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more autonomy? comparing to what state? let's use Catalonia of spain for example? you think they have more autonomy than hong kong?
for one thing the hong kongers don't pay a single dime of tax to the chinese government. Please name one city/state that has more autonomy than hong kong
Actually, yes. Catalonia can elect their own representatives without Madrid interfering in disqualfying their candidates based on a contrived litmus test.
Actually, yes. Catalonia can elect their own representatives without Madrid interfering in disqualfying their candidates based on a contrived litmus test.
Madrid did disqualify and jail severall politicans because they voted for independence. They can also overrule decisions made by the catalan government, which is something Beijing never did before the protest.
Hong Kong was not very democratic, but it was quite autonomous from China untill 2019. The few things that China did try to pass went through the local government and eventually got rejected. The main change from 97 to 19 was that business got more connected to the mainland, and more and more mainlanders went to Hong Kong. Many native Hong Kong people hated that.
That combined with massive inequlity, low wages for young people, unaffordable housing and increasing anti-China media led to an explosive mix that lead to the protest in 2019.
Madrid did disqualify and jail severall politicans because they voted for independence. They can also overrule decisions made by the catalan government, which is something Beijing never did before the protest.
Hong Kong was not very democratic, but it was quite autonomous from China untill 2019. The few things that China did try to pass went through the local government and eventually got rejected. The main change from 97 to 19 was that business got more connected to the mainland, and more and more mainlanders went to Hong Kong. Many native Hong Kong people hated that.
That combined with massive inequlity, low wages for young people, unaffordable housing and increasing anti-China media led to an explosive mix that lead to the protest in 2019.
And that therein was a major reason for Mainland China to further integrate Hong Kong into its economy and to further restrict freedom of speech. There are a lot more people with close ties to the Mainland and a lot more going back and forth between Hong Kong and Shenzhen than there was back in 1970. Times have clearly changed. Of course, Xi could have expanded Hong Kong's political system to include all of the Pearl River Delta, and then all of Guangdong, and ultimately all of China but there are major powers (i.e. other Communist party chiefs) at all levels opposed to that so that would have put his position and possibly even his own life at peril. Such a course would have amounted to a Chinese glassnost I bet and it could either have resulted in a successful transition to a more open political system or outright revolution and breakup of China as we know it.
Madrid did disqualify and jail severall politicans because they voted for independence. They can also overrule decisions made by the catalan government, which is something Beijing never did before the protest.
The difference was that these Catalonian politicians were allowed to stand for election. HK simply disqualified would be candidates before they were even allowed to contest an election. That's my point.
Point is, a central government can do what they want from an actional point of view but if they don't resolve the popular sentiment over the long term, it's not going away. You can see the Unionist vs Republican sentiment going on in Ulster/Northern Ireland for decades. Or even the Palestinians/Israeli dynamic.
Madrid did disqualify and jail severall politicans because they voted for independence. They can also overrule decisions made by the catalan government, which is something Beijing never did before the protest.
Hong Kong was not very democratic, but it was quite autonomous from China untill 2019. The few things that China did try to pass went through the local government and eventually got rejected. The main change from 97 to 19 was that business got more connected to the mainland, and more and more mainlanders went to Hong Kong. Many native Hong Kong people hated that.
That combined with massive inequlity, low wages for young people, unaffordable housing and increasing anti-China media led to an explosive mix that lead to the protest in 2019.
no, that is not correct, those are typical anti chinese propaganda.
there had been a some what constant influx of chinese people into hong kong through out history due to war, natural disasters, political unrests etc.
let's break them into two groups because most people are confused by what those anti chinese people are complaining about.
1. single permit entry (these are immigrants that will become hong kong citizens), these have a long history even before 1997, for a long period of time the British have a rule as long as you reach hong kong you are a legit citizen. There are countless amount of chinese enter into hong kong before 1997 and these are the true hong kong people. Shocking I know, but 99.9% of the so call "native" hong kongers came from china.
now a days you have to be direct family to a hong kong citizen in order to be considered eligible for immigration from china to hong kong, and there are daily quotas that controls this so everyone must wait even if their immediate family is in hong kong.
The goal of this is to reunite families. These influx are not the issue as those so call "natives" or their parents belongs to this group years ago. In fact the pan dem helped to fight for the rights of these group to decide whether chinese born hong kongers children are citizens.
2. double permit entry (these are chinese tourists that has a limited time stay)
again, these have a long history because chinese tourists cannot freely to enter hong kong before and even after 1997.
In the early 2000s after sars, hong kong's tourism economy was crashed and on life support. So the chinese government tries to help hong kong by giving a huge amount of "free travel to hong kong" passes and that created a huge amount of chinese tourists (and smugglers of goods) that has caused social issues in hong kong.
That's when the so call "native" anti chinese groups were born. They view the tourists acting as locusts to take hong kong resources.
The so call "more and more mainlander went to hong kong" is purely propaganda. There are always mainlanders going to hong kong because all of the hong kong chinese came from mainland during one time or another.
The difference was that these Catalonian politicians were allowed to stand for election. HK simply disqualified would be candidates before they were even allowed to contest an election. That's my point.
Point is, a central government can do what they want from an actional point of view but if they don't resolve the popular sentiment over the long term, it's not going away. You can see the Unionist vs Republican sentiment going on in Ulster/Northern Ireland for decades. Or even the Palestinians/Israeli dynamic.
no, the so call separatists was actually elected into serving in legco. Had they not played around when giving their oath, they would not have been kicked out of office by the court and disqualified from future elections.
the chinese central government would not have done anything had the separatists not gone too far, also the US sponsoring the separatists doesn't help either and made it much worse.
Madrid did disqualify and jail severall politicans because they voted for independence. They can also overrule decisions made by the catalan government, which is something Beijing never did before the protest.
Hong Kong was not very democratic, but it was quite autonomous from China untill 2019. The few things that China did try to pass went through the local government and eventually got rejected. The main change from 97 to 19 was that business got more connected to the mainland, and more and more mainlanders went to Hong Kong. Many native Hong Kong people hated that.
That combined with massive inequlity, low wages for young people, unaffordable housing and increasing anti-China media led to an explosive mix that lead to the protest in 2019.
Isn’t it funny how you are called anti-China by the wumaos too? Apparently your brown-nosing is still not enough for China lol. It’s so sad and pathetic.
Isn’t it funny how you are called anti-China by the wumaos too? Apparently your brown-nosing is still not enough for China lol. It’s so sad and pathetic.
And here comes the Taiwanese bigot who thinks its okay to say that millions of Chinese could get killed and he would not care and despite thinking that the government it horrible and cruel, he also think Chinese deserve their own government.
The fact that some Chinese call me anti-China and anti-Chinese westerners like you call me wumao, just shows that I am more in the middle of the road. Which makes sense considering that I am a Norwegian living in China. For instance, my opinion about the Hong Kong protest was never "Hong Kong protests is just anti-China protest" or "Support all actions done by protestors", it was "I support the goals of the protests, but it needs to be done peacefully or else it will be counterproductive".
That infuriated you, and you started calling me lots of names and you began cursing in every post. Take a look at the posts you made in 2014 in this thread and compare them to the rage posts you make today. That is what is truly sad and pathetic.
And here comes the Taiwanese bigot who thinks its okay to say that millions of Chinese could get killed and he would not care and despite thinking that the government it horrible and cruel, he also think Chinese deserve their own government.
The fact that some Chinese call me anti-China and anti-Chinese westerners like you call me wumao, just shows that I am more in the middle of the road. Which makes sense considering that I am a Norwegian living in China. For instance, my opinion about the Hong Kong protest was never "Hong Kong protests is just anti-China protest" or "Support all actions done by protestors", it was "I support the goals of the protests, but it needs to be done peacefully or else it will be counterproductive".
That infuriated you, and you started calling me lots of names and you began cursing in every post. Take a look at the posts you made in 2014 in this thread and compare them to the rage posts you make today. That is what is truly sad and pathetic.
hey I only respond to posts and ideas and would not be attacking any posters or calling names. I simply ignore the ones that starts to call names
I'm curious to what you think are the "goals of the protests", can you expand on that?
I think it may be a bit complicated as there are multiple goals and different people protest for different reason.
In hong kong, even the pro-establishment parties organize protests/"show power"/plead/lobby all the time against government offices, capital tycoons, foreign government or any party they so choose.
approved and peaceful protests are protected no matter what the cause is.
illegal and violent protests are obviously cracked down no matter what the cause is.
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