 1970s. They have lived in DR their whole lives.
FWIW, I would have no problem with them instituting a similar policy for people who were not born in the DR and then going forward from 2013-2015 not allowing citizenship based solely on being born in the DR. Ireland has a similar immigration policy that doesn't allow children born in the country to be automatic citizens. And FWIW, I feel the USA should institute the same sort of policy but it is silly to say someone born in 1960 in the DR or the US now has to leave the country all because we don't like Latinos or black people who look "too black" to be considered a "real citizen."
I also don't think that it is not a good idea to boycott the DR's tourism industry which is a major economic employer in the country. It sends a message to the country that people don't want to go on vacation to places that literally make hundreds of thousands of people stateless. As those booted out will not be able to "go back" to Haiti, they won't have passports, they don't speak the language anymore in many cases and they have nothing to go back to.
I was planning on having a dedication of vows ceremony in the DR in 2017 as I went to a relatives' wedding there and we had a great time (we did drink and party and hang out on the beach but the only "cheap thrills" I got was me laughing at drunk Germans who were fun people and who cracked me up). I am now changing my plans and will look at going to Jamaica or even Mexico instead of DR due to this law they are passing. I am encouraging everyone I know to not go there anymore over this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperMario
That's the basic gist of it. They are enforcing their immigration laws, just like every other country does. They are not picking Haitian's up and throwing them in concentration camps. They are not picking Haitian's up and putting them in cages, like the Bahamas (yet no body says anything about them). Nobody has helped Haitians more than Dominicans. Everyone feels sorry for them, yet nobody want's to help. They leave the DR to carry that burden, a poor country that can't sustain thousands of poorer people.
As stated above, people like me would have no issues with them enforcing their laws if they weren't back dating those laws back to the 20th century. If they start from 2013, then I have no issue with this but going back that far and affecting so many people is not "helping" and it is cruel to make hundreds of thousands of people stranded without a country.
It's too bad I didn't know about this issue and what the DR government is doing. I would have suggested my niece have her destination wedding elsewhere.
DR constitution states that you have to be born in DR to at least one Dominican parent to be a Dominican citizen. Why is it anyone's business? That law was a great idea because then Haitians would just cross the border and reproduce like rabbits. Do you think that the DR has no right to defend their border? The US sure as hell deports thousands upon thousand of Mexicans and Dominicans every year. The difference with anchor babies in the US is that the US is a huge country with a lot of open land that can afford to provide citizenship to anchor babies. The DR? 2/3rd's of a small island would cease to exist. I mean, 20% of the DR population is composed of illegal Haitians. Let that sink in.
By the way, many of those Haitians born in DR have no papers. The DR requires paperwork to legalize many of these Haitians, whether it's from the parents or whomever. Guess who is taking advantage of that situation and OVERCHARGING Haitians for documents? The Haitian government. They make it so that the average Haitian can't afford their documents to prove their identity. Yet, again, nobody says anything to the Haitian government.
To add, someone mentioned that it's not like the DR is putting Haitians out, but trying to give them the opportunity to become legal Dominicans. The government wants these people to become citizens. Pay taxes and receive benefits just like everyone else.
The only people that we currently deport, are ex-convicts after they serve their sentences (read the article). Deporting 5000 criminals is nothing, considering the total amount of illegals there are, who we tolerate.
Tolerate? You don't think non-criminal illegals get deported? Many of those 5,000 are sent back to DR and ripped away from their families. That sure doesn't sound like tolerant to me. Tolerant would be not returning illegal Mexicans back to Mexico once they cross the border. Tolerant would be not returning Dominicans who illegal try to get into Puerto Rico back to DR. Dominicans tolerated illegal Haitians due to the unfortunate circumstance (earthquake) that befell them. Enough time has passed since that and it's time to enforce the law.
Quote:
We are very kind to illegal immigrants. You only get deported if you commit some other crime.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
