Arizona again among Most Dependent States on Federal Government Subsidies (farm, Japanese)

[LS Jaun]

Like said above: Reservations and Illegal Alien enclaves are the biggest user of tax payer money. The most drop outs, the most teen pregnancies, the biggest users ie. Democrats and their supporters.

[payutenyodagimas]

they should only compute what the state govt received from the federal govt. the federal govt have its own mandate/powers likewise the states.


it should be how much the people pays in taxes minus what the federal govt gives to the state

[Potential_Landlord]

Part of this effect come from our electoral system which prefers rural areas. AZ is very rural overall and not populous. Our senators and reps have an outsized influence in the federal legislature. This brings money home regardless of political preference.

[Dangerous Dave]

Originally Posted by stinkingliberal

This is such a myth. They don't hold wages down because they do jobs that Americans won't do at ANY wage. They definitely DO pay income tax--it's withheld from their paychecks, and due to their illegal status, they can't file for any refunds. They also can't "collect welfare" because in doing so, they'd have to register with the government and risk being deported. Also, social security tax is withheld from their wages, but they'll never collect any SSI benefits.

All of this fretting and sweating about illegal aliens is just thinly disguised racism. I really wonder what it is about these folks' mere existence that cheeses off so many conservatives. In Arizona, any politician promising to drive all them Mekskins out of the country is sure to get elected. It's a cruel, stupid, and counterproductive position.

Actually, there was a Harvard (not exactly your bastion of conservatism) study that proved that illegal labor does indeed drive down wages. And as far as doing jobs that Americans won't do, that is true in some jobs but we also have guest worker visas for those jobs. Our current immigration laws were written by democrats... and you think adhering to them is racist. Actually, I doubt you believe that but you have no other rebuttal.

[cactusland]

Originally Posted by stinkingliberal

This is such a myth. They don't hold wages down because they do jobs that Americans won't do at ANY wage. They definitely DO pay income tax--it's withheld from their paychecks, and due to their illegal status, they can't file for any refunds. They also can't "collect welfare" because in doing so, they'd have to register with the government and risk being deported. Also, social security tax is withheld from their wages, but they'll never collect any SSI benefits.

All of this fretting and sweating about illegal aliens is just thinly disguised racism. I really wonder what it is about these folks' mere existence that cheeses off so many conservatives. In Arizona, any politician promising to drive all them Mekskins out of the country is sure to get elected. It's a cruel, stupid, and counterproductive position.

The myth that americans would never do these jobs keeps getting perpetuated. This is frankly not true. They saturate the low-skill market so that people who have less skills overall have less chance of getting jobs. They get paid under the table and no income tax is withheld, and the employer can pay them less because they pay less overall, and the employer doesn't have to declare them as workers either. They can absolutely collect welfare in many states as you do not have to prove citizenship to collect in states such as CA.

[GeneR]

Originally Posted by phetaroi

You think Indian reservations began in the 1920s and 1930s?

No. But I do know the difference between a reservation and a social welfare system. As a careful re-reading of my post would indicate there was no reference to 'reservations' being the brainchild but rather the system used to support the impoverished residents.

[Danno3314]

Only something like 17% of the state is privately owned. The rest is federal land and Indian Reservation which are both funded by the federal government.... so the federal government is responsible for 83% of the land.

[Woody01]

Originally Posted by Potential_Landlord

Fresh in from Phoenix Business Journal: So the next time you see a panhandler at a traffic light just think of him following Arizona's great tradition of mooching of other people's money
From the article:
"This means that taxpayers in other states are subsidizing Arizona social services and education."
"The study also found that “red” states have twice the federal dependency as “blue” states, a trend WalletHub’s experts believe belies the stereotypical red state call for small government and less federal involvement in state affairs."


http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/b...ess+Journal%29

And what's your point? Conservatives bad? Trump bad? What?

PS - Studies are only as valid as the money paid to fund them.....

[Woody01]

Originally Posted by oldtrader

You really do not understand how those people have been taught and oriented to live there. Most do not have the education for decent jobs, and do not have the money or way of getting it to leave the reservations.

Remember it happened all over the country. The Trail Of Tears, is an example of how the Indians were forced onto these reservations. And then they were kept there by the Army.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trail_of_Tears

Native American Reservations | PWNA Resources - Partnership With Native Americans

Impact on Indians

PBS - THE WEST - Philip Henry Sheridan

And these are just a few examples.

The white man wanted the best land for farming, etc., and they sent U.S. Army in to kill and plunder and round up the Indians and move them to the worst land. Many died along the long trails they had to walk over to get to a reservation, and then forced to live there.

The army used tactics such as killing off the Buffalo and other sources of food, so the Indians were easier to drive out.

The Indians have been kept ignorant and needy to be able to control them right till today.

Anyone that thinks that all the Indians need to do to get out of poverty is to move away and they will be able to support themselves has no idea of what goes on, and how those people were treated.

Imagine a group of big tall, green haired people with advanced weapons and people control decided they wanted to move to San Francisco today, and just showed up one day, and rounded up all the people in the city, and drove them out of San Francisco, and moved them to Death Valley and gave them minimal means to have shelter and survive. They were given food, if they did as they were told. Kind of a concentration camp. With their superior weapons, the U.S. Military did not dare to try to take San Francisco back, is it would cause untold death of other American citizens if they tried it.

And after San Francisco they just kept moving on, taking over more land.

Think that is preposterous, think of the American Indians. That is exactly how they were treated, and land made available for White Europeans.

Think America would never do something like taking over a group of people.

Think Again. I was at my best friends house for a sleep over the day of the Attack on Pearl Harbor. When it came over the radio what happened, they had a big family dinner as they did every week. The family owned a big green house food growing business, and they all worked there. There were about 50 people there, all good American Citizens. I have never seen such anger over what was happening. The young single men all vowed to joint the army and fight those Damn Japs. They went in on Monday to sign up, and were immediately rejected. Shortly after that I was in my front yard, watching as they rounded up all of that extended family and moved them to a concentration camp, confiscating their business and holdings.

Those families had been in the U.S. for generations and were as good Americans as anyone. But because they had Japanese Ancestry, they were treated like the Indians were. Lost everything, and put into concentration camps. Men that tried to be good Americans and offered to go fight the enemy, were locked up. I have known several people that were locked up for the war, and know how they were treated.

My question is, if they rounded up the Japanese we were at war with, why did they also not round up all Germans and Italians in the country and put them into concentration camps as we were at war with them?

If you think that all the Indians have to do is walk away from those reservations, and they can get good jobs, etc., and live like everyone else. They have been educated to stay on the reservations, and survive, with no way out. They do not have the money or means to leave. And no one to help them.

What a bunch of BS.....All humans have freedom of choice. They are still there because either:

a) they are stupid, or
b) they made that choice...

Which is it?

[DetroitN8V]

Originally Posted by Woody01

And what's your point? Conservatives bad? Trump bad? What?

PS - Studies are only as valid as the money paid to fund them.....

The point is, hypocrites bad.